Newbie with typical newbie questions

[cdnzee]

Hello Z members, it's a pleasure for me to be among this group. I have a short story and a few questions to run by you guys....

I bought a classic car,eventhough I don't know anymore than I did in high school automotive class. But I figured "Hey - you're getting married, soon you're gonna need a reason to get out of the house and a reason to stay out." Maybe some of you can relate. So I bought a 1972 Datsun 240z. After seeing one on the autotrader in Canada, test drove it and a week later I bought one that was half the price. The major difference was that the second had more surface rust on the bumper and the floor pans were bondo-ed, but on the good side the engine workwas performed at a z specialist garage.

That was over three years ago - and it's been sitting ever since. I guess the marriage is going better than I forecasted.

Well it hasn't started in the last two years i got tired of smelling the fumes, and now it won't start.

My question is "can anyone help? and better yet is there any Z enthusiast in the GTA that wouldn't mind making a trek to learn a little more about this car?

I live in Mississauga, and I have seen one in the Lakeshore area and two in Brampton if you are out there please let me know"

Thanks for the help in advance.

Roy

[Zak's Z]

Hey,

I live by Wonderland just north of the city. Ihave a '72 also, but I'm restoring it so I havn't driven it yet. My car needed new floor pans and rails also, so I understand what youre going through. Im familiar with all the parts, but I'm not a mechanic. I know our best Datsun shop and all the guys there if that helps. Why dont you tell me what youre looking with help for exactly and I'll and be of some use.

Send me a PM if you like, or just post here.

Zak

[JimmyZ]

Congratulations on the Z! (Belated 3+ years) You've picked an excellent car to learn on.

It's probably fuel related but here's a quick way to test things. I'm writing these tests in the context of your situation.

Get a spare spark plug and plug it into the coil wire or one of the s-plug wires and lay it on the valve cover or find a way to ground the body of the plug. Crank motor and see if there is spark. (Might need a helper to crank so you can watch spark gap) If no spark then you know where to look. Plugs, points,condenser, dist cap, coil... there are ways of inspecting testing these things listed in a Haynes manual. (You DO have one right?)

If you do have spark and the engine sounds normal when cranking then fuel is the next suspect. By "engine sounds normal" I mean it cranks evenly and compression can be heard when cranking. This rules out any mechanical failures.

Before testing for fuel related problems in this situation it would be nice to know if the motor will run if given something combustible. Verifying things in this manner erases doubt and allows complete focus on what hasn't been solved.

Try spraying starting fluid in the intake before cranking. Don't spray a lot just a quick tap or two of the spray is all you need. If you spray too much and it backfires you'll have on heck of a fireball! Starting a lawnmower with liberal S-fluid removed my arm hair and some of my eyebrows once. Be careful. All you want to do is hear it run for a second or two. This verifies and allows you to proceed to the next steps.

next post...

[JimmyZ]

Sitting for a few years can do a few things to a Z's fuel system which would cause a no start. Starting with the most likely..The rubbers in the fuel pump may have rotted. The float needles in the carbs may have seized or varnished over/shut. The fuel return orifice in the rail may be clogged. The fuel itself may have become so stale that it won't easily run the car let alone start it. Unlikely that the fuel filter is clogged but remotely possible.

Be careful when working with raw fuel. The burns you can receive from a flash might kill you if enough of you gets crisped. No kidding. Wait for any spilt fuel to evaporate completely before starting an engine or making any sparks etc.

The easiest thing to do when testing the fuel is to unplug the fuel line exiting the pump and crank the motor. The moment the pump squirts some fuel STOP cranking. (Have a helper do the cranking and listen for your stop command) The pump, which after sitting this long probably needs replacing anyway as the rubbers are probably getting bad from varnish etc. It's quick and easy to disconnect the exit line from the rail and see if it's clogged. This allows you to skip the float covers/needles which should be done after the pump is verfied.

next post..

[JimmyZ]

Playing with carb float assembly..

Take a fuel line off a carb and four screws off it's float cover, remove and look at the inside of the float bowl. (Clean crud if any from inside of bowl) Be gentle with the float assembly and get a manual if it makes you feel better. It pretty simple to disassemble and check the needle. Work on this part over something soft like a towel so that.. A. You don't lose anything and B. You don't drop and damage the float. Just be gentle and use some needlenose pliers to remove the pin from the float Gently remove the needle from it's seat and chack for crud. They have spray carb cleaners but laquer thinner does a great job of cutting varnish. A quick soak and an old toothbrush and things are like new. Replace the needle, float etc and before installing float cover assembly to carb pour the bowl halfway full of gas. This keeps you from having to crank the engine forever to prime. It is also an excellent way to remedy a run out of fuel situation once the tank has been filled.

[JimmyZ]

Now for what I should have said first:)

I assumed that the engine was actually cranking w/o asking..

Ask yourself, "Have I missed something simple like verifying that there's gas in the tank or that the battery is strong enough to crank things fast enough etc". I'm assuming you've done the obvious. Funny how sometimes it's something simple like no fuel which causes all the hubub.

It might just take some cranking to prime the fuel system after having sat for so long. Try using the choke and spraying just a quick shot of starting fluid to see what happens before whipping out the tools.

Hope this helps,

Jim

[beandip]

Change the oil before you start the engine. A engine setting that long in your area will have condensed moisture in the crankcase, same for the fuel tank. New oil and filter, so since pumping sludge through the engine. You can squirt some gas into the float bowls of the carbs through the vent hose in the top of the float bowls. No more than a oz. pull the choke full on and keep your foot off the gas peddle. try and start the engine . I am taking for granted that the engine is not frozen up. Zed findings is a great place for new floors. GAry

[cdnzee]

Thanks guys,

I will try some of the suggestions today. I noticed on one of the other threads that I can manually turn the crank, how do I do that?

Lastly, my goal is to start the engine so I don't have to tow it to a garage. i guess I just wanted to learn something about auto mechanics: Oil changes, plug changes and minor mechanical repairs. What Datsun manual should I buy that is for the beginner mechanic?

Thanks again.

And Zak I will PM you later on

Roy

[JimmyZ]

The Haynes manuals are OK. I did my first tranny rebuild using one. The troubleshooting sections in most manuals aren't the best but this forum easily picks up where they leave off. One day, if you can afford to get the FSMs (factory service manual(s)) for the car that would give you everything you needed to know and even some you didn't. Eventually you will evolve beyond the manuals and understand things more on an engineers level. It took me a while to reach this point on my own slow pace but now I'm building a plane and the motor from scratch. You may be aware that working on cars like these is a great way to expand yourself in many ways while making some good friends.

A breaker bar with the right sized socket will turn the crank. If it's a manual shift you can always put it in gear and budge the car to turn things over. (I'm assuming you want to adjust the valves and need to turn the motor?)

Early Z's are sooo easy to work on. It's a great car to learn from and the mechanical parts are much cheaper than modern car parts.

Cya,

Jim