The Internet Z Car Club (IZCC)

[Darrel]

You can still look up your number in the member search. By location, name etc.

[Mike]

Guys, I will never let IZCC die. The mailing list may be slow because of all the forums around these days. But, Carl's website is FULL of excellent information.

If Carl ever needs help, a new host, or just moving the data around, I would be glad to help out and put it on our server for free.

FYI, our local member, Carl Beck, is the founder of IZCC.

-- Mike

PS: Our member numbers are different than IZCC.

[Mike]

I've also set up an article system on our site that supports HTML code. It is very simple to move data from one site to another using this system. Check out the samples here:

http://www.classiczcars.com/modules.php?name=Content

This method allows anyone to post an article and make it searchable in our system. The best thing about it is the HTML support -- which the forums do not support.

[Carl Beck]

Not too long ago there was a little scare that maybe the IZCC mailing list dying or dead. Well there erupted a lot of chatter about that. :paranoid:

I remember when this club began, and I remember talking to Mike about it. Anyone around then will remember it was not an easy decision for Mike and for those of us that support his effort to start this club. It was feared that a split would breakup the Z community and fragment it permanently. Well it didn't happen that way, but lots of other sites have sprung up since then. :classic:

I think and hope that Mike would agree that we should never let the IZCC lose it's status as the mother of all online Z clubs. I think we should do what we can to maintain its viability. What ever we should do will be a personal decision by each member. I just wanted to voice my opinion and bring this to the attention of those who may not know the history of the online Z community.

Hi Bryan (everyone):

It's kind of like the Big Bang - at first we were all in a fairly close, tight nit, small community "the Z Car On-Line community"(circa 85-95). Then as the universe expanded and time passed... we found ourselves spinning off in all directions, separated by light years, each in our own more unique model specific galaxy.

So Bryan - regardless of what the original members of the IZCC wanted, forces beyond their control have indeed spit up the Z Community. I don't see it coming back together again. It is now way to big and way to diverse to be of interest as a whole, to the individuals.

It has really very little to do with the technological "medium", and far more to do with Group Dynamics and Focus. Birds Of A Feather, Like Minded People, Shared Common Interest. We all like to be part of a "Group" and not of a "Crowd". When a Crowd gets too big, it splits up into smaller Groups again.. TRIBES...

To a great extent, Nissan's evolution of the Z Car really set the stage. It only took time for the on-line group to grow large enough - that smaller model specific sites could spin off and achieve critical mass and begin to grow on their own. Today that very growth in total mass, is crushing what was once "the On-line Z Car Community". Almost without exception, individuals are primarily interested in one or two generations of the Z Car.. and not really at all interested in all generations, if it means spending too much time wading through too much space noise.

It hasn't happened as completely in the physical world, but it's taking place there now as well. Where there were once "Z Car Clubs"... there are now "350-Z Clubs" and "350Z / G35 Clubs". I won't be at all surprised if we don't see "240-Z Clubs" started in the physical world as well, perhaps at the State Level more often than at the Local Level...

"The Z Car List" does have a fairly large subscriber list - so a Post there should reach a fairly large number of Z Car People. Even though the list traffic is down to a crawl many of the subscribers wanted to keep it on-line. If nothing else, it's still a method to reach a broad range of Z Car Owners, and it does represent a huge knowledge base. ... So we'll maintain it.

"The Z Car Home Page" and the "IZCC" are related but different entities...Traffic to ZHome are at an all time high and membership in the IZCC continues to grow - in spite of the apparent problems with the sign-up forms (which need to be better addressed).

Just didn't want to confuse "the Z Car List" with the Z Car Home Page nor the Internet Z Car Club...

FWIW,

Carl B.

[Carl Beck]

Guys, I will never let IZCC die. The mailing list may be slow because of all the forums around these days. But, Carl's website is FULL of excellent information.

If Carl ever needs help, a new host, or just moving the data around, I would be glad to help out and put it on our server for free.

FYI, our local member, Carl Beck, is the founder of IZCC.

-- Mike

Hi Mike (everyone):

First let me say thanks to Mike for his generous offer - and let everyone know it's not the first time he has made it. At the present time, an Internet Connection, Server Space and all support software are freely provided by several of our members. Nonetheless, as most of us know, things change over time. In fact we've moved/re-hosted both the Z Car List and the Z Car Home Page several times over the past 19 years. So I always keep offers like Mike's in mind ;-)

WARNING - LONG COMMENTS FOLLOW - feel free to skip them if you have no interest. If you haven't anything else to do - it will give you something to read while your waiting...

Carl B.

As the three distinct parts of what we call the IZCC seem to have been intermixed in this discussion, I'd like to give everyone interested a little more background - to promote an understanding of each.

Although I've been around for a long time - I'm certainly not the founder of the IZCC... only the longest running sucker, volunteered to support it.

