New "F" car on Ebay

[Carl Beck]

It appears that the statements came from the eBay ad that started this thread.

Hi Chris:

Yes - I just wondered where the Dealer found it - I doubt he worte it himself. I thought perhaps you might have ran across the original writting in your research on the VZ's.

Carl B.

[mars23z]

X-ray now thats funny

[Montezuma]

Carl and Will you guys should get together and write a book on the history of everything Z. That was an aewsome debate very informative where do you guys find all the knowledge? Very impressive. I think it would a best seller!!

I was thinking the same thing, I think if Carl wrote a book it would be very interesting, I would buy it. He could get contributing sources from Chris, and Alan from England amongest the other very knowledgable contributors on this board. Us PA guys think alot alike...(grow up in PA, moved to Cali when I joined the navy over 20 some years ago). Seriously, Carl think about writing a book about all things Z, it history, myths and legends, make it a coffee table type with great pictures and personalities. One last note, Alan that was some great funny stuff you did....loved it.

[JLPurcell]

See the first post in this thread ...

:nervous: It is preferred that these cars be referred to as program cars instead of the "F" word. Lets not get that debate going againLOL .

[26th-Z]

Carl,

I might have RUN across something like what was written, but the dead give-away was the reference to parts Nissan has access to that we don't - wrong! One of the major reasons that the Vintage Z restoration program ended prematurely was because of a shortage of parts. How do you doubt that the seller wrote the text?

[ta240]

Can you tell us where the following statement came from?

To be honest I don't remember where I got the text from when I setup the page so he may have gotten it from the same source but it appears to be a cut and paste from my site:

http://geocities.com/z-car/rebuild.html

Right down to the large bold first letter for each paragraph.

Of course he didn't put any of the parts with typos so I can't be sure!

I'll have to dig through my old paperwork to see if I find anything like it.

-Trevor

http://geocities.com/z-car/

[Carl Beck]

To be honest I don't remember where I got the text from when I setup the page so he may have gotten it from the same source but it appears to be a cut and paste from my site:

Ah... thanks Trevor.. I knew I had read that somewhere before....

Carl B.

[ta240]

actually he did cut and paste, unless they really did replace "busings" on the cars

Typos, the watermark of the web artist

-Trevor

[ta240]

For anyone that is interested I managed to find the Nissan brochure that Courtesy Nissan sent me way back when. My scanner is dead so I had to take pictures of it so sorry for the poor quality.

[Arne]

...articles written about the Vintage Zs describe them as “factory” restored insinuating to the uninformed reader that the cars were returned to the original Japanese factory for restoration. One article appeared in the June 1998 issue of “Road & Track” magazine entitled; “ Datsun 240Z, Factory Resurrected”. Interestingly, Douglas Kott reports a price of $29,950 which may have been the case 12 months after the Z-Store program began.

Poor Douglas Kott. Raked over the coals for using copy that was probably handed to him by Nissan's media flacks.

Actually, Kott wrote two articles for R&T on the 240Z in the late '90s. The first one was in the Feb. 1997 issue, and was a Salon article about a yellow Series 1 that was refurbished by Pierre' Z. (Don't ask me to point out all the non-original parts visible in he pictures, there's a pile of them. Still a nice car, though.) In that article, Kott mentions Pierre's involvement in the program near the end. "...in fact, Nissan has appointed his firm as one of the shops to restore early Z-cars that will be sold through Nissan dealerships." A totally accurate statement, other than possibly the strict use of the word 'restore' - some would prefer the word 'refurbish'.

The second article is the above mentioned profile on the program cars. Besides the article's title ("Datsun 240Z, Factory Resurrected"), in the last paragraph he refers to the cars as " factory-refurbished". In that same paragraph he calls them "factory-authorized" which is pretty much correct. The rest of the article makes no claims about the the factory-ness of the program. And since he probably got most of that wording from the Nissan flacks, I don't think I'll hold it against him.

[HS30-H]

Poor Douglas Kott. Raked over the coals for using copy that was probably handed to him by Nissan's media flacks.

I for one do not apologise for taking anybody to task on this point, and I will be surprised if one of "Nissan's media flacks" as you call them ( surely you mean hacks? ) actually wrote the dreaded couplet "Factory-restored" in any of their press releases or advertising brochures. If you have any evidence, then I'd be interested to see it.

I've mentioned before when discussing this subject that I have actually met and conversed with people who were convinced that these cars were sent back to Japan to be restored in the factory that originally made them. Amazing. One of these people was a motoring journalist himself, and continued spawning the mistake through his own misunderstanding. It appears that the root cause of the misunderstanding was not directly from NMC USA or the advertising company that they employed ( Chiat/Day Advertising North America I believe ) but from people outside the 'Vintage Z Program' who were not thinking about what they were writing and saying.

