240Z for USD$18,000 ?????

[AxtellZ]

Just bustin' em. Hope you're not offended. Zya;)

[2ManyZs]

Nah, I'm not offended, besides, I know where you live.:eek:

[Alfadog]

HS30-H (dont know your real name hehe), yes, it's an EXCEPTIONAL car, the detailing is superb.

There is no harm trying I have no problem with it. And yes, it would be fantastic if some rich guy who likes the "look" of this strange datsun car that he has never heard of before bought it. If the market value of our cars goes up, thats good, right? Well 2manyZ's had a different perspective to the issue... would they eventually get too expensive to really enjoy with a clear concious? Will we have to go and start collecting TR7s?

I certainly took advantage of the low price of the Z, as it was my first car and I really didn't have all that much money to spend. I look at my car not only as a beautiful and fast coupe, but also a piece of history, and an investment. I believe the market value of these cars will only increase... so yeah in all honesty the guy who sells his datto for $18,000 is doing us a favour - and I think thats your point.

But I certainly was not poking fun at the car at any time.

"Read, gawk, then look at the price and laugh"

I hardly said anything so I dont know where you picked up the tone from... I'll explain what I meant as it may be a bit ambiguous.

"Read": Read the description

"Gawk": Gawk at teh pictures, as the car is brilliant

"then look at the price and laugh": The car, although unfaultable, is set at a price way above market value.

Sorry if this caused any confusion.

In England I would imagine the price is about right for a perfect Z?

[HS30-H]

Hi ALFADOG,

Thanks for your reply. I think this has turned into a really interesting and worthwhile discussion, hasn't it?

Sorry if I misread your sentiments about that particular car. It seemed to me when I read it that you were putting down that car and the S30-series in general, so I am glad to hear that I am mistaken ( tail between legs ).

I really hope that somebody who loves it to death will buy that car ( and take the mirrors and that awful downturned rear pipe off! ) and then drive it and enjoy it. Maybe they will even put in a five-speed and an LSD with a nice ratio. Maybe they will not even mind that the handbrake is on the "wrong" side of the tunnel ( tee hee ).

I really think that even in the USA and ( even in California ) such an early and straight car has to be worth more than $12,000 - and maybe this car will eventually change hands for something like $14k to $15k (?). I can't believe that a professionally restored example with many now unobtainable parts can really be worth less than that, can it? COMMENTS PLEASE! Not counting the costs of self-restoration ( I do a lot of work on my cars myself, and I know how much it saves me ) then it would have to be worth at least half the sum of its parts..........

Is anyone taking into account the problems that are looming regarding the non-availability of many body panels for the early S30-series? In the UK, we are scared of any crash damage ( and particularly from the rear ) as we know that these panels are all but unobtainable now. What panels there ARE in circulation over here are changing hands for a LOT of money. I just sourced a RH rear quarter for an early car that was crashed badly, and it cost a fortune. Fitting it professionally and then painting it will take a REAL lot of man-hours. Any insurance company would write the thing off as uneconomical to repair over here. Surely there is a similar lack of original spare body panels to repair crash-damaged cars in the USA and Australia?

Some Z specialists in the UK have been importing cars from "dry states" in the USA recently, and although they are generally good bases to start restorations from, I have to say that they are usually REALLy bad in all other areas. These cars are changing hands in the USA for thousands of dollars ( not hundreds any more ) and they are buying them from original owners, not dealers or brokers. Restoring them properly certainly takes the cost way over the equivalent of $20,000 USD unless corners are cut. It would be easy to do this, but even then restoring the parts that need to be restored and replacing the parts that need to be replaced is costing thousands. Putting non-factory parts on the car will surely keep costs down, but in my opinion the quality is often just not there.

I know Z specialists and enthusiasts in Japan who are laying down parts like fine wines recently. They know what is being made and what is not, and what they tell me makes me really nervous. If you think of any other "collector" or "enthusiast" car, then I would say that in almost all cases they have a better spares supply ( at least for any model or make that has the equivalent amount of surviving cars out there ). Nissan have been closing down body-pressing plants and throwing away the original tooling over the last few years. Any specialist or after-market supplier who decided to take the risk and start pressing up the unobtainable panels would have to spend a HUGE amount of money to make the tools, and even then they would never be "right"............. I just do not think it will happen.

What does everybody think of the situation regarding lack of parts being made in Japan lately? Has anyone else noticed that things that were still available until just a few years / months ago are just not coming through any more? I am thinking particularly of body panels and trim / lighting ( mech. parts seem to be mostly still OK ). Anybody got any views?

Great debate - we should do more of this!

Alan Thomas ( "HS30-H" ) London, UK.

[Alfadog]

Alan,

It is a good discussion and certainly an important one for all of us ...

For that much money I'd want badges on my car too

In all honesty I wouldn't know how much it'd be *worth*. I think it depends on the buyer... (rich senseless men are the best)

Also, as I only bought my car a few months ago, I wouldn't really know about the whole unobtainable part issue... although I did get a quote for a synchro for 2nd gear - $120 USD is a lot IMO!