1) Bryan is referring to the e-mail based, Z Car Discussion Group that was originally started in 1987. We call that "The Z Car List" (and it's digest form - The Z Car Digest). The original List Server was put on-line by Bob Weissman (at Boeing I believe)... because his personal e-mail distribution or copy list was getting too large, and not everyone was copied on all e-mails and replies. Today "the Z Car List" is hosted free of charge by Texas A & M University - Extension Services Dept. It's an old unix based Majordomo system...(what is old is new again).

2) The Internet Z Car Club - a virtual club started by John De Armond in 1992, among the subscribes to "the Z Car List" - with the main purpose of obtaining volume discounts for our virtual members - at various Dealerships and Vendor Locations. In the then spirit of the Internet - membership was FREE and Open to anyone on the Internet. We provided an on-line Membership Data Base - so that the vendors could easily verify membership in the virtual world (no physical membership cards at the physical Parts Counter).

3) The Z Car Home Page - originally started in Australia in 1994 by Salman Shami (an M.E.) at the University of Melbourne. The Site was moved to Princeton University when Salaman was Graduated and lost access to the Universities Servers ..then moved to our own servers when Stefanos Damianakis (Ph.D.) was Graduated from Princeton (and lost access to the Princeton Servers)...Today hosted free of charge and free of any advertising by Elie Rosenblum (an ISP).

In The Beginning:

Prior to the Z Car List - ie. the actual List Server Software being put up by Bob in 87... many of us Z Car Owners in the Aerospace and Defense industry had been using the ARPA Net and NASA's PSCNI net - to keep in touch ( I started on the ARPA Net in 73). Personally, as I traveled to various Prime and Sub contractor sites around the Country - working on various A&D Programs and Projects - I keep track of the other Z Car owners I meet - and kept in touch via text messages (on TTY's between/among main frames and super-mini's) and later e-mail on Personal Computers.. We all needed technical questions answered, sources for parts and good used cars... and we all keep our own contact lists etc.

As the DoD ARPA (Advanced Research Projects Agency) Net opened up to become what we know as the "Internet".. the next major user group was mostly located at Colleges and Universities - and usually first in the Engineering/Scientific Colleges (Post Grad. then Under Grad). There we found growing numbers of younger guys - that were just trying to keep their old Z's running as daily transportation... Loved their Z Cars.. but were far from having the funds to Race nor Restore them... Most of them simply could not afford to take their Z's to a professional mechanic, let alone a Dealership. So us older owners, found a group of younger owners that shared our love for the Z's.. and who provided an outlet for our "experience".. The main goal was to help them fix their own cars. (which is one of the main beauties of the 240-Z's).

As the World Wide Web developed - Wide Area Information Servers (WAIS) and the World Wide Web Servers / Browsers followed...That and the continued opening of the Internet then brought the masses on line. By 1993 the IZCC had about 350 members, by 1995 a 1000 members. By 1999, 6000 members, by 2001, 10,000 members..by 2003, 13,000 and by 2006, 15,000. (about twice the membership of all Local Z Car Clubs combined).

Of course the Internet then spread around the world - and today we have members in over 40 different Countries as well as within the USA.

OK - So Lets Back Up to around 1995.

Growing as we were - we wanted to more formally pull the three entities above - into a more comprehensive whole. So a rather large group of IZCC Members were volunteered to define the future direction of the "virtual club" and its resources.

The Z Car Home Page: The Group decided that "the Z Car Home Page" should be a source of information for Z Car Owners. NOT a source of entertainment, not a commercial development... So , no "eye candy", and strictly "Internet Standards Based"... ie no Vendor Proprietary formats/software. As all data/information and articles were freely donated to the Z Car Home Page - the members did not want any commercial interest profiting, from the work so freely given. So NO ADVERTISING. Additionally, to preclude conflicts of interests between the members good and commercial vendors interests - we would take no Sponsorship Funding from commercial interests either.

All information/data collected and possible future growth forecast - was then divided into seven main Sections - and the Sections then subdivided... the goal was to establish a structure within which one could to get to any information/data - within three levels of decomposition. KISS - keep it simple stupid - and get me to the information I'm looking for.!

By 1998 - the Z Car List was sending about 65 to 85 Posts/Replies per day (to aprox. 2300 subscribers) - and many members were complaining that it was simply too much e-mail, most of which any one of them, didn't want to read. The use of Subject <tags> was supposed to allow everyone to easily sort, store or delete unwanted Posts/Replies within their e-mail clients. Nonetheless - Model or Interest specific sub-groups started to split off. Z31.com, 240-Z.org, HybridZ.org, TwinTurbo.net. That was then followed by all manor of attempts to start Z Car Sights/Forums.. ZCar.com, ZDriver.com etc etc.

