240z ignition points problem

[richard1]

Escalon,

You are right......this Honda motor is not OEM.

So I am not stock anymore and you are true.

Lets say that it is a little " improvement "

[JimmyZ]

Points are,well....completely point-less.Dinosaur technology that has no place on a street driven vehicle in 2008.Points(vs electronic)provide poor starts,poor fuel economy,dirtier idle and erratic timing.

Not knocking you but I get 28mpg highway and merely "bump" the starter and the singer sewing machine comes to life. I Imagine you are reffering to when the points aren't in adjustment in the above comment and you would be right. Perhaps with fuel injection one could get 30 mpg out of the 2.4L if they tried. The ignition aspect of mileage is very small.

Driving 80 miles a day round trip I tinker with my points about every 1-2 months.

The real issue is some people have distributors which are worn giving them erratic behavior. When they go to set their points the setting is off because the shaft may shift. A dwell meter helps.

In such cases a Pertronix or similar setup would compensate of course. This would be like buying a new dizzy cheap.

I agree that the cheapo points most commonly offered SUCK. One place in town offers premium points like Arne mentioned. Just holding them you can "feel" the quality.

2c

Jim

[beandip]

So it is the wrong year then, I was told 79-80 distributor will work, so this is wrong year then,appreciate the infor. will keep looking

The distributor is right but the module is wrong. The module is for a later ZX like a '82 or 3. It has the later module that requires input from the computer , that you don't have . The 12 80 is a stand alone module. all the dist. from '79--'83 will work , its just the modules that are different. As was said before , the lower half of the dist shaft is missing on the eBay part. Gary

[280~Master]

has anyone ever tried to run that module?

Just wondering :paranoid:.

I bet there is a way to run it on Z cars. Maybe I can try it on my car.

I have 2 sitting around the shop just waiting to be used. I will research this wiring problem of the module and see if it can be done.

[Z train]

Not knocking you but I get 28mpg highway and merely "bump" the starter and the singer sewing machine comes to life. I Imagine you are reffering to when the points aren't in adjustment in the above comment and you would be right. Perhaps with fuel injection one could get 30 mpg out of the 2.4L if they tried. The ignition aspect of mileage is very small.

Driving 80 miles a day round trip I tinker with my points about every 1-2 months.

The real issue is some people have distributors which are worn giving them erratic behavior. When they go to set their points the setting is off because the shaft may shift. A dwell meter helps.

In such cases a Pertronix or similar setup would compensate of course. This would be like buying a new dizzy cheap.

I agree that the cheapo points most commonly offered SUCK. One place in town offers premium points like Arne mentioned. Just holding them you can "feel" the quality.

2c

Jim

I was referring to points -period.No matter how well your car starts with points,it would start better with electronic ignition.As far as MPG goes-i agree who really gives a rats arse about milage.But to pick up fuel economy as colateral with no down-side?That's a no-brainer.

And no matter how good you are with a dwell meter,points float.Floating points causes the dwell to change.Changing dwell causes the timing to change.Not good.

No logical arguement can be made for the retention of points with the possible exception of a concourse car.

[dualies]

Arne: do you happen to know if a E12-80 module will fit on this distributor then? Thanks for the input

[Z train]

Where the hell is the edit feature?

[Arne]

has anyone ever tried to run that module?

Just wondering :paranoid:.

It will work, but retards the timing by about 8 degrees when it doesn't get a signal from the injection. There are workarounds, but using the E12-80 instead is much cleaner.

Arne: do you happen to know if a E12-80 module will fit on this distributor then? Thanks for the input

As I noted in your other post, yes, you can replace an E12-93 with an E12-80. The distributor itself is the same.

Where the hell is the edit feature?

The ability to edit a post times out after 5 minutes or so.

[JimmyZ]

I was referring to points -period.No matter how well your car starts with points,it would start better with electronic ignition.As far as MPG goes-i agree who really gives a rats arse about milage.But to pick up fuel economy as colateral with no down-side?That's a no-brainer.

And no matter how good you are with a dwell meter,points float.Floating points causes the dwell to change.Changing dwell causes the timing to change.Not good.

No logical arguement can be made for the retention of points with the possible exception of a concourse car.

Unless you're doing 7000+ RPM and/or a high CR and/or whacky/stupid advance does it matter?

