Zx Distributer Swap Problems- Advice?!

[bloxman]

Okey everybody chime in here I need some advice, thoughts, and recomendations.

I recently Purchased a Used ZX Distributer from a member of another Club. I repeat not this club!

I paid some fairly decent dough for this distributer and If you take into account where I live (Grenada, West Indies) I paid a whopping $U.S. 200.00 in shipping and it don't work!

I plunked her in the whole and she would not start, close but no go.

I was in the middle of attempting the rebuild on this link :

http://atlanticz.ca/zclub/techtips/distributorrebuild/index.html

Ah so here's the problem..it appears I got hosed eh!

The vacuum advance cannister thing is screwed, I can blow right through it into the distributer , I mean Zero resistance. so the diaphram is toast, I assume it is unrepairable.

So my question even really is should I even look for a vacuum advance unit new or used (maybe somebody in this club could help out)

Or should I buy a "new" remanufactured one ($150.00)and pray the little module on the "screwed Dizzy is O.K.

Ah just a thought a new remanufactured unit would come with the Vacuum canister right?

Bloxman

[Ksteve]

Bloxman,

The vacuum advance does not come into use durring starting and idling so I don't think that is the main problem (though it is obviously bad if you can blow through it)

I would first check to see if you are getting spark to the end of all your spark plug leads while cranking, if yes then double check the position of the dist. rotor when the crank and cam are at top dead center. It should be pointing almost strait forward (to the front of the car).

If you are not getting any spark through the leads you may have a bad dist. module, a bad coil lead/connection, a bad coil, or just bad wiring/connections to the coil.

I hope this helps out.

As a side note, I found a remanufactured ZX dist. from my local parts store for $120. They said it comes with the vacuum advance but not the module. When it arrived it had both! Mabe I'm just lucky.

Steve

[240ZMan]

Bloxman, I'm running triple webers like you and gave up on vacuum advance when I installed them. Because triples have 6 individual runners, there isn't as much vacuum available for the distributor. I run all mechanical with a total of 35 degrees.

Vacuum advance is only used to gain a little better fuel economy at light throttle, such as when cruising on the highway. Under those conditions of high manifold vacuum the distributor will advance timing further because the engine can usually tolerate it and it gives you a little better mileage. You do not need vacuum advance, it's just nice to have. Since you have triple webers, you've already decided that economy isn't your #1 priority

So as Steve said, the issue isn't with the failed vacuum servo, it's somewhere else. I don't blame you for being frustrated by not getting what you thought you purchased, but if it's any consolation, it's not surprising to see the vacuum servo failed on a 30 year old part.

[bloxman]

Thanks 240Z man and K steve

O.K. so I feel margfinally better having heard what you said about the vacuum advance function in relation to webbers and economy. Ya economy is kinda low on my priority list.

I was going to order it tonight off Amazon. Though it says it comes with the module and the Vac advance

Thoughts?

So based on your inputs, I'll just carve it off, ( Hack saw), the Dizzy.

That should allow me to be able to remove it.

Part of the problems seems to be it is inverted.

When I say inverted I mean the little pipe seems to face up in all photos I have ever seen on the net, but ... mine faces down like the points dizzy. Possibly this is what busted it and maybe what has jammed it.

Wish me luck

Thanks again guys.

Bloxman

[240ZMan]

So based on your inputs, I'll just carve it off, ( Hack saw), the Dizzy.

That should allow me to be able to remove it.

Part of the problems seems to be it is inverted.

When I say inverted I mean the little pipe seems to face up in all photos I have ever seen on the net, but ... mine faces down like the points dizzy. Possibly this is what busted it and maybe what has jammed it.

I think you may be going down the wrong path here. I would NOT cut it off with a hack saw, at least not if you plan on reusing any parts of it

Even if the vacuum advance is frozen, it's not going to prevent the engine from starting. I would focus my efforts on the wiring to the dizzy, and also check the sensor and the magnets on the shaft inside. From your earlier post it sounds like you're not getting any spark. Have you confirmed that? (Have someone crank the engine while you pull a spark plug wire off and hold it very close to the plug tip. You are looking to see the spark jump. NOTE: YOU WANT YOUR HAND TO BE INSULATED FROM THE WIRE. Wear gloves, thicker is better, you can also use insulated pliers. Feeling the full spark won't kill you, but it's not any fun either.)

Also, have you confirmed you have your timing set reasonably close to where it needs to be? Perhaps you took note of the old dizzy's positon before you put the new one in? If you're timing is too far off, the engine might not want to start.

But a broken vacuum advance mechanism is not going to stop your engine from starting.

