eBay audacity

[Sean Dezart]

Lazeum,

there are innumerable differences between the S30s, even between supposedly the same model but in different markets but any lay person wouldn't really know the difference and certainly not any civil servant and/or cop...unless he or she were a well-informed Z fan as well and had it in for you !

Quite frankly, I don't care what a buyer might do with this number - it aint my problem any more than selling a correct car to someone and then wondering if they'll kill someone on the road........alcohol kills, so do cigarettes and let's not even get into the legal sales of guns..........

You know of the story over here where last year (I think) a bar owner was prosecuted because he sold a few drinks to asomeone who then had an accident intoxicated ? Self - responsibility is a diminishing occurrence - it's always someone elses fault and that means I can sue their a*s ! Well not me - I assume - if there was a Z museum, I dedicate the VIN to it but there aint so it's either there for someone or it hangs in my garage - I don't mind either way but admittedly, it's a shame that it can't legally be exploited. In fact, it can but it means someone buying the chassis too then replacing more than half of it - all legal but what's left of the original ?

Reading earlier about race cars reminds me of a certain 240Z that used to race in the UK. I won't mention it's name 'cos Alan will moan and hold his head in his hands but it's not running on the original chassis number.

Back to you guys......

[John Coffey]

Its like the old story told around the campfire:

"Yup, this here is the ax that George Washington used to chop down the cherry tree in the 'I cannot tell a lie' story."

"Really? The original ax?"

"Yup. Its had the handle replaced back in 1813 because it splintered and the head was replaced back in 1890 because it rusted away, but its the original ax."

[Sean Dezart]

http://cgi.ebay.com:80/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300238661817&ssPageName=ADME:B:EF:MOTORS:1123

As we would say (translated) " little player" !

[EScanlon]

Wouldn't "C'est la même chose!" apply as well? (Same thing?)

But duly noted and reported.

E

[bigoak]

Presque la meme chose....no less than discreet shot of a title...but whatever...

[Sean Dezart]

YOU can interpretate as YOU wish - YOUR perogative but if I'd simply put the wreck up on Ebay - what would you be saying ?

"this French guy's dreaming - who's gonna pay that AND ship it back here - look at the state of it - it aint worth fixing" ?

Anyhow - this aint