Most of the systems for EI discussed here don't have a rev limiter. (You have to buy one separate) I can't tell you how many times I missed a gear and slammed my tach. (Actually I CAN say that it was 6 times/18 years) Thank God the "poor little" points were there to kill the engine. The thing just died. Hit the starter after collecting my nerves and vroom everything back to normal. No broom or bucket to collect engine parts required.

Like I said.. Bump the starter and it starts. I mean a quick bump at that... like as long as it takes to tap a piano key. Don't think it would start any faster with the EI... at least on mine.

Part of the allure of an older car is a melding with the machine. I like the idea of the engineer of old getting out every stop to lube the train. There have been times where I didn't pop the Z's hood for six months and I felt like I was neglecting a child.

If you want a no hassle car they still sell Hondas.

If someones tired of screwing with points then more power to them. I won't knock them, it's their car. There are circumstances which would make it a legitimate need.

To say points are crap is wrong. Although it's a different system (magneto) think about the "points are crap" mentality next time you visit the airport. Light aircraft (GA piston engined A/C) have points. I've never had a forced landing due to ignition problems and neither has anyone I've talked to. (2 mags help)

[Z train]

Unless you're doing 7000+ RPM and/or a high CR and/or whacky/stupid advance does it matter?

It matters.Always has-always will.

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Most of the systems for EI discussed here don't have a rev limiter. (You have to buy one separate) I can't tell you how many times I missed a gear and slammed my tach. (Actually I CAN say that it was 6 times/18 years) Thank God the "poor little" points were there to kill the engine. The thing just died. Hit the starter after collecting my nerves and vroom everything back to normal. No broom or bucket to collect engine parts required.

If you are using a points as a "Polish rev-limiter",i suggest you learn to drive.

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Like I said.. Bump the starter and it starts. I mean a quick bump at that... like as long as it takes to tap a piano key. Don't think it would start any faster with the EI... at least on mine.

Wrong.Even on yours,it would start faster.And there is no Z-car on earth that starts with a "tap" when it's cold.

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Part of the allure of an older car is a melding with the machine. I like the idea of the engineer of old getting out every stop to lube the train. There have been times where I didn't pop the Z's hood for six months and I felt like I was neglecting a child.

If you want a no hassle car they still sell Hondas.

I never realized that a Datsun was a car/truck full of hassles.

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If someones tired of screwing with points then more power to them. I won't knock them, it's their car. There are circumstances which would make it a legitimate need.

Legitimate need?!!You mean like easier starting,more power,more fuel economy and less emissions?

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To say points are crap is wrong. Although it's a different system (magneto) think about the "points are crap" mentality next time you visit the airport. Light aircraft (GA piston engined A/C) have points. I've never had a forced landing due to ignition problems and neither has anyone I've talked to. (2 mags help)

You are wrong again.Saying points are crap is not only right.It's completely,100% accurate.If points WEREN'T crap then they would still be in new cars.They're not.Take the hint.

And comparing aircraft magnetos to a 35 year old points distributor is so bizarre that i'll let it go.:tapemouth

One last thing-the Fireman lubed the locomotive.

[Walter Moore]

And comparing aircraft magnetos to a 35 year old points distributor is so bizarre that i'll let it go.:tapemouth

I hate to burst your bubble, but it is a valid comparison.

The real problem with point type ignition (other than the much lower voltages produced) is that the side load of the points wears out the both the point's cam follower, and the distributor bearings.

On vehicles that don't have that problem (like some tractors etc.) one set of breaker points can last for decades without adjustment.

Oh, and EScanlon, from what I recall reading years ago only semiconductors are sensitive to EMP damage. Which makes some sense since static electricity destroys transistors, but has no effect on capacitors.

But I DO NOT claim any expertize in the area of EMP research. I am just repeating what I read somewhere. As I said, it is not something that I worry about, only a funny memory.

[JimmyZ]

One last thing-the Fireman lubed the locomotive.

"Point" well taken. (Bad pun) I always thought it was the engineer. That's what I wanted to be at age 4. Thirty four years later I realized my dream of being a guy who likes to tinker.

Walter,

Interesting about the EMP and condenser. I've only cursory knowlege but it seems to me that the spike contained by the condenser each cycle would be much greater than a single EMP.?? I know a retired electrical engineer with friends at MIT. I'll pick his brain and see.

I've heard stories about how a 1kiloton nuke being detonated over Kansas would wipe out a fair portion of the countries computers. Can't imagine it but what do I know. Enrique was in the military. Perhaps he has something.