Driving Lights

[Bulldog Z]

Anyone have any thoughts about some driving lights for my 73 240Z. I have seen some hellas at black dragon and I also have seen some at the cibie web site as well. I do have a front air dam with vents for the brakes. Where is the best place to mount the driving lights. Which lights are better hellas or ciebies?

[Nigel1943]

There is no best place to mount lights on a Z. Fitted anywhere near or on the existing bumper interfers with the opening of the hood. There are basically two alternatives, remove the grill and mount them well back near the radiator or fit a drop-bar, ie cut a section out of the centre of the bumper and drop it down on new brackets welded to the existing ends. This is what most rally car boys do for round lights. Dont know about rectangular lights, you may be able to squeeze them in. Cibie's probably have the edge over Hella's.

[DaveN]

Back then the original bumpers had fog/driving light mounting holes on the under side some 3-4 inches inside each overrider. That was the usual mounting point. Lights there looked good, but functionality was compromised.

Driving lights work best mounted high to minimize shadows where there are dips in the road. Pro rally cars have their driving lights above the bumper or on the roof. But... the pros use ther driving lights to supplement 1 or 2 pairs of Euro style hi/low beam headlights like those on p. 61 of the Black Dragon catalog. The high beams are broad enough to light the shoulders and sweeping bends is enough out to about 1/2 mile, and the low beams are also much brighter, more uniform, and better controlled than sealed beams. Driving lights extend the visibility range to 1 mile plus, but only straight ahead and for 3-4 degrees on either side (the greater the range, the narrower the beam).

Fog lights need to be as far as possible from the drivers eyeball level to minimize the amount of light reflected back into the driver's eyes. Under the bumper is better than headlight level, down at the chin spoiler is better still. In really thick fog they also have to be used instead of the headlights (which are too near eye level in a Z). That's illegal in the US, but in a pea soup fog it's the only way that works -- the laws of physics trump the laws of Congress.

If you don't already have them either Cibie or Hella replacement headlights will give the most useable improvement over sealed beams. Both companies also make good driving and fog lights. I can't say if either is better today. (Cibie was a bit better in the 70's, and my 72 Z is still running 75 vintage Cibie Z-beams.) Either way use clear (white) bulbs. Your eyes see yellow and green best, and "bonehead blue" bulbs absorb some of the yellow. A heavy duty wiring harness is a good idea with the standard 55/60w bulb -- headlight fuses blow occasionally without it and the voltage drop through stock wiring steals more light than you might think. Heavy duty wiring is essential if the original wiring has deteriorated or if you want to upgrade to 80/100w (illegal on the street) H4 bulbs.

[Arne]

Dave speaks the truth, I agree with his post 100%. While driving lights will definitely light up the road in a straight line, best bang for the buck are good quality E-code headlights.

I've been using E-code lights exclusively (mostly H4, a few dual H1) in every vehicle I've owned since 1976. In the 7" round size the Zs use, I have personal experience with Marchal, Cibié (pre-Z-Beam, Z-beam and BOBI), Bosch, Hella, Carello, Lucas, Wipac, Stanley and Neolite. While the Marchal and Cibié were both quite good, all of the best I've ever used (in any size/shape) have been Hella. Good range, and the most even, shadow-free pattern. So if improved lighting is the goal, I recommend Hella. In my experience, Hellas have lasted longer than Cibiés as well. I've had several sets of old Cibiés where the reflectors rusted. Never have had that problem with a Hella. Hellas are also easier to find here in the USA these days.

[TomoHawk]

Concerning the use of driving lights...

Do most states allow you to use them alone, or do they need to be hooked into the high-beams? Or are there some other stipulations that go along with the type and/or wattage of the lights?

thxZ

Edited June 28, 2009 by TomoHawk

[texasz]

Concerning the use of driving lights...

Do most states allow you to use them alone, or do they need to be hooked into the high-beams? Or are there some other stipulations that go along with the type and/or wattage of the lights?

thxZ

May be a state by state issue as with many things (i.e. radar detectors, front license plates, window tint, etc). So that said it may be hard to get an answer for what most states do. Unless you are moving you may consider just focusing on what your state requires as they will be the ones you have to deal with for inspections. If you do what most states allow and you live in a state that is different you'll run in to troubles.

[Carl Beck]

Driving lights extend the visibility range to 1 mile plus, but only straight ahead and for 3-4 degrees on either side (the greater the range, the narrower the beam).

Gee.... a mile - - who makes them?

One Mile = 1609m / 5280 ft.

According to CIBIE their light patterns are:

CIBIE OSCAR 460mtr / 1509ft.

Super OSCAR 750mtr / 2450ft.

OSCAR XENON {HID} 1200m / 3937ft

If you don't already have them either Cibie or Hella replacement headlights will give the most useable improvement over sealed beams.

That may very well be true. Not to be picky but a few extra comments.

