Strut Insert Selection

[Dtsnlvrs]

Ok I know we have been through this before, but I want a difinitive answer from a few of you guys (Coffey, Mortenson, et al). Let me start by explaining where I am coming from and where I want to go. When stationed in Italy, I sectioned my struts, and installed GC Coilovers, and Street Prepared camber plates. Spring rates were 175F, 200R. I do not remember the exact cartridge GC sent me but they were Illuminas. I used the car as a daily driver / Auto-x / Track day car. I was also using the GC 1" front bar and the Susp Tech rear bar. I loved the setup but upon return to the states found the ride too jarring. Out came the coilovers, in went stock struts raped from a wrecked 240, w/ tokiko hp and MSA springs (the old blue ones). The car looked like a friggin truck but the jarring ride was gone (at this point I was not Auto-Xing the car). Well a year went by and I decided to go coilovers again. Which brings us to where we are now. New GC coilovers (sold old ones to a buddy). F150, R175 no camber plates (stock strut mounts). I installed 240Z F insert in rear (Tokico HP) and used 300XZ front insert up front (bout 1 in shorter). Hindsight being what it is, I think I should have gone with a different strut up front. I am not bottoming, but at a track day or Auto-X I will. I have heard VW rabbit (gland nut issues), and MR2 rear (HZ or BZ3099). The car is primarily used as a nice weather daily driver (really nice weather) with an occasional Auto-X (when I aint deployed for a whole season). Would my best bet be the MR2 strut and should I stick with the HP or go Illumina. I have always liked the "west coast" setup (btw....its the same philosophy Bob Sharp used...soft springs w stiff bars) and will not excede 225lb/in spring rates. On a tangent...I remember when Illums were the hot new ticket in VW cup racing (circa 1986)

[jmortensen]

Illuminas on 1 ride softer than the HPs. I ran Illuminas on 1 with 200/250 rates, camber plates, heims jointed control arms and TC rods, and had no problems at all. Daily drove it like that for 5+ years. Put the struts on 3 and it would make you pee blood practically. Couple of times I have them on 3 or 4 at an autox and forget to turn them down. SORE BACK by the time I'd driven the 2 hours home. I'd suggest the Illuminas for your softer rate springs on 1 or 2 for street driving. Zguitar71 might help too, as he's running 180/200 springs with Illuminas. For sake of comparison I have a friend who has the Tokico shock/spring combo and her car rides marginally smoother than mine. Not hugely different IMO, but hers is noticeably smoother I'd say.

I just bought BZ3099s but haven't run them yet. They are 1 5/8" shorter than stock. So that's not going to be a huge change from what you have now. Is it worth all the hassle to get an extra 5/8" of travel? I'd guess not.

[Dtsnlvrs]

Well considering we did not shorten the housings enough for the 300zx inserts, going with the MR2, and doing it right, might yield exactly what I was looking for to begin with. The big improvement in ride I believe was from removing the camber plates. East coast roads being what they are makes for a very bumpy ride with them installed. I may just buy a set of HZ3099 to get the setup right...then down the road replace all of em with illuminas. On another slight tangent. Anyone have any input on the Modern Motorsport adjustable chapman arms? I am considering a set of those combined with off-center front bushings to get the alighnment "perfect"

[zguitar71]

I run around town with the Illuminas on 2 and the car is very stiff for the street (we have very bad streets here, much like the North East, freeze thaw, frost heaves, ect...). On one the ride does smoothe out a bit but I think it is a little bounce, the rebound on 1 is a little soft but keep in mind I drive the hell out of my car when I get it out of the garage and do my 50 or so miles a week, so I like to keep the suspension pretty stiff and under as much controll as possible. On 3 the car is too stiff for my crappy street tires and it gets a little skatey sometimes. With the race tires on a cold day I run 3 and when it is warmer I run 4. I tried 5 but it was a little skatey again. In the rain and cold (last race last year, 45 and rain) I ran on 2 with the race tires. I think on 1 you could tollerate the ride around town, probably not on 2 though. For an autox/street car the Illumina's are great. They are the best compromise street/track shock around. Any more toward race and the suspension would be too stiff for the street and any more toward street and the suspension would be too soft for the track. IMO you should get the stiffest springs you are willing to run (225 rear 200 front?) and get the Illumina's and drive. The street ride will not be Caddy on the 1st setting but after all your driving a race car.

[Dtsnlvrs]

Thanks for all the info. I will probably wait till after my next move (OCT 11), and install Illums, use the MR2 strut up front and increase my spring rate to 200r 175f. Of course I may adjust that based on local road conditions at my new duty station (no clue where yet But I am going to be an Army Recruiter now). In Italy, I would run the Illuminas at 2 on the street, and adjust as necessary for Auto-X or track days. We would Auto-X on the Airfield and I found I would have to use different settings every time due to pavement changes, transitions from concrete to asphalt, or whether we ran a fast or slow course. At Hockenheim track days I would run 3 up front and 4 in rear, And at Hungaroring track days I would run 4 and 4. In the 4 years I spent in Europe, my tire selection was Potenza RE-71, Yok AVS Interm (both in 225/50/15, and used Michelin street rally gumballs (very sticky) in 24x10x15. I would get the Michelins for free from rally teams after the local rallys. They were good for Auto-X (usally two events) or 1 track day. John Coffey, you wanna chime in on this one?

[EricB]

Can I ask a detail question about your setups?

What length springs are you using F&R?

Thanks,

-e

[Dtsnlvrs]

The springs are Eibach 10in free length, 2.5in diameter.

[EricB]

Thank you Russell

-e

[John Coffey]

The street 240Z I'm building for myself will have the following:

EMI Racing camber plates with a 1/4" poly isolator.

EMI Racing coil over kit.

175F/200R springs.

ST 1" front and 3/4" rear ARBs.

Tokico Illuminas BZ3099/BZ3015.

I think it will be a good compromise for comfort and handling.

[Toein1949]

Hi,

I am rebuilding a 240z and would like to replace the front strut inserts, the originals rusted away!! buying original inserts over here is (Southern Ireland) expensive, will MR2 inserts or another type fit?

Thanks

Ian

[Toein1949]

Hi Again,

I just looked at another thread and it suggests shortening the strut tube by 1.5" and using a MR2 insert?

Is that correct?

Thanks

Ian

[John Coffey]

http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?t=103860