NOS Body shell?

[Alfadog]

I just came across this eBay auction in Australia:

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4651574320&fromMakeTrack=true

I was wondering if anyone could shed light onto this? Did Nissan actually make body shells to sell as SPARES? I have never heard of a NOS body shell before... I am not refuting his claim, I'm just seeing if anyone here has more information.

[Virto]

I suppose it's entirely possible. It could be something as simple as a production ended and they had leftover shells and nothing to do with them.

Tons of surface rust, but it might clean up nice.

[NZeder]

I heard a rumor here in NZ that you could still get NOS KP510 (ie 2 door 510) body shells ex Japan landed in NZ for $8500 NZD - funny money to the rest of the world but that would be $5250 USD. I have not asked Nissan if this is true or not. Never know might be a S30 shell there too or a KGC10 shell - I would keen on that

[Carl Beck]

Very interesting. I do not know, or did not know... that one could order a complete body shell for the 66 Datsun Station-wagon through a local Datsun Dealer. Too bad the original paperwork wasn't kept with the body.

Nissan Motors USA, did though their Datsun Competition Department supply "white bodies" and "penny cars" for the factory sponsored, or factory supported race teams here in the USA.

A "white body" was a bare body shell, sprayed with only a white primer/paint (actually a very thin coat of paint to prevent rust). I have been told by various members of various race teams that the white bodies had no chassis numbers. However I have also been told by one of the people that bought a white body a few years ago that it did have a chassis number... 00017. So who knows??

The "penny cars" were regular production cars supplied to the race teams for use in competition. They were sold by Nissan, to the race team for one penny, so ownership would transfer and with it the liability that could be incurred.

Here in the States, roadster bodies, 510 bodies and Z bodies were all supplied as either "white bodies" and/or "penny cars" to the competitors.

It was a contract violation, as well as a breach of Federal Law if any of the white bodies or penny cars were re-sold to the general public for road use, or titled for sale. Normally ownership was held on the Manufacture's Statement of Origin (MSO).

FWIW,

Carl B.

Carl Beck

Clearwater, FL USA

http://ZHome.com

[sakijo]

Is all that orange paint or rust? I looked through my parts manual and can't find any part number for a shell (no surprise) but they list everything you would need to build your own car ala-carte - roof panel, quarter panel, fenders, floor pans, etc. But, as we all know, with cars, the sum of the parts far exceeds the price of the finished product.

[Mr Camouflage]

I dont think its that unusual for a car manufacturer to sell a bare shell.

The drift monaro gto that competes in the aussie drift circuit was bought as a bare shell, not a complete car, and purposly built/modified for drifting.

Same with all the Touring cars. They are bought as a shell and built from there, not bought as a complete car, stripped and rebuilt. They also need spare shells for when cars get destroyed beyond repair.

I think he's dreaming about the price though.

[g72s20]

I think when a vehicle is new on the market it was(is?) not uncommon to have replacement shells available for the body repair industry. When new the cost of rebuilding the car into a new shell may have been a viable alternative to an insurance write-off. In my experience this was not uncommon during the late '60's to early '70's. Every now and then a NOS shell of varying makes will appear in "Unique Cars" (Australian publication) though usually of domestic production.

Never know might be a S30 shell there too or a KGC10 shell - I would keen on that

...Yeeeas! I would love to get hold of an old KGC10 rolling shell to build into a look a like of any of the old touring cars that raced...dream on JimLOL

[daddz]

I have heard of 'heritage bodyshells' with regard to the British sportscars such as MGB, TR-6 etc. The old tooling was saved and thus the new bodyshells were stamped out and sold and I believe you can still buy those bodyshells. The bigger question for any S30 enthusiast is what did Nissan do with the old tooling which stamped out the S30 bodyshell? If that tooling still survives maybe a possibility exists that reproduction bodyshells could someday be stamped out and sold? Assuming Nissan still had the tooling the negotiations would be very interesting.

[Alfadog]

Unfortunately, I believe the S30Z tooling was destroyed quite some time ago.

A real pity, if it hadn't then who knows, perhaps the Factory Z Programme would have been exactly that!

[26th-Z]

I think the seller has been eating mushrooms. That is a stripped out body shell from an old production car if ever I have seen one! No question in my mind. However, the archives of Her Majesty the 26th can shed some light on this discussion. Here are some results from exhaustive research.

The Datsun Competition department of Nissan U.S.A. sold ten 280 ZX body shells which lacked VIN to various competition teams of the time such as Electramotive, BSR, Jim Fitzgerald, Logan Blackburn, and Frank Leary. To the best of my knowledge, there are no S30 "white bodies". Please show me an example.