(I'm now trying to find a whole gearbox second hand, and if I can convince my parents perhaps I could even buy a parts car hehe (another advantage of the Z's "worthlessness") )

-- Lachlan "Alfadog" McCombe, Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia.

[2ManyZs]

What really annoys me about Nissan turning their back on us "Zedheads" and discontinuing a lot of parts we need is the fact that we are being put out in the interest of this 350nadaZ. They want us to remain loyal to the brand yet they continue to bombard us with cars that are no where near the simple, stylish, affordable sports car the early Z series was. They say the 350 is an extension of the Z yet it is not affordable to a very large segment of the market, it's not as elegant and stylish as the early car, and it sure as hell isn't something the average person can work on in the comfort of their own garage.

That's why I said that in ten years or so the early cars will be in short supply and the prices will reflect that. Everytime a car needs a part to repair it, another car will be scrapped to supply the parts. There is really a lot of parts still available if you get right down to it. There are a few important body parts that have been discontinued and that is a shame. But if you look at other "cult" cars like the early Mustang, a huge percentage of their parts are coming from the aftermarket. So, hopefully somewhere down the line someone will see that there is a large number of these cars still in existence and start making some of the parts we need, whether in the US or Japan. It doesn't really matter, as long as they get made.

It would be interesting to do the research to see how many Z cars (before 79) that are still on the road or the track. Maybe if someone were to find out and show this to Nissan they might re-think their position on abandoning the tooling for some of these parts. Perhaps they would license the tooling out to a supplier so that parts could be made available. I would be really surprised if there weren't at least 150,000 cars still registered just in the US. And that is not counting the later ZX's, since we are primarily concerned with the early Z series here.

One of the great things about being a "Zedhead" is the fact that it's not a "class" only car. Nearly everyone can afford one as the membership here will attest too. We have owners ranging in age from 16 to 60+, and all up and down the wage scale. You don't have to be rich to own one, but it sure would help.

Perhaps someone should get an address for all of us to send an e-mail to, someone up the ladder at Nissan, and tell them we want them to license the tooling for these parts we desperately need. Who knows, maybe we would be able to buy a few more parts in the future. If not, then the prices of Z's will surely rise as the numbers of cars goes down due to there being so many cut up for parts.

I'll stop now before I get a blister on my fingers.......:tapemouth

[Alfadog]

Originally posted by 2ManyZs

What really annoys me about Nissan turning their back on us "Zedheads" and discontinuing a lot of parts we need is the fact that we are being put out in the interest of this 350nadaZ. They want us to remain loyal to the brand yet they continue to bombard us with cars that are no where near the simple, stylish, affordable sports car the early Z series was. They say the 350 is an extension of the Z yet it is not affordable to a very large segment of the market, it's not as elegant and stylish as the early car, and it sure as hell isn't something the average person can work on in the comfort of their own garage.

What really annoys me is how car magazines go on about how the design resembles the original Z... now apart from the big square grille (which looks ugly without a chrome bumper bar splitting it up IMO), I dont see anything about the car which looks like a 240Z - apart from the badge.

Mr. K calls the 300ZX the "fat lady", and Nissan has just made an even fatter one...

A mass email would be good, perhaps Mike might like to organise some sort of petition on the main page of the site?

Originally posted by 2ManyZs

That's why I said that in ten years or so the early cars will be in short supply and the prices will reflect that. Everytime a car needs a part to repair it, another car will be scrapped to supply the parts.

Good point.

[240znz]

My God...how fast can a thread get out of hand.

As prevoius replies has detailed, this Z is not by any means original....those mirrors...not period.

It just goes to show that we all have different opinions about what we like in Z's. Some people (like me) just want a affordable sweet looking car that has grunt and some like a car that is "so called" restored and will look great even in "Chunder Yellow".

Gezzzz.....good luck to those with more money than sence.....buy one and profit....I do hope this seller votes on the poll "Did you profit in selling your Z"....it would be interesting to see how much it really profited.

[Alfadog]

I dont think he would have profited at all... after all, no one makes money restoring cars, right?

[guy_geo]

Well, I just hope people who will buy the New Z (not beautiful IMO), won't keep them in a garage to boost the resale value...

As far as it is for our Z, depending where you are and where you live, I know for sure in Montreal, my Z is a crowd teaser...

Lots of peolple told me about how beautiful these cars where!

So, for me, whatever the price I paid, just hearing that is worth any price and smiles for my EGO!!!!!!

[WishN4DaZ]

If the car has been so Pristinely restored and is in such AWSOME condition, what about the little things the owner forgot to do.

For a car to be worth 18 grand, every damned little detail better be taken care of. And this guy, didn't even have the simple taste to put the emblems back on the car....

which makes you wonder what ELSE he forgot to do in his "ground up resto"

Matt

[AxtellZ]

It's been mentioned that Nissan has ceased production of body parts. We all know there are fiberglass panels available, but for anyone who doesn't know, Charlie Osborne has just started selling the rear panels at www.datsunzparts.com Looks to be a quality sheetmetal product. My 73 has damage beneath the rear bumper (PO drove like an idiot), so i will most likely use one of his panels. I'll let the list know how it works when the time comes. Thumbs up to Charlie for keeping the dream alive:) Jeremiah