Factory Restored 240Z's

[bobc]

Doug,

Wasn't your car actually owned by the President of Nissan USA at the time? And I believe it was stored in the museum not a warehouse.

I actually told Pete the number for the VIN in his book didn't belong to a VZ car. He was a bit surprised at first, but called his sources at Nissan who researched Doug's car and that's when the story of an Admiral owning it surfaced. Carl can come in here anytime, but I believe that's why some believe there are only 37 VZ cars, but I think Pete believes he just got one of the numbers wrong and there are 38.

Bob

[Carl Beck]

Doug,

This sort of "double standard" is somewhat amusing to me. Is Evanow's list the final word or is it not?

Hi Chris:

It may be years before we have a "final word".

I really don't see an honest mistake, recognized and corrected as indicative of the entire list being less creditable. So no - I don't see a "double standard" of belief or disbelief being applied. Simply a matter of working to verify the cars on the only list that we have.

At this point, at least 28 of the 37 remaining on the list, after DougN's Z was taken off - have been found to be correct. No VZ's have been found to date that are not on Mr. Evanow's list.

Could one or two show up later? Sure... but until it does, 37 is the best number as far as I'm concerned and Mr. Evanow's list is the only one we have to work with and so far it's proven to be pretty accurate. If not perfect it is the best available evidence at this point.

Is it the final word? Right now its the only word, from anyone directly involved, who made a serious effort to account for them all and publish the VIN's.

And to add fuel to the fire, I have serial numbers from Nissan published documentation that are not on Evanow's list. I think you have yourself a real prize, Doug.

CW-

Far more than 37 240-Z's were purchased by Nissan for the Program - but many of them were simply parted out, some were beyond reasonable repair, and some were left unfinished when the program came to an end. Mark at Datsun Alley purchased all remaining parts cars, body shells that were in several of the body shops used, as well as huge quantities of new parts accumulated for the program.

A friend of mine just sold one of the bodies he had used for a race car, that he purchased from Datsun Alley, after the VZ Program came to an end. Mark said he thought he had about a dozen or more body shells / parts-cars, that he purchased from Nissan at the end of the VZ Program. Another friend of ours used one of the shells to restore one of his cars, then another was sold some years ago on E-Bay along with the spare parts needed to put a car together..

Perhaps some of the VIN's you have recorded were from some of the donor cars or body shells not used. You might want to publish them so we can all start looking for them as well.

FWIW,

Carl B.

[Carl Beck]

I actually told Pete the number for the VIN in his book didn't belong to a VZ car. He was a bit surprised at first, but called his sources at Nissan who researched Doug's car and that's when the story of an Admiral owning it surfaced. Carl can come in here anytime, but I believe that's why some believe there are only 37 VZ cars, but I think Pete believes he just got one of the numbers wrong and there are 38.

Hi Bob:

When he was working on finalizing his book; Mr. Evanow went to the Nissan Storage Facility to see what Vintage Z's were still there. Because when he left Nissan's employ, he knew some of them had been retained by Nissan. There in the dimly lit environment, the dust and dirt covered cars were crammed in side by side. Four stock looking 240-Z's were setting together, so Mr. Evanow took the VIN's off them, believing them to all be Vintage Z's.

As it turned out one of them was not. I know this because we were more or less constant communication during that period. The picture below was taken "after" the storage facility had been opened up and most of the stored vehicles had been rolled out of the way, but you can see the thick dust on a couple of the 240-Z's still sitting there. Look at the thick dust on the white Z!

As mentioned, when Nissan was moving their H.Q. they decided to sell off many of the cars they had warehoused, so they opened the storage facility and as they cleared the cars and boxes etc out - blew the dust and dirt off the cars - they found that the car DougN has, was not a VZ. Just prior to that, even the people working at Nissan thought they had 4 VZ's that they were going to sell. Recall the initial note put out to the Z Car community via Paul G of the ZCCA?

Anyway - that put the number down from 38 to 37. I had reported in error a friends VZ VIN... of course it did not show up on Mr. Evanows list. The car had the VZ Plaque, window decal and it looked the part in every physical sense. So Mr. Evanow may have thought the number was back at 38. In effect one taken off the list and one added.

Oops.. my mistake! Upon verification it turned out the car I had reported, once the correct VIN was obtained - was in fact on Mr. Evanows list. So the number is back at 37.

Toward the end of the Program - Nissan Press Releases and some of the Nissan employees interviewed by the media were saying that "about" or "something like" 40 cars had been completed. It is my present belief that they were simply rounding the number up - not really knowing what the final number would be and the number 40 stuck in everyone's mind.

It just strikes me as odd that to-date, not one VZ has shown up - that isn't on Mr. Evanows list. Not that we haven't been trying to find more...

FWIW,

Carl B.

FWIW,

Carl B.

[26th-Z]

Carl, you make me smile.

Don't you see that no matter what your explanation is, the list is not accurate? No, Pete's list is NOT the only published list. I'm looking for cars that parts were purchased for:

HLS30-11416

HLS30-11553

HLS30-01613

HLS30-27464

HLS30-03022

HLS30-05779

[26th-Z]

Perhaps I should add to my post above - explanation. I have a Nissan document (an accounting document) from the program that shows part purchases for the VZ cars by VIN. It is dated May 23, 1997 and lists 25 cars. Of those 25, 15 are on Evanow's list. Of the 10 remaining, the VINs I listed show significant part purchases; enough to make me believe that these cars were restored. May 97 was early in the program and to be on the list that early would indicate that they were not parted out. The other 3 do not have purchase quantities and data entry. This accounting document is 18 pages long and lists over 800 different part by number. There is a lot to glean from the information. First is the idea that the Vintage Z restoration program was a part replacement restoration process. Thus we can accept the idea of incorrect part application to model year. Another is the vast number of replacement parts that went into the restoration - and the resulting cost.

[bobc]

Chris,

You don't have to look for HLS30011553 any longer. It's listed in Carl's web site, in Pete's book and resides in my garage from time to time when it's not in storage....

If you have any records related to it, I would greatly appreciate getting copies and would be happy to reimburse you for any costs to do so.

Regards,

Bob

[26th-Z]

Yep! It's that easy to cross up all these VIN numbers and stuff. Sorry. I'm not looking for your car Bob.

[Mckrack]

Many of the VZ cars were not very good so I must disagree with some here. Unless you think the wrong interior parts and sub par paint and some other issues constitutes a compleely restored to factory specifications good. I will accept a two stage paint job, but wrong seats and other things. No way.

[Mckrack]

What's the matter all of a sudden every one agrees with me. No dissenting comments? lololololololololololololololololololololololololololo