I'll just add that we should not confuse terms by comparing halogen headlights with sealed beam headlights. Today - both replaceable bulb and sealed beam type halogen headlights are legal and available in the US. Both sealed beam and replaceable bulb type headlights are made by Cibie and Hella as well as others.

No question in my mind that the replaceable bulb type headlights from CIBIE/HELLA come with better reflectors and higher grade directional glass. The question is; "how much better do you really need and is the extra price worth the extra benefit?"

The halogen headlights offered in a sealed beam format in Auto Parts Stores are about $18.00 each and they offer a pretty good upgrade to the original headlights on our Z's. Hella for example offers a sealed beam halogen headlight at around $49.00 each...

The replaceable bulb types - with the better reflectors and lead glass directional lens are around $75.00 each. Of course both CIBIE and HELLA offer less expensive, and lower quality units in the $45.00 each range as well.

Sadly today just because it bares a known brand name, doesn't mean you are buying "the best". You also want to assure that the units you are buying are made for use in your country - the directional lens are cut for either "Right Hand Drive" or "Left Hand Drive".... {so watch what you buy on E-Bay}.

FWIW,

Carl B.

[=Enigma=]

Concerning the use of driving lights...

Do most states allow you to use them alone, or do they need to be hooked into the high-beams? Or are there some other stipulations that go along with the type and/or wattage of the lights?

thxZ

As texasz said, this is up to state law and may vary from state to state. Here in California the law concerning auxillary lights is as follows:

Auxiliary Driving and Passing Lamps

24402. (a) Any motor vehicle may be equipped with not to exceed two auxiliary driving lamps mounted on the front at a height of not less than 16 inches nor more than 42 inches. Driving lamps are lamps designed for supplementing the upper beam from headlamps and may not be lighted with the lower beam.

( Any motor vehicle may be equipped with not to exceed two auxiliary passing lamps mounted on the front at a height of not less than 24 inches nor more than 42 inches. Passing lamps are lamps designed for supplementing the lower beam from headlamps and may also be lighted with the upper beam.

If you're really interested, I recommend checking with your state's DMV site.

http://www.bmv.ohio.gov/

Edited June 28, 2009 by =Enigma=

[TomoHawk]

Passing lamps?

Another reason why I'm interested is because I see a LOT of sporty cars, SUVs/trucks and 'performance' cars with the lamps (UNDER the front bumper) on, sans headlights. Then there are the 4x4s with the light bar of the roof...

I'll put my tape-measure in the car and measure a few SUVs, which typically have them in the lower corners of the front, below the bumper. I'm not so sure they are between 16 - 24 inches off the ground, but I'm not in CA either. I would think that other states would be similar.

I don't really see how having driving lights (ie., ones with clear lenses) below the bumper would help in illuminating the road beyond about 100 feet, anyway. you'd need them above the bumper on an S30.

Responsible drivers have the lights hooked up to the high-beams.

I will see if there is anything in my state.

thxZ

[texasz]

Passing lamps?

Another reason why I'm interested is because I see a LOT of sporty cars, SUVs/trucks and 'performance' cars with the lamps (UNDER the front bumper) on, sans headlights. Then there are the 4x4s with the light bar of the roof...

I'll put my tape-measure in the car and measure a few SUVs, which typically have them in the lower corners of the front, below the bumper. I'm not so sure they are between 16 - 24 inches off the ground, but I'm not in CA either. I would think that other states would be similar.

I don't really see how having driving lights (ie., ones with clear lenses) below the bumper would help in illuminating the road beyond about 100 feet, anyway. you'd need them above the bumper on an S30.

Responsible drivers have the lights hooked up to the high-beams.

I will see if there is anything in my state.

thxZ

Really? This is new information to you? Sorry, I know that sounds really nasty...I'm just taken back that you have not noticed ALL new autos have day-time running lights (DRL as is often indicated on the window sticket or equipment list). Now this may be an option or standard equipment, it's there on new cars in one way or another (i.e. maybe not all new cars have them if they are optional equipment).

In any case, the day-time running lights are intended to ALWAYS be on and make autos on the road more visible no matter what the conditions. They are not so much for the driver's ability to see the road as it is other drivers to see the auto (i.e. most people fail/forget to turn on their headlights in rain). Now at night they do help the driver see the road a little better.

They are by no means fog lights though, those are completely different and have the yellow lens.

Not sure if this helps or not, hopefully it does. And seriously, no disrespect is meant by the way I started this post so please do not take it that way.

[TomoHawk]

No, not the daytime running lights, auxiliary driving lights. I have noticed the DRLs, especially on trucks. The DRLs are usually part of the headlamp unit, and aren't standard on all new cars. The auxiliary lights are elsewhere, like the lower corners.

Edited June 29, 2009 by TomoHawk

[Arne]

Lots of newer trucks (especially GM) have moved the DRL out of the headlights and down low on the bumper/valance. Very common these days.