What came first , Fairlady or 240 ?

[NovaSS]

Im sorry. Im new and posted this in another section but maybe you guys can help. I picked up a Fairlady , serial number 000144. Its titled as a 1969. I understand about the 500 240s that were US bound after a short production run but were did the Fairlady fit in? Since the 240 were run at the end of 1969 did they run the Fairladys first??

Are their any 240s titled as 1969 cars?

[v12horse]

The 240z and Fairlady Z cars started production in 1969, but are 1970 model year cars. Whether the Fairlady Z or the 240z came off the production line first is a topic that has been very talked about on this forum.

You will probably find your info here. http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=7801&highlight=production

I know there are other places on the forum where this has been talked about or where Kats has posted the production dates of the two. Just look up production dates and you will find what you are looking for. The link that I gave you is quite lengthy, but a great read. I am sure someone will bring this to light.

Ben

[NovaSS]

I was wondering about 1969 . I know the original owner and he purchaed it in japan and sold it to my dad years later. It has always been titled as a 1969.

Ill try a link tomorrow , I was trying to post the title with the vin and date.

[v12horse]

Awe, the link does not work. I am very excited to see a picture of your car.

Ben

[Bambikiller240]

Ther are a few US model 240Z's titled as 1969, but the factory intended them to be 1970 model cars. how they were titiled (in the US, at least) is a function of the DMV in the state it was titled in. Could not be "controlled" by the factory.

[NovaSS]

Originally posted by Bambikiller240

Ther are a few US model 240Z's titled as 1969, but the factory intended them to be 1970 model cars. how they were titiled (in the US, at least) is a function of the DMV in the state it was titled in. Could not be "controlled" by the factory.

That make some sence. I have a 65 Nova that was first title in 1964 but it still states it as a 1965 model. I guess it depends on the state.

The first owner of the car ( he passed away.) He purchaed it in Japan and sold it to my father, it been in my family ever since.

[Bambikiller240]

Originally posted by NovaSS

That make some sence. I have a 65 Nova that was first title in 1964 but it still states it as a 1965 model. I guess it depends on the state.

Back in the 50's, 60's and 70's; the US domestic manufacturers released all of their "new model year cars" in October of the year before the named model year. So it is somewhat common to have a 1965 model Chebby, Ford, Chrysler titled in 1964.

You are correct in that the state DMV procedures wer not totally consistant state to state, or even office to office within a state in some cases.

Post some pic of your car when you get a chance!

[26th-Z]

Hello NovaSS and welcome to the club. Congrats on owning a '69 - my favorite year as well. That car of yours could be pretty valuable and I would recommend you consider it that way. It is truly rare in America. Who cares what year it was registered.

The question of which came first, the Fairlady Z or the 240 Z, has been thoroughly thrashed in the bowels of the archives and I'm sure you will find some great reading. Bluntly answered - both.

Fairlady was a name given to the Nissan SPL212 in 1960 by Katsuji Kawamata with the intention of using the name to market the car in America. It comes from the Broadway musical "My Fair Lady". Fairlady was associated with the sport roadster series all through the '60s.

When Nissan introduced the S30 series in 1969, it used several names to represent the various models it intended to market. Datsun was used to market cars in America and comes from the DAT car lineage - part of the Nissan corporation. The S30s bound for America were marketed as Datsun 240 Zs and the S30s that were built for the home market were labeled Fairlady Zs. It is quite clear that both were produced at the same time from the very begining. Variations in the specific chassis designation include S30S, PS30, PS30SB, HS30, and HLS30 depending on the market and the engine installed. Serial number 144 would put your car in the November / December 1969 production range. You should also find quite a few peculiar parts and production techniques unique to the early production of the series.

I want to emphasize how valuable your car could be to the collector world. I see prices for the Nissan Restoration Program cars hovering in the $20,000 range. Certain clean, low milage examples have been trading a little higher and my guess would be that your example in excellent condition could command well over $30,000. To address your frame rail question in the other thread, yes, a donor frame rail from any early chassis would be appropriate. Do the work carefully to retain the value of your car.