[bloxman]

Some Photos for your Perusal

Looks like this Dizzy liked fishing, or How did all this Rust get in a Alloy Distributor

[bloxman]

I think you may be going down the wrong path here. I would NOT cut it off with a hack saw, at least not if you plan on reusing any parts of it

Well as you will see from the pictures it was in dire need of a rebuild. The usual story :

1) one of the ball bearings was weedling around in the muck at the bottom.

2)I Would not have been able to take apart the dizzy to clean and reaseemble it as the arm that is actuated by the Vacuum diaphram was seized in place at whatever position therefore preventing the removal of the main shaft .

Even if the vacuum advance is frozen, it's not going to prevent the engine from starting.

Couldn't agree wuth you more .

I would focus my efforts on the wiring to the dizzy, and also check the sensor and the magnets on the shaft inside.

Ya well check them pictures.

From your earlier post it sounds like you're not getting any spark.

Na it wouldn't have fired without a spark. It wouldn't stay running.

The tach hunted all over the place .

Feeling the full spark won't kill you, but it's not any fun either.)

Ya been there done that

Also, have you confirmed you have your timing set reasonably close to where it needs to be?

The car was running well not literally when I swapped Dizzies .

I diconnected the battery, removed the number 1 plug used a piece of new clean gas welding rod to verify #1 TDC, noted position of rotor with cap off.

undid the two bolts pulled up. set aside. inserted new used dizzy from zx its impossible to really get it on there bad. as the key way wont line up. installed brand new cap. transfered wires Firing order same.

Did wiring alterations as per attached Schematic Accept that that blue wire only goes to the tach and not an ecu.

But a broken vacuum advance mechanism is not going to stop your engine from starting.

I agree with ya but the general cruddy condition i think did.

Can't hurt to scrap it clean it .and bebuild it if possible.

Bloxman

[240ZMan]

So are those pictures of the unit you just bought?!

[bloxman]

Ya

Shuks!

And if ya think it looks bad then here is the clincher

Busted plastic triangle shaped piece that is sandwiched between the metal pieces of the breaker plate .

I am reasonably sure that this means that this Dizzy is Toast as I do not know what the tolerances are in how tightthat breaker plate would need to be at the spot welds.

PMO

bloxman

[beandip]

First of all , if that rusty mess of a Dist is the ZX unit , Sorry but at best it is just a core to trade in on a rebuilt unit . The bronze bushings are most likely bad as well. the breaker plate cannot be salvaged ,but they are available . I completely rebuilt my .79 ZX dist. everything but the bushings . Cost me $79.00 . If I remember correctly the breaker plate was about $45.00 but that was 3 years ago. Now for the vac advance , it's function is to advance the ignition when the vacuum is down , like when you depress the throttle. The vacuum advance will advance the timing about 8* to 18*at 650 RPM if you had the timing set at 10* at idle. The Centrifugal advance takes over from there and will advance another 17* for a total of 35 . This is from memory so I could be off a degree or so. But I do remember the 650 of centrifugal advance kicking in. So with out the vacuum advance pot, the likely hood of a hesitation at throttle opening may be experienced . Also besides the dist from a ZX you also must have the ZX part the the dist bolts on to that bolts to the block . The 240 part will not work , you wont be able to set the timing properly. Another thing , just because the welding rod showed the the piston was at TDC , but it may not have been on the compression stroke . Gary

[bloxman]

Beandip

Ah so today I went to Amazon and purchased a new rebuilt Dizzie

"Cardone Industries 31-619 Remanufactured Distributor"

apparently "on sale" for $150.00. It is unclear as to whether the matchbox is included. Hope mine is in good shape ,though with this distributors track record...

I also snagged a Borg-Warner V578 Vacuum Advance Control, it was around Forty

I figured as I 've cleaned and stripped this Dizzie to the tune of three and a half hours of my time

Adding a couple of bucks to the damage of purchasing it and having it shipped International priority at this point is I know throwing good money after bad ... but should give me a spare dizzy for whatever emergency situation arrises.

So my question to you is when you aquired your breaker plate was it new or used?

How much was it?

Where'd ya get it?

Bloxman

[=Enigma=]

I'm gonna venture a guess and say that:

A) The moisture in the dizzy from sitting uncovered in a the junk yard, or...

It was caused by a leaking diaphram which created a vacuum condition inside the casing of the dizzy which pulled in the moist air which built up inside.

I think choice A is more likely since the heat of the engine would likley evaporate moisture trapped in there faster than it could accumulate, however I guess that depends on where you live.