Need computer help!

[hls30.com]

Dave,

Have you rebuilt a starter or replaced it? Most testing that is performed on them really does not go past replaceable and inexpensive brushes, but...the labor involved means most of them get replaced not repaired.

While I will agree a bad block by its self is not necessarily an indication that a hard drive is going bad, the growth in numbers of bad blocks is. A growing number of bad blocks in absolutley indicative of read failure in a drive be it due to changing head geometry, or failing media..

Ed is in an area he is not familiar with. Yes, he could download the right set of utilities from the existing drives manufacturers web site and properly test the drive, but EVERY manufacturer states that the only true test of a drives health is made by destructive data testing-that is NONE of them will authorize a warranty replacement for a drive with symptoms like EDS without the drive failing to reformat. With this test he looses all data, and the ability to recover it...in Eds situation, this is not a good answer. There is a chance the drive is not actually going bad, but if the drive will not pull a directory, then the file allocation table has been corrupted meaning that the drive no longer is sure of what it contains, or how it is organized. More often than not, this is a precursor to drive failure. While Ed has not reported that he is getting a "Bad CRC" error, the odds are that is where his drive is heading. If It was my drive, I would replace the drive, and use the utilities that came with a new drive to attemt to copy the contents of the old drive, then thoroughly test the old drive, but I have been servicing drives since before the controllers were addressable with "debug G=C800:5", when the tools I used most were a soldering iron and an oscillascope, and when replacing a board was never a cost effective repair. For the cost of a new drive, he could save some of his data which does seem to be important to him. If the data and time was not important, the testing would be a viable option.

It all comes down to the most economical repair, do you spend a time testing and hoping the drive will pass and continue to function, or do you spend a little less time for a sure thing? Depends on value of the data, the labor rate, and the cost of a drive.

Will

BTW you said:

"Somebody recommending a new hard drive right off the bat is the 'service technician disease' IMO...most techs in a service company have to work quick, and to say 'just buy a new hard drive' is a quick way to fix the problem. It fixes it, but it isn't the most effecient fix for the consumer, and isn't necessary."

I will be happy for you to pay me for the time that would be spent doing this testing and not replace the hard drive, I would get a great deal more of your money (and you would have a much higher bill) than I would by simply replacing the drive.

Funny thing about that "technicinan disease", it saves customers money even if the drive tests good(a replcement drive costs less than the time it would take an onsite technician to sit through a test) Let's not forget Eds time is worth money too, and he has a learning curve as well.

In addition the utility you link will not test drives which are linked to a raid controller, or in some systems that require drivers for the controller-so they may or may not work on a particular system though they will work on every drive under specific conditions.

[owenk]

Ed, I left my cell phone home today,:stupid: so sent you a PM with my work #

[owenk]

Dave,

BTW you said:

"Somebody recommending a new hard drive right off the bat is the 'service technician disease' IMO...most techs in a service company have to work quick, and to say 'just buy a new hard drive' is a quick way to fix the problem. It fixes it, but it isn't the most effecient fix for the consumer, and isn't necessary."

I will be happy for you to pay me for the time that would be spent doing this testing and not replace the hard drive, I would get a great deal more of your money (and you would have a much higher bill) than I would by simply replacing the drive.

Funny thing about that "technicinan disease", it saves customers money even if the drive tests good(a replcement drive costs less than the time it would take an onsite technician to sit through a test) Let's not forget Eds time is worth money too, and he has a learning curve as well.

In addition the utility you link will not test drives which are linked to a raid controller, or in some systems that require drivers for the controller-so they may or may not work on a particular system though they will work on every drive under specific conditions.

Very well said and I would like to add, If you have a failing drive and the more you screw with it the more data you could loose. The data typically has more value then the hardware. I have worked with DriveSavers (data recovery company) and the first thing they do is make a copy of the harddrive then start going for the data.

[Ed]

Just an update. I went to wally world and picked up a new 80GB internal hard drive for $70 bucks. OwenK talked me through installing it and it went pretty smooth. A lot easier then I thought. The new drive is up and running and I'm back in buisness. Thanks Owen.

Now I have to try and recover data off the old drive.

[sblake01]

If your computer has USB, and most all of them do now, the easiest way I've found to transfer data from an old drive is through a USB to IDE adapter. They're not very expensive either and Owen, me, or anyone who has done it could talk you through the process.

[owenk]

The good news is that Ed reload the OS, updates, and anti-virus software on the new drive while the old drive was disconnected. But when reconnecting the old drive as a secondary it is reconigized by the BIOS & OS but cannot be read and at first boot windows ran a check disk that it could not complete .

