lookin at a Z

[CARkid]

Hey guys. I'm new to the forum. My name's Eric.

I recently found a 70's 240Z for sale in the area and have been considering selling my car (02 Nissan Sentra SE-R Spec V) to buy this Z as a project car and buy a beater car as my daily. I was wondering, what sort of things should I look for to see what kind of condition it is in? It's been a couple of months since I last saw it. If the underbody has some rust on it, does that mean other parts of the body that are hidden by the eye are rusted? How easy is it to repair the rust? Thanks, I appreciate any information you guys can provide me!

[DatsunZGuy]

Welcome!

Go to http://zhome.com/ and look at the 'Z Ownership' section.

[kenz240z]

Hi Eric, welcome to the club. There are lots of places on the Z cars that are prone to rust:

Fenders behind the wheel

Top edge of fenders

Rocker panels

Dogleg in front of rear wheel

Rear wheel arches

A pillar (side of windshield/door opening)

Floorpans

Rear hatch sill

Cowl area

Door edges

Battery tray

Frame rails

These are a few areas. Any metal part can rust. The difficulty/cost in repairing the rust depends on where the rust is, and if you are a welder. Almost anything can be fixed, but be prepared to shell out some bux if the car needs extensive rust repair. The worst is probably floorboards and frame rails. If you know how to weld and are good at metal fabrication then you should be able to do any rust repairs yourself.

I spent about $190 for replacement rear wheel arches & wheel houses from Tabco, and another $600 to have a body shop install them. One of these days I'd like to learn how to weld.

If you search the site you should be able to find information on various rust repairs done by members here.

You may want to update your profile to include where you are from. There may be a member or two nearby who could take a look at the car with you.

I hope the 240Z you're looking at turns out to be a good project for you! Keep us posted if you purchase the car, and put up a few pics, too.

[CARkid]

Thanks for the replies guys! I went and looked at it again today, but didn't get to drive it because it was raining. Its at a classic car dealership(it's on a guys farm) an hour south of Springfield, IL. It's a '72 240 and looks to be in amazing condition. They are asking $8,450 for it. I think the odometer said 66,XXX or 86,XXX; couldn't tell because the needle was covering the first number. But I know they will deal on it because he said it's been there for 6 months and it needs to go. It had trouble starting up, but if I got it I would redo the engine or find another engine to put in it. I have to decide whether or not I could afford this because I'm only 18 and I'm in college. I didn't see any rust, although I didn't get the best look at the underbody. But the previous owner left EVERYTHING with the car. He has before, during, and after pictures of the restoration. He repaired the rust and even welded in some metal to replace the rusted parts. Here are a few pictures I took.

Out of curiousity, has anyone on here dropped another engine in a Z? Possibly a Skyline motor or even a small block v-8.

[Virto]

Check out Hybridz.org if you're interested in motor swaps...

Although I have to tell you, a good running L-series engine is a whole lot of fun, and sounds great. There's a reason Nissan used them for so long.

Being an Illinois car, like mine, I'm sure that there's some rust hiding somewhere...under some undercoating or paint. Snapping a few pictures of the underside of the car would be nice...posting them here would get you some serious opinions.

I certainly looks nice...my 280Z was yellow in a different life. POs...never can make up thier minds...factory blue to yellow to gray. Oh well, at least it's mine.

Major problem areas are the battery tray, frame rails, spare tire house and floor pan. My PO replaced the floor pan already, and did a backyard band-aid fix of the frame rails...it's not pretty and it's not going to last forever, but at least it's drivable.

One other consideration. Illinois does still require cars built after something like 1946 to be tested for emissions. It's just an idle test (no dyno) but you need to be able to keep the car is good running order to prevent a failure. These cars are awesome, but they aren't cheap.

Still, I wish mine looked that good...but I didn't pay anything like 8k for it. If I were you I'd really get some undercarriage shots of the car and put them up here, and everyone will love to help you decide.

