Can't keep everything or can I?, #156 what's it worth?

[MikeZcar]

Although I would like to I can't keep everything, working a package deal on a couple of cars and #156 is in the mix, green, needs resto but it's complete less passenger seat and it's really solid, sure it's got some hidden rust but it's not a Flintstone car. Feel sure this car is like a savings bond and down the road will command more money than now but I would like to get a feel for what I should put as a value in this deal. Not sure what I will do just yet but selling it is an option(not a good one) and IF I do decide to sell it I will post it here for 1 week before Ebay. OK anyone who has looked at, bought or considered buying a low number car recently tell me what kind of prices were being thrown around. Please no PMs, I still haven't worked a deal or decided the fate of the car if I end up with it. What's it worth? Mike

[jmortensen]

One of my friends sold #472 about a year, maybe a year and a half ago. Sounds like similar condition. Had been repainted in factory color once nicely, good weatherstripping, ran nice, had hole in muffler and needed complete exhaust system from the manifold back, and had a rusty spot in a door and in one floorboard. Other than that it was bone stock, had original hub caps, original engine, monkey motion 4 speed, etc.

Wallowed on ebay twice IIRC, sold once for $8000 but it fell through after the auction, second time no bids. Ended up selling to a private party for $7000 or $7500 I think. It didn't bring what it should have. Unfortunately from what I understand my friend wasn't willing to drive anywhere to show it to anybody and really made it hard for locals to look at the car. I know she can be difficult sometimes and I'm sure this hurt the value, but I really thought it would bring more.

Just beware, because the people here who say it's worth $15,000 are the people who won't be bidding... ;-) Start it low, reserve it where you won't be disappointed, and cross your fingers. Good luck.

[26th-Z]

Mike,

There are several threads floating in the archive about relative value for the early cars. There was a blurb in the Wall Street Journal not too long ago and Hagerty Insurance just published some research. However nothing really addresses the implied value of a low vin car. Of course, a car is only worth what a buyer is willing to spend at any given time, but the going trend seems to be around $18,000 + for a drop dead gorgeous, pristine example of a '70, '71 Z. You will see higher prices - lots higher, but the published values are lower.

That has nothing to do with a low vin car, however. 27th was purchased in 2004 for under $3,000 sitting in my driveway. I know another double-digit vin project that traded less than a year ago for not much more - and it's a driver! The one low vin car I know of that is absolutely flawless (restored) is not for sale for anything under $30,000 - more like $40,000. Keep in mind that it will take $40,000 to restore a Z that is worth $40,000.

Hope this helps. I would guess from your description the car is worth $4,500 to $6,000 depending on how original it is. Something like a missing seat is a big red flag to what else is missing.

Chris

[gnosez]

I just want to know if the thumbnail pic is some sort of math test where we have to figure out how many log sections to the right of that Series I 240 would have to be placed inside it before it sank to the bottom of the pond in the background? I think I have the density of cypress trees around here someplace......

[26th-Z]

Great picture, isn't it? Reminds me of a "Creature from the Swamp" movie poster. And it's the best picture I have! All the rest make her look like junk!

[lonetreesteve]

Almost 2 years ago #390 sold for only $510.00, but this one was absolutley on the low end of the spectrum! It had a lot of rust and some of the members here thought it wasn't even worth restoring: http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13282

On the opposite end of the spectrum is the $40,000.00 one that Chris referenced. Not sure where yours falls- Can you post some pics for us?

[SJGREEN71]

Well, it is less than 2 hours to go on eBay, number 682 still has no bids at a starting price of $12.500, so this should give you an indication of the value of a low number. This car is in much better shape that what you describe yours to be. Search on eBay Item number: 4613610880

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1970-Datsun-Z-Series-240z_W0QQitemZ4613610880QQcategoryZ6187QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[Carl Beck]

Well, it is less than 2 hours to go on eBay, number 682 still has no bids at a starting price of $12.500, so this should give you an indication of the value of a low number. This car is in much better shape that what you describe yours to be. Search on eBay Item number: 4613610880

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1970-Datsun-Z-Series-240z_W0QQitemZ4613610880QQcategoryZ6187QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Looks like it sold for $12,500.00. If it is actually as nice as the pictures would lead you to believe - the buyer got a bargin.

