Hey guys a friend of mine is having some problems with his F54 L28......

"I was removing my welsh plugs (maybe they are called freeze plugs in the US?) and I think I hit one a bit too hard when I was taking it out. There is a little pipe that comes out from where the cylinder walls meet, it comes out and then goes up to the top of the block....anyway, I actually think I broke it at the top. Is my block screwed? What was that pipe for ? I dont think all of the cylinder walls had the pipe coming out from between them, just a couple. "

Anyone have any ideas?

Thanks guys

I must agree with you as I didn't think there was an internal pipe either?

Are you sure that this is what he did? I'm guessing no-one else has responded to this is that no one has the slightest idea about the internals of the block.

Yep I'm yet to pull one completely apart so I have no idea.

I have never read about these though if that helps i think a photo would be the best in this kind of situation?

Yes. I don't recall any pipes being located within the cylinder block. I could be wrong. You sure your not talking about the crankcase breather located at the rear end of the block?

These ones?

Another ( N42 block ):

Interesting. Guess I never looked that hard at my block when I got my motor rebuilt. . What are they? oil galleries?

Guys,

I spent most of my better years (younger) as a patternmaker. I was the guy that made cylinder heads/ blocks/wheels/ every kind of metal cast part----all out of wood (master patterns).

I can't get to much information from the pictures, but I'm guessing that we are looking at chaplets, or nails. NAILS IN MY ENGINE!!??!! Yes.

The engine block was formed by a cope and a drag pattern which formed the two main halves of the sand mold. Into the main mold halves went various other pieces of sand produced by coreboxes. These cores formed the cylinders, water jackets, some oil passages, and any areas that needed to be reorrientated in order to mold (patterns must always be larger at the BOTTOM than the top. "draft". Coreboxes must always be larger at the TOP than the bottom).

Anyway, in the foundry some of the cores can be glued together and some must be "hung" from the top (cope) half of the mold. Those cores would be drilled with a wire and than a nail would be inserted (usually at an angle) to hold core in place.

Though you can see parts of the nails (that area that was core sand) the ends are now part of the iron engine block.

If you broke one of these don't worry. If you can get loose pieces out than go ahead.

Yes, excellent description / explanation from Panchovisa.

That's exactly what I was told about them; they are leftovers from the block casting process and breaking / damaging one of them is not a major problem. They certainly are not oil-carrying pipes or extra coolant passages, or anything like that.

However, just as Panchovisa said, you don't want any broken pieces left in the block as they might find their way back to the water pump and damage the impeller.

Great post, Panchovisa!

Cheers,

Alan T.

Thank you Alan. Why have I noticed that you know things (like about my R-190, foundry nails) but DON'T tell right away? Huh? Why?

My guess is your testing others first before parting with your (hard earned) knowledge first. Making people think? Thats un-American! Wait, your in the U.K., then it's O.K.

How's your baby coming along? I've seen the body is going well. Got an engine going togrther yet?

Later,

Pancho

Thanks guys, and thanks Deaus !!

I was the one having the issue, and yep, that is the "pipe" which I broke. I was really starting to worry, as although I couldnt see any obvious purpose for em, I had just cleaned and painted and replaced the welsh plugs on the block and didnt want to have to start again.

Thanks guys!!

Ray

Got me thinking about the old days now.

At one time patternmakers were probably the most respected of tradesmen. To create the tools of the industrial revolution using knifes, abrasives, glue, wax, putty, wood, plastic leather, etc was realy a mind blower!

Then came computers and numericaly controlled milling machines. At first it was wonderful, slap a piece of metal on the machine and make something more precise in less time!

But I left the trade when patternmakers became just programmers, and now they aren't even programmers because the CAD-CAM software does it for you. It's a trade that lost it's soul, it's no longer an art, only a video game.