Please join our group and post pictures. We love pictures. We have lots of conversations going on about the early days and there are plenty of people willing to help with repair advice and parts.

[Alfadog]

Originally posted by 26th-Z

We love pictures.

I second that!

Welcome to the club, I'm sure you'll love it here. If the guys here don't know something about S30's, NO ONE DOES!

(pictures please)

[HS30-H]

Welcome NovaSS,

Congratulations on owning a very early production Fairlady Z. That's one of the lowest body numbers I have heard of recently.

Can we check your body number? Is it "S30-00144" ( five digits after the "S30" prefix, and not six )? What was the original Factory colour? As has been said above - we LOVE pictures here!

This would DEFINITELY place it within 1969 production at the Factory, with a very high likelihood of a November build date rather than December. Please don't let anybody tell you that RHD cars were not made until 1970, which you will sometimes hear.

The issue of "Model Year" seems to cause lots of confusion. In most cases ( at least for my part anyway ) when we discuss the age of a car we mean the actual BUILD DATE rather than the "Model Year" it was intended to be sold as. Some threads and conversations confuse the two.

I'm wondering if you know whether your car is a "Fairlady Z" ( model S30S, the 'base' no-frills model, sometimes known as the 'ZS' or 'Z Standard' in Japan ) or a Fairlady Z-L ( model S30, sometimes known as a 'Deluxe', 'Lux' or 'ZDX' in Japan ). They both have the same "S30" VIN prefix stamp, and the same emblems / badging. You will only be able to tell the difference by looking at the paperwork that came with the car when it was new, or the details of the car. The S30S originally came with rubber mats instead of carpet, no rubber trim on the bumpers, no clock and no hubcaps. They usually had the 4-speed transmission as standard. There were lots of other little differences too. I'm willing to be that your car will be the Z-L, which would be a more natural choice for somebody to have personally imported to the USA. The Z-L had carpet, rubber bumper trims, a clock, hubcaps and usually came with the 5-speed transmission. In many cases these cars were brought home as personal transport by US servicemen and women who were stationed in Japan.

I own a 1970-build Fairlady Z-L here in the UK, and it would have been very similar to your car when new. I have a fair amount of spare parts and RHD / Japanese market model-specific information, so if you need anything please let me know. I'd be very pleased to help if I can.

Cheers!

Alan T.

[NovaSS]

Thanks guys , I have worked on other cars for years, have a pro street car, a vette and a few others but I plan on keeping the z stock .

I has the 5 speed and fully carpeted. It still has the original drivtrain but the engine was rebuilt in the late 70s, I have all the paper work on the rebuild. Its original color is plum. As for the miles Im not sure. The first owner pulled the speedo to put a MPH unit in its place but I still have the KPH unit. I guess I could sit down and do some converting. The vin is S30- 00144 ( sorry I added to many 0s)

[HS30-H]

Hi NovaSS,

Thanks for confirming the full VIN number.

It sounds as though your car is indeed a Z-L, with the FS5C71-A transmission and 3.9 diff ratio as standard equipment.

One thing that puzzles me is your description of the original Factory colour as being "Plum". I can't think of a standard 1969 or 1970 Japanese market colour that could be described as Plum. Can you find any cars on the Gallery of this site that are painted in a similar colour? I'm wondering if it might have been 920 'Gold'?

I would echo 26th-Z's thoughts above, and say that it would be very nice if you could bring the car back - as close as possible - to Factory stock condition, or if you modify it then do it with an eye on a 'period correct' look. However you look at it, the car deserves to be treated with respect to its original specification. That L20 / close ratio FS5C71-A / 3.9 diff ratio combination is well balanced and great fun to drive.

Its a rare survivor from 1969 Factory production, and its great to hear that it is still 'alive'.

Cheers,

Alan T.