Is this Z worth $45,000

[HS30-H]

Smile on my face. You make an excellent point. No, the ZCCA would fall short of "qualified" people to properly "evaluate" world market and Japanese cars. Furthermore, the ZCCA point of view is quite "enthusiast" oriented allowing people of all ranges to compete in car shows on an equal basis. The foundation of the judging criteria is asthetic focusing on "fit, finish, and cleanliness". The examples you describe, Alan, would most successfully fall into the modified class structure as it would be difficult for anyone to evaluate a "stock" Japanese car (for example) "as it left the factory". We know fairly well how the American imports left the factory, but as you point out, other export versions and home market cars are not well documented.

GOOD answer. My hat is off to you. I think the ZCCA needs more people like you!

As I said before, the questions I posed were somewhat rhetorical. I think I got the same answer from you(?) the last time I asked something similar: non-USA/Canada market cars would end up - by default - in the 'Modified' class, even if they were totally stock, because the ZCCA judges would be unlikely to be able to judge them objectively.

I'm nothing if not a pragmatist, and I would honestly feel sympathy for the ZCCA judges if somebody stuck something like a 1970 432R in front of them in a showroom stock class and expected to get anywhere. I would not actually expect them to know what they needed to know, but it would be an interesting exercise nonetheless. If I had unlimited funds I might even consider attempting it! On the other hand, if I had truly unlimited funds I might sponsor a proper WORLD convention of S30-series Z cars - to take place in Japan, and with all market models and variants present and correct with their owners. That would be fun.

Alan T.

[AndysPlit]

if I had truly unlimited funds I might sponsor a proper WORLD convention of S30-series Z cars - to take place in Japan, and with all market models and variants present and correct with their owners. That would be fun.

Alan T.

Yeah, that would be nice if I had the funds to ship my car and meet it in Japan.

When I uncle from Japan visited a few years ago, he was intrigued by my 280Z, since that was an American market car. He owned a Skyline. God rest his soul.

[hls30.com]

Alan,

I apologize, I missed some points, and did not make mine clear in several instances.

I thought it would be more likely to be "........Here come the Judge!"

Surely they would be looking for a car that was being judged to have the correct type of parts and equipment for that market model ( ie - as it left the factory ) if they are judging a 'Stock' class? Sure there are a multitude of parts that were shared by all models in all markets that were built around the same period, but if a USA market HLS30U is fitted with something like - for example - a UK market distributor, then surely it is up to the judges to pick up on it and the owner to explain it?

I suspect your question would have been too close to a 'How Long Is a Piece Of String' to answer.

Actually, my question was: "Does s a genuine Nissan part for an S30 of the correct year count as a modification in the modified classes?" I asked it to be certain of the class my car would fall into given the fact that the rules make no express reference to model destination.

You see, to me your above comment strikes right to the heart of what I'm talking about. I don't see why anyone would necessarily feel under any obligation to travel halfway around the world to "share" any information on cars and specifications that are not even present. You are familiar with the idea of 'The mountain going to Mohammed' I take it?

Frankly, I think if an organisation wants to promote itself as some kind of world authority on a subject then it had better open its eyes to the whole story of that subject, rather than just one part of it. Some very significant members of said organisation are happy to tell people that certain models of the S30-series Z family are "irrelevant", or indeed that it is unnecessary to think of the S30-series Z as a family of models made for different markets and market sectors. Quite a fundamental problem I would say.

Of course, if the ZCCA judging panel wasn't implied to be the single, all powerful, all-wise and all-seeing body of the world ( see the three posts that I objected to in just this thread ) then it would not be an issue, and "assholes" like me would not need to pipe up.

There is no obligation to share anything. Some people simply choose to criticize rather than participate in a solution, and I don't agree with the logic that supports criticism without first attempting to be active in a solution. I did not mean to push my beliefs on you, again, I apologize.

While I did miss some of your meaning, I have never felt you were in "asshole" status, and I have learned a great deal from your "pipe up"s.

First of all Will, I'd remind you that I have on many occasions tried to be of help and assistance to people that needed information or data that I had access to. You yourself are one of them. I don't think I need to be reprimanded for not trying to be helpful. There's an open invitation to anyone who needs anything specific, and I will always do my best to help. But I certainly do NOT want to be sending half of a very precious, rare and hard-won collection out of my sight! There's also the question of copyright ( you are going to be selling these CDs, are you not? ) as I feel sure that a lot of what I have will not be covered by any agreement / dispensation you have obtained from Nissan in the USA.

There was no need to remind me, I pointed it out in the quote(diamonds-are quite valuable, especially yours!) My intention was not to reprimand you, but I seein my expression of my meaning I absolutely was not clear.