So I have told him what is options are:

1. Try some some of the tools out there, SpinRite, etc (but he may make it worse.)
   
2. Take it to a local computer shop (hopefully they will/can make a image of the drive before trying to recover the data).
   
3. See what Drive Savers can do / cost. Basicly it has come down to what are his photos worth.
   

[EScanlon]

Based on what you've posted, it sounds as though the old drive is being recognized as being present, and with a different label (D:\). However, the computer is trying to do a Check Disk (CHKDSK) that it is unable to complete. That's probably due to errors in the FAT and as such it can't effect a proper check.

Sometimes the drive CAN be read, and even accessed.....up to a limit. Check Disk and Scan Disk are both utilities that read the WHOLE disk, bit by biit. This causes a problem because the utility won't complete successfully if there is a problem that prevents it from executing and terminating it's complete program. So you try to step around it.

I've been able to read sectors of drives that have been physically OPENED and SCRATCHED on the disk itself. Admittedly, there were so many problems with that disk, that it was way too much trouble, and we had a back-up.

But, you MIGHT be able to rescue some data.

Try the following. Boot up normally, but cancel the Check on the old Drive.

Exit to MS-DOS, and at the prompt( C:\> ) change drives by typing in " D: " then key Enter.

The Prompt should now read ( D:\> )

If it DOES: Change directories to the one that has the pictures in it.

This can get tricky as DOS still does not recognize more than 8 characters for names, so you might have to pull a DIR / W to be able to read the name of the directory you want in proper DOS shorthand.

Once you're at the directory with the pics, you can pull a directory to see just how much it can read. Once you know that it CAN read that directory, you're half way there.

Change drives back to C:, then find or create a directory that you want to receive the photos. CD is shorthand for Change Directory, and MD is for MAKE Directory. Once you have C: ready to receive and the prompt shows that you are IN the directory that you want to receive the files, switch back to drive D: one more time.

Now, at the ( D:\> ) Prompt, type: COPY *.* C: and key Enter.

This will take a bit, but SHOULD copy all the files in the D: (old) drive and onto the new (C:).

There are other flags to add to the copy command, but this is one of the simplest and should allow the OS to read what it can, and alert you to the ones that it can not. When you get a failure reading, and you probably WILL, you can determine how far you've gotten and how much more you can recover.

Hope this helps.

Enrique

[owenk]

Good idea Enrique, I work so much in Windows i forget that DOS commands still exist! It is like when I used a typwriter ~3 years ago I was puzzled on what to do when I got to the end of the line and it did not word rap !

[Ed]

Thanks Enrique, I'll try this tomorrow.

[sblake01]

If you ran the drive through a USB to IDE adapter, like I suggested in post #29, it would not have to go through the bios and thus would not have to go through checkdisk. In essence the old hard drive would become a USB mass storage device. You could simply drag the files you want from it once you were in windows. I've done this, it works as long as the drive it still readable.

[RolfSis]

Curious if you've tried again to access via SAFE MODE so you can get to Device Manager, and if you have Administrative access. Sometimes if its merely a missing system file, and have the XP CD handy, executing this:

start -> run -> sfc /scannow (space after sfc)

may help restore missing key system files.

Also, as stated, if you've suffered an intrusion, the first line of defense is always to scan your entire system (all files, including the heuristic scan options with updated virus definition files) whether using Norton or McAfee, or whatever (some freebies out there as well), to eradicate the intrusions may prove helpful. System Restore functions would need to be turned of if you've truly been 'invaded" so that after the cleanup you're not again reintroducing the culprit back into the environment.

2 cents worth; know your pain ...

Curious what you may have done recently to cause this change

- new hardware or software installed? Freeware often comes along with problems

- Errors found in Event Logs that may help?

Running ANY viruscan applications with updated virus definition files along with spyware tools?

Lots of other links/ideas here:

Microsoft still has a 90 day free trial for some help here (free):

Try Windows Live OneCare: The always-on security and performance service for your PC

Windows Live OneCare works quietly in the background on your computer, helping protect your PC from viruses, spyware, hackers, and other unwanted intruders. It also goes beyond security, regularly backing up all your important files and automatically cleaning up and tuning up your PC to help keep it running at top speed.

Antivirus

Removes viruses, worms, and Trojan horses

Scans and cleans attachments, downloads, and other files

Updates automatically to counteract new threats

Antispyware

Helps protect your PC against pop-ups, slow performance, unwanted programs, and security breaches

.... and more, source link here:

http://onecare.live.com/standard/en-us/purchase/trial.htm?sc_cid=mscom_srch

Good luck.

[BRE-240Z]

Just a guess, but I would imagine that sometime during the last year and a half, he's managed to solve this computer problem......