So at that point the Z Car Community had indeed fractured - split itself into smaller special interest groups. Nonetheless, IZCC Members like Bryan, wanted to keep the IZCC as a group that supported ALL Generations of Z Cars. As well as to preserve the huge knowledge base that subscribers to the Z Car List represented. It also provides a link to the broader Z Car Community than any individual model specific site can offer. So promotions for the annual ZCCA (Z Car Club Association) Annual Convention, the Motorsports Auto West Coast Nationals - and many Local Z Car Club shows and events - get published on the Z Car List as well.

The IZCC Membership data base - provided the ability to find other Z Car People in local areas - and to reach them via E-Mail. In that manor several Local Z Car Clubs were formed in the Physical World. An unexpected side benefit of the data base.. but it turned out to be an important contribution to the Z Car Community at large.

Today - I am reviewing the purpose, scope and usefulness of all three parts. We've talked about "the Z Car List"... and I'll be reconsidering the purpose and structure of the Z Car Home Page. It's original intent was to be a single source on the Web for Z Car related data, information etc. It was expected many years ago - that many people would volunteer to both build and maintain various Sections of the site. Indeed in many cases that happened... and in too many cases it didn't. So over the next year I'll be going through the site - and based on usage and access statistics - I'll be deleting or trimming a lot of sections/articles etc that are no longer supported by their originators - or which can be found elsewhere at the Model Specific Sights.

Anyone can build their own Web Sites today (something not really anticipated in 95) - and do so in any manor they wish. With ever improved search engines, anyone can find just about anything any where. So the need for a centralized data/information repository seems at first glance to be to have been made obsolete...The problem then becomes Quantity vs Quality. A centralized focus of thousands of members, assures that the data/information held there is reviewed by many and corrected where necessary. Something all to any individual sites lack completely...

It is an evolving universe...Being somewhat older and I hope wiser now - I've found that slower, better thought out moves yeild the best results in the long run. Nothing is going to change too quickly.. but change is a part of the evolution in the Information Age.

I appreciate all your thoughts and comments -

FWIW,

Carl B.

[=Enigma=]

Very intresting to hear the evolution of the various Z car information sites/service in relation to the growth of the Internet and the effect that this had on the Z car community. Thanks for sharing this history with us and for managing to keep the Z Car Home site up all these years. I hope that it continues to be the quality source of information that I have found it to be since I became a member of the community just over a year ago.

Cheers,

Adam

[Carl Beck]

I belonged to the mail list years ago and quit because of the endless emails on subjects I had no interest. I still visit the site from time to time. But, quite frankly it does not have what I am looking for these days.

I too have registered my car there only thing is the numbers are not correct tried to get it fixed no go so far oh well.

Hi Jim:

Copied below is the data dump from the - on line input form - as I receive it from the Web Site. When you or anyone fill out the form, the raw data from the input form - is e-mailed to me.

I then extract the relevant data - and enter it into the html document - that displays the Classic Z Car Registers.

NOTE only input forms that are COMPLETE make it to the Classic Z Car Register... Lots of people fail to input their Original Engine Serial Numbers - - so nothing happens with that input...(not the case with your input - it was complete).

The data as received looks like this:

- - - Begin copy - - - - - - - -

Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2005 16:44:12 -0800 (Pacific Standard Time)

From: "Jim Coffey" <a7dzcar@thewiredcity.net>

To: <beck@becksystems.com>

Subject: Form posted from Microsoft Internet Explorer.

The following document was sent as an embedded object but not referenced by the email above:

temp=temp&mizccno=11142&mORIG=&mvin=HLS30-06160&bdmonth=6&bdyear=1970&colorcode=918&ext-int-color=Orange%2Fblack&engine_ser=009502&mcomm=Car+was+originally+purchased+from+Hoyt+Datsun+or+Hoyt+Motors+do+not+remember+which+one+in+Auburn%2CWA+by+an+Air+Force+Captain.+He+traded+it+in+Dec.+of+1975+at+Monroe+Street+Datsun+in+Spokane+Wa.+I+bought+it+Dec.1975+and+have+owned+it+ever+since.+%0D%0A&mname=James&mlname=Coffey&memail=a7dzcar@thewiredcity.net&mcity=Tacoma&mstate=WA&mctry=USA&mpub=yes+please

- - - - end copy - -- - -

I drop out the ASCII characters - and get it ready to put into the html document.

IZCC# 11142

HLS30-06160

06 / 70

918 Orange

L24 009502

James Coffey

Tocama, WA USA

a7dzcar@thewiredcity.net

Searching my e-mail files for either your Name, or the VIN - I have received only the one input from you shown above. (did find several e-mails from you related to springs) If you'll let me know what numbers are not correct - I'll be glad to fix them.

Checking the IZCC Membership Data Base - I do see that your e-mail address is different there, from the one listed on your input form for the Classic Z Car Register.

You can e-mail me directly at beck@becksystems.com

FWIW,

Carl B.

[a7dz]

Carl;

It did get updated last December my mistake. I remember sending you the L 24 serial number as I started the rebuild thanksgiving last year.