Please allow me to dispel a few things about my project for you.

1) I have donated hundreds of hours, and a couple of thousand dollars in materials. I am not selling anything or getting anything marketable for my donations-other than a single copy of the finished project. A couple of members have chosen to cover return postage of their materials, and offered to do more.

2) Along the lines of sending rare S30 related documents through the mail. Kats offered to send some items that fit the description to me when I asked for help with collecting info showing the differences between the USA and other versions of the cars roughly a year ago, and I told him exactly the same thing I will now tell you. I don't want any such rare pieces to have any more exposure to damage or loss than they do where you choose to store them on a daily basis. I prefer to have scans because the materials owners have absolute control over the handling of their materials, and yes, it saves my time.

3) As a matter of fact I recently started working on a blanket universal copy write exemption for all technical and advertising documentation pertaining to the entire family of S30 cars. I have no Idea how Nissan will respond, but as I pointed out in my correspondence with them, the materials in question are no longer in use at the dealers or the corporate offices(at least here in the States), and as such no longer are in use by Nissan such that there is even a need for a copy write(a copy write(again, here in the States) is there primarily to protect the income stream from intellectual property and to protect how the property is used-Nissan no longer sells documents pertaining to the S30 so they have income to lose from the clubs use of their S30 documents, and the documents will still be used for supporting the cars to their owners. )

Really, what has this got to do with the subject I brought up? Like I said, I haven't been backward in coming forward to try and help where anyone needed specific information that I might hold. It's not MY obligation or duty to educate ZCCA officials on market models that they do not judge, but it IS my right to point out that the ZCCA should not be held up as some kind of WORLD authority on the S30-series Z car by default.

26th-Z made a great answer to me in post #58 on this thread, and addressed the crux of my questions whilst showing some understanding of what I might be objecting to with my post #54. I think he - at least partly - 'gets' where I'm coming from. I don't see how pointing the finger at me for not lending some ( unspecified!? ) stuff to your monster CD project is actually relevant to this?

Obviously I missed more of your meaning.

Contributions to the project form overseas translate directly into more knowledge available of the cars of other markets cars-helping to spread the awareness and knowledge of them as very viable and instrumental parts of the Z heritage. If you saw a link to information on most every variant of the S30 family on the opening menu to a parts cd, could you successfully fight the temptation to explore them? I couldn't!

[kats]

Hello,

This is an interesting thread,I would like to introduce this Z432 now for sale in Japan.

http://cala.flexnet.co.jp/flexcw/search/detailXG.jsp?wk=+where++%28++tenji_ktn_cd+%3D+%27REVIEW-HQ%27%0A+or++tenji_ktn_cd+%3D+%27FLEXSETAGAYA%27%0A+or++tenji_ktn_cd+%3D+%27KAWAGUCHI%27%0A+%29%0A++order+by+photocase%2C+data_regist_date+desc+%2C+asp_no&sc=XGA&an=23129

This car is verified PS30-00087,just ahead of my Z432.Like Chris' 26th and 27th sisters,these two Z432s are the same color and must be in a sequence in a production line.

For sale 8,000,000JPY now ,this car was for sale two years ago at different car shop 6,000,000JPY.Price is rising like this.Be careful,there is a bad example,a not good condition Z432 is now 8,000,000 this car was 4,800,000 last year.I do not think that car deserved 4,800,000 anyway. I think the seller should know right price for right car.

This 00087 is unrestored body,still great original painting with remaining lots of early original small parts.

What not my taste is many customizing added,AFM air conditioning,front and rear suspension components are upgraded,electric cooling fan for the radiator,and the engine is not 2000.That is modified to 2300cc with different camshafts.And custom middle and rear exhaust systems.But these modifications are strong sales featuring for the people who like these upgrades.

kats

[Sailor Bob]

Although I understand your point of veiw, I have to say that is a fine looking car. How much horsepower/torque would that be?

Would that be $40,000?

[sblake01]

8,000,000.00 Jpy = $69,391.97 Usd.

[BRE-240Z]

The wheels on that 432 get an A+ in my book......

[Sailor Bob]

Stephen - I meant Canadian Dollars - He He - had to say that, may never be able to do it again.

[geezer]

8,000,000.00 Jpy = $69,391.97 Usd.

Or $67,039.82 CDN. Our buying power has risen sharply lately. But I think I have to pass on this one anyhow.

[sblake01]

That's more than we owe on our mortgage!

[Sailor Bob]

Thought I'ld get a better rise out of you than that. BTW I was refering to the 4,800,000 yen sale price.

[hls30.com]

Very handsome car, but to me Kats opinion is more valuable than a photograph, I bet he has seen more of the cars than I have photographs of them.

Will