We have now reached the stage, more than ten years after the events in question, where certain people are engaged in trying to justify the mistake and make it - in some way - more true ( just look at post #22 on this thread ). What a farce.

Besides the article's title ("Datsun 240Z, Factory Resurrected"), in the last paragraph he refers to the cars as " factory-refurbished". In that same paragraph he calls them "factory-authorized" which is pretty much correct. The rest of the article makes no claims about the the factory-ness of the program. And since he probably got most of that wording from the Nissan flacks, I don't think I'll hold it against him.

That's a perfect example of the way this rolling stone gathers its moss, isn't it? I don't see how Kott could have justified the use of the terms "factory refurbished" and "Factory Resurrected" in the same paragraph as he wrote "factory-authorized", and the terms arguably contradict eachother anyway. The layman and casual enthusiast would easily be misled by such language, and it seems to me that NMC USA and the advertising / publicity company they employed consciously avoided trying to do that ,whilst making an effort to bring home the point that this was an official NMC USA project that had the blessing and support of Nissan Japan.

I have some sympathy for NMC USA and the people behind the project, as well as their advertisers and publicity people. I can imagine they had a somewhat delicate situation on their hands to describe and explain this project properly, considering that the original cars were designed, engineered and made in Japan. I also think it might be enlightening for some of the people that write on this subject if they were to try and put themselves in the position of the people that actually designed, engineered and produced these cars in the first place ( yes - in Japan ) and tried to imagine this project being viewed from that perspective. Especially when the word "Factory" is thrown around so lightly.

Chris Wenzel's excellent report on the 'Vintage Z Restoration Program' contains the following quote, which he repeated in this very thread ( post #18 ):

"Two articles written about the Vintage Zs describe them as "factory" restored insinuating to the uninformed reader that the cars were returned to the original Japanese factory for restoration."

And that's it in a nutshell. I personally believe that the people involved in this project were at pains to avoid that very insinuation, whilst being faced with the problem of getting across the point that this was indeed a project that had the blessing of the company that originally built the cars ( with all that is implied by that ). As usual, it is the people on the outside that blur the lines between fact and fiction..........

Alan T.

[26th-Z]

Thanks for the comment, Arne. The article was reprinted by Nissan for promotional purposes. I didn't mean to diss Douglas Kott, or any writer for that matter. There are few direct associations with the word "factory" in any of the literature I have collected on the Vintage Z subject. But they exist. Nissan, of course, wanted thier restoration efforts to pack credibility. It is easy to see how one might get the impression that the cars were actually sent back to Japan to be restored. The businesses chosen to actually restore the cars were promoted to a certain degree in order to support the validity of the program.

But thanks to the conversation I am looking at my research again; making some changes and updating some files. Quite fun to look back through all this again! My current working bibliography on the subject:

Nissan Motor Corporation Related Publications and Documents

“10 Nissan Retailers Selected to Host Z Stores”, from website www.nissannews.com, 20 November 1996.

“240Z Restoration Program Quality Control Checklist”; January 8, 1997.

“Datsun 240Z – Japan Reinvents the Sports Car”; (reprinted from Road & Track, February 1997).

“Datsun 240Z Sports Owner’s Manual – Model S30 Series”, Issued Date: March 1997 (161100)

“Greetings from the Z-Store at Nissan Corporate!”; Z-Store letterhead, Z Store.doc, no date (late ’97, 25 cars produced).

“Hand written note from Pete Evanow to Bob Berke”, on Pan Pacific Hotel letterhead, no date.

“News Coverage as of May 27, 1997”, market survey compilation..

“Inside Nissan – Heritage”; from website www.nissanusa.com, January 2005.

Magazine advertisement (fold-out format) “First Solid Food”, 1997

Magazine advertisement “No Cup Holders”, TBWA Chiat/Day Inc.1997

Magazine advertisement (Slick) “The most popular…”, no date.

“Nissan Proudly Presents – Vintage Z”; announcement and site map, May 3, 1997.

“Nissan Z Store Merchandise Catalog”, Flyer # CAR412965

“Popular 240Z Restoration Parts”; Parts and Service Bulletin, April 30, 1998.

“Rebirth”; brochure, 1997.

“Restored 1970 Nissan 240Z Sells for $33,920 at Monterey Sports and Classic Car Auction”; 22 August 1997.

“Spirit”; brochure, 1997.

“To Our Z-Club Members”, letter from Pete Evanow, Manager, Z-Store, Z-Store letterhead, Z Shutdown\Signoff.doc, October 30, 1998.