EDIT: As for the trouble starting, the car might just need to have the carbs tuned. If you do decide to pick up the car, people here can offer some help, depending on what carbs are hiding under those air cleaners.

[Arne]

Looks like dual Webers, not the original SUs. Much harder to tune properly than SUs. But fairly reliable once they are tuned properly. (Of course, so are the SUs.)

Also looks like it still has a ballast resistor, so it's probably still got the points ignition. That's probably a more likely reason for the hard start.

[ncz]

Eric, car looks in great shape from the outside. Didn't see the other pic's, but as for dropping in engines(and on a college budget) a car in that price range and supposed shape should run you for your entire college stay and then some(I was on the extended plan myself!) As Arne and Virto said, should just be tuning and you should be good to go. Where did Arne find your engine shots?

[AWC]

My daily driver is an 03 Spec-V. Just make sure you drive a Z a few times before deciding to trade in your Spec. It is a lot different. I'm not trying to discourage you, but you should go into this with your eyes wide open.

One thing that is nice to have with an older/project car is a lot of garage space. Learn as much as you can prior to buying so you can choose the one you want.

The pics you posted of that yellow 240 look really nice.

[kenz240z]

Hi Eric, the paint on the Z is awesome, looks like a nice job was done on the body and paint. But, at $8450 I'd be worried about the mechanical performance of the car, which the hard start may be hinting at.

If possible, do a compression test on the engine to help determine what kind of shape it's in. And, look for the obvious, like smoke out of the tail pipe, oil leaks, etc...

What about the brakes? Are they solid, or do they need work? Pull the front tires and look at the rotors & pads. Pull the rear tires & look at the drums & pads. How about the suspension? Are the struts and bushings in good shape? Listen for telltale signs, clunks & thunks if you drive the car. Look at the tires. In addition to normal wear, look for indications of alignment troubles, uneven wear, etc... If these areas have been neglected you're going to have to spend a bit of money to make the car safe to drive. The $8450 car just got a little bit more expensive.

I'm not sure about Illinois, but in Colorado, the state statutes require the seller to provide an emission certificate with the car showing that it passed. Check your local statutes to see what options you may have.

If the car is truly solid and mechanically sound, then perhaps $8450 isn't too bad. You could easily spend more trying to refresh another Z to the same condition, depending on how much work it needs.

Who knows, you may be able to negotiate a lower price, or at least get the seller to correct any mechanical issues so that you purchase a car that you can enjoy right away without having to dump any money into it.

I hope it works out for you!

[Arne]

If the car is truly solid and mechanically sound, then perhaps $8450 isn't too bad. You could easily spend more trying to refresh another Z to the same condition, depending on how much work it needs.

Very true! I expect to spend more than that before my car is done. Of course, I enjoy the restoration process itself, so I wouldn't want to buy a finished product myself.

[SteveInOakland]

Agree with Ken -- definitely do a compression test.

The thing about this car is that you're paying for the body work that's been done. That's why it can begin to command this price.

If the body work wasn't done right and the car starts to rust in the key places, you'll have paid thousands of dollars for work that'll have to be redone.

If the work was done right and the car's pretty sound mechanically, it could be a decent deal.

But the thing is -- how will you know whether the work was done right? Do you trust yourself or some third party you might bring in, to make the right determination?

And let me say this -- doing the work to properly renovate a rusted Z is a big, big job and a labor of love. I'm afraid the odds are that any given job has *not* been done right. (BTW, if the car is an Illinois car, it's pretty well an absolute certainty that there have in fact been rust problems in the past.)

Getting into an old Z is a tricky thing. I don't mean to be too discouraging. Just a word of caution.

Steve.

[ggarrard]

CarKid - It might be worth finding a local Z car person to help you decide. The Windy City Z Car Club is Chicago based, but their membership is spread out and I'd bet a club member lives nearby. http://www.windycityzclub.com/

I'd also be concerned about driving a Z in the winter. Z's don't like snow and hate road salt...

GWGarrard