Two books discuss the disposition of the tooling for the S30 chassis; "Z-Car, Revival of a Legend", by Seiichi Takarabe and "Mr. K - A Japanese Who Rezalized a Dream in America", by Takashi Ashakawa. Both books were co-authored by Yutaka Katayama. The translated version of "Mr. K" was prepared by Brian and Miho Long, edited by Mike Taylor. ( I have copies if anyone wants to buy one - $25 ) The tooling was destroyed along with most of the production records for reasons having to do with a dispute between Nissan management and labor organizations. An understanding of that issue might be achieved through reading; "William R. Gorham; An American Engineer in Japan, translated by Donald Gorham.

I have held in my hands what appear to be factory build records - computer punch cards with Japanese printed text filled in with typed information. As described to me at the time of my holding, these cards came in the box with the wheel covers and very few remain in private collections.

The archive endeavors to collect information about the design, tooling, construction, and manufacture of the S30 chassis. To me, the S30 represents the high sophistication of Japanese automotive production technology. A time when automated machining and production techniques were taking place in Japanese industry. The S30 exhibits some remarkable qualities in design such as the symmetry issue to accommodate the export market. Or the accommodations made to the basic chassis for all the various production models. I have yet to find photographs of the body shell construction in the factory. One of my favorite pictures is this floor section for a series two. This component was evidently constructed and supplied as such for fitment to the rear deck sub-assembly and the front firewall / cowl sub-assembly. Notice the hand welding where the components are joined.

[HS30-H]

To the best of my knowledge, there are no S30 "white bodies". Please show me an example.

There is one right here in the UK. I'm sure I told you about this before?

It is a very early 'RLS30' body ( RLS30-000017 in fact ) that was originally supplied by Nissan to Bob Sharp Racing as a 'spare' bodyshell - eventually to be built up into a race car should it ever be needed.

I'm guessing that BSR possibly received either another of these 'White Bodies' and/or a couple of complete early RLS30s too ( around the time that the first RLS30s were being produced ).

Anyway, this body was never actually built up into a running car and was eventually sold off to a private individual who also never used it. It seems to have passed through at least one other pair of hands on the east coast of the USA before my friend Geoff Jackson of Fourways Engineering purchased it and brought it over to the UK. Once in the UK it was partially converted to an RHD configuration and given a couple of coats of primer, but then put back into storage. It stayed in storage for some years, but earlier this year was dis-interred and sold. It may well finally be built up into a complete car after all these years.

It is a complete basic bodyshell ( no bolt-on panels whatsoever ) and of course the sheetmetal tabs for the wiring and accessories have never been 'bent' over - which is fun to see. Anyone who sees it in the metal can instantly recognise that this is clearly a 'virgin' unused 'shell - even if it has a healthy coat of surface rust spots and the ( reversible ) RHD conversion.

What I found interesting about this bodyshell was that it was supplied WITH A COMPLETE VIN AND BODY SERIAL NUMBER. We could get our teeth into another nice 'philosophical' discussion about what actually constitutes a car and what actually constitutes an identity for that car. To my mind, this bodyshell is 'RLS30-000017' - and hanging a set of panels and a full set of mechanicals on it doesn't really change that fact all that much. It would have been included in the production records and quantities at the factory, and arguably has carried its identity all the way through its 'life' so far. That I find interesting.

My personal take on this is that RLS30-000017 was plucked from the normal production process expressly to be sent to BSR.

Now, if Nissan had supplied "replacement" ( 'White Body' / 'Body in White' ) bodyshells for the S30-series Z, surely they would have had to have 'blank' body serial numbers? If they were supplied with the intention of repairing damaged cars, but had full VIN / body serial numbers from the production line, then they would not be 'repairing' - but actually 'replacing' the original identity with a new one. That's one of the reasons why I see a factory-stamped VIN / body serial number as an 'identity' in its own right, and can't stop myself from imagining that a car's identity arguably *begins* when the VIN & body serial number combination was whacked into the firewall sheetmetal...............

Alan T.

[26th-Z]

Alan,

You have shown me that example, however that is not what I am talking about. It has a VIN therefore it is not a "white" body shell. I am not particularly talking about the color of the coating. I am talking about the VIN. Your example is RLS30-000017 and could never be used as a substitution for another VIN. Here in the States, I believe, Federal law would prohibit a full chassis substitution. Your point about vehicle identity, birth, is well taken in this discussion.

That is why I am so taken with the photo of the floor tub. I can not imagine the extent of damage that would cause this assembly to be used as a replacement part. A chassis would have to be literally cut in thirds to install this sub-assembly and I think the photograph is of a manufacturing component; intended for chassis construction rather than replacement part.

I think it is quite possible for Nissan to have produced and delivered a 'blank' S30, but I doubt it. It has been pointed out that certain S30 blanks could have been produced and delivered for the use of design study teams. In all probability they would have been disposed of. However, in that respect we have discussed the idea that the very first production 'mules' were without serial number and we are discovering that misconception. I am begining to believe that Nissan did not make a 'blank' S30. Even as customized as they were, the rally cars had VINs. How about all the 432-Rs? The school cars. The pace cars? Did they all have VINs?