“Vintage Datsun 240-Z Sales Invoice”, HLS30-96203

“Vintage Datsun 240-Z Sales Invoice”, HLS30-80067

“Vintage Datsun 240-Z Certificate of Authenticity”, HLS30-96203

“Vintage Z Quality Control Launch Rally”; May 3, 1997. Letter from Tom Orbe, Vice President Marketing, registration form, preliminary schedule of events.

“Vintage Z Program-Master Parts List”, inter-office correspondence / spreadsheet, February 20, 1997.

“Z Store” Dealer Kit, November 13, 1996.

“Z Car Parts Shipments, by Part no. & by VIN (Closed)”, spreadsheet, May 27, 1998.

Publications from Independent Sources

“240Z Restore Project by Nissan in USA”; Nostalgic Hero magazine, vol. 64, December 1997.

“A Classic Reborn”, PPG Repaint Reporter, 1998

“A Once and Always Legend”, Sport Compact Car magazine, January 1997

“Back to Its Rootz”, Automotive News, October 28, 1996

“Cartoon”, Automotive News, November 4, 1996

“Datsun 240Z, Factory Resurrected”, Road & Track magazine, June 1998

“Datsun 240Z Sports Classic”, Nostalgic Hero magazine Geibin Mooks No. 471, 2004

“eBay Motors.com”, sales auction, November 2004

“eBay Motors.com”, sales auction, March 2005

“eBay Motors.com”, sales auction, May 2005

Excerpts from Z-Car Club of Washington newsletters -

“No New Z For A While”; Marc Sayer

“Reconditioned 240Z’s”; Barry Breen

“Ground-up Rebuild”; Phil Deushane, IAPA

“Restored vs. Refurbished”; Carl Beck

“Later Z”; reprinted from Autoweek, March 23-29, 1998 vol. 48, no. 12

“Vintage Z’s Get New Pizzazz”; reprinted from Automotive News, Mark Retchin, March 10, 1997

“New-Old Z’s”; Steve Klepinger

”If You Wait Long Enough”; reprinted from PR Newswire, 1997

“New-Old Z-Cars”; Barry Breen

“Update: 240Z Restoration Program”; Rex Jennet

“Z-Store Opening”; Bob Bailey

“History-Making Vintage Nissan Rally”; Z Car magazine, Rick Feibusch, Summer 1997

“Life’s a Journey”, Sport Compact Car magazine, December 1996

“Lust, Then Love – The Story of the New Z”, Ron Sessions, Publications International, Ltd., 2002

“Obsolete Nissan Parts Availability”; NewZletter, Z-Car Club of Washington, March 1998.

“The Rebirth of the Legendary 240Z”; Old Timer (Japanese text), no. 34, June 1997.

“The Way They Were”; Sports Car International magazine, August / September 1997.

“Restored Datsun 240Zs Take a Step Back In Time”; Newsday, November 23, 1997.

“Restore Your Z”; The NewZletter, Wayne Karnes, May / June 1998.

“Restoring a Vintage Vehicle”, Enjoy the Ride.com, 2004

“Return of the Living”, Classic Cars magazine, August 1997.

“Sports Car Chronicle”, Publications International, Ltd. 2004

“Tokyo Survives Another Typhoon, But What About “Mad”s Recent Visit??”; unknown, letter to ZCCA from Mike Taylor.

“U.S. Paint Code List”, http://datsunprojects.org/zpaintcodes/

“Vintage Z Car Register”; IZCC website – www.zhome.com.

“Vintage Z – Road Impression in L.A.”; J’s Tipo (Japanese text), no. 61, February 1998.

“What Comes After Z…Store?”, Z Bits Maryland ‘Z Club, Paul Taylor, March / April 1999

“Z-Car: Future Classic?”, Z Car Magazine, Fall 1996

“Z Day at Texas Motor Speedway”; Z Car Magazine, Bill Reagan, November / December 1997.

“Z-Speed”; Unique Cars, Howard Walker, October 1997.

“Z-Store Update”; Z Car Magazine, Marc Sayer, Spring 1997.

“Z-Store Update”; Z Car Magazine, Marc Sayer, Summer 1997.

Films

“Nissan Intro Spots / “Dream Garage” – Life is a Journey. Enjoy the Ride. Nissan Brand Campaign 1996, vhs/dvd

“Nissan Z Store” – KNBC 2/15/97 and KABC 2/18/97 vhs

“The Return of the 240Z (The restoration Process). TRT, no date, vhs

Pierre Perrot, no title, no date(s), self produced video of events surrounding the Vintage Z program. vhs

“Birth of a Legend” – Nissan Motor Corporation, USA: 1997, vhs/dvd