If I had seen it - I might have been in there bidding. One of the pictures showing the area behind the seat - also shows a vinyl mat!! That car "might" have had the vinyl mats from the Factory - but I see the rear deck now has carpet... but maybe the owner put that in.... maybe he has the original vinyl mats!!

FWIW,

Carl B.

[Carl Beck]

Hi Mike:

In general terms.... a good solid (meaning as rust free as you will find) Series I 240-Z, STOCK with all parts present and correct , body straight, not recently repainted, not bondo'ed, good dash and all interior parts in good shape - and one that can be driven and drives out well - etc.... is a $6,500.00 to $7,500.00 car.

When you say "needs resto"... that's somewhat different than above... That means to me, that the car needs to be repainted now!, or rebuilt before it would be "presentable" at the local Z Car Club meeting... it means the dash is shot, it needs door panels, paint, re-chrome everything, rebuild brakes, new tires etc etc etc.... In that case it's a $3,500.00 to $4,500.00 example. But depending on it's location - say East of the Mississippi - it might still be a $5,500.00 example to the right buyer.

With the above as a baseline - what's a "low vin" worth? Lets say that we are here talking about 1969 production dated cars only ..... This gets very tricky to explain... as it is all but impossible to separate the value of "condition" completely from the value of "low VIN".

At present - any restorable example (not one ready to send to the crusher - not one that is "salvageable"...) of a 69 production dated car has a base value of $3,500.00 and that might be a couple grand higher depending on the completeness of all the original parts on the car... or where it is located.

As the value of the "condition" of the car goes UP... the percentage of the additional value of the low VIN goes down.. when you are talking about VIN's between 800 - and 100.

So if Car #156 has a "condition" value of $6,500.00 then the low VIN would be worth an extra one to two grand. If Car #156 had a "condition" value of $3,500.00 you might have to add two to three grand for the VIN.

VIN's below HLS30 0200 - add between $1,500.00 and $2,500.00 (there are 47 of them that we know of...not counting the race cars #6, 7 & 8).

VIN's below HLS30 0100 - aka double digit VIN's.... add between $3,500.00 and $4,500.00 (there are 28 of them that we know of not counting the race cars #6, 7 & 8).

VIN's below HLS30 0050... add between $4,500.00 and $5,500.00 (there are 17 of them etc)

VIN's below HLS30 0032.... add between $5,500.00 and $8,500.00 (there are only 10 of them etc.)

VIN's below HLS30 0017.... add whatever it takes - there is only ONE. (unless we ever do find #13,14 or 15).

There is also a value - other than money - ***ociated with the 69 production cars. That is the fact that they are easier to resell...than like condition later cars. They also have a value ***ociated with the history of the design, bragging rights or the amount of interest they generate... Call it a "fun factor"...

So as I understand your description of #156... it looks like $4,500.00 plus $3,500.00 = $8K, if you can find the right buyer.. priced for a quick sale... $6,500.00

All the above is just a general guideline.... nothing is absolute in that market....

FWIW,

Carl B.

Carl Beck

Clearwater, FL USA

[MikeZcar]

Thanks to all who have added their two cents, and Carl thanks for your reply as I think this is a great Archive piece and if someone needs this info at a later date it will be of great value. The car is a "needs everything" example that's mostly intact and very solid. IF I can get him to sell it, "Gonna restore it someday" kinda deal as it sits outside, and it is affordable would prefer to push it into the shop and spend 3 years or so on it. If the price is too high I may see if there is room to resell it or may post info here if it's more than I want to fool with. More info as it bcomes available. Mike

[moonpup]

Feel free to put this in the FWIW category, but about 20 yrs. ago I spotted #200 in a Houston salvage yard. Not much left, no engine and missing the entire rear clip. If I remember correctly, it was a silver car.

[MikeZcar]

Well it's as I feared, still not for sale, I did buy the Black Pearl and it's in my garage now. I have promised to call him the first week of every month till one of us croaks or he sells me the car. I hope to end up with this car as he also has his 72 Z race car he campaigned 20 years ago to restore and I don't think he will find the time to restore both. I did guilt him into moving both of them inside, he has the room especially since that old black 78 Z is out of the way now. Wish me luck and look for this thread to come back out of the blue with a big YEEHAH as the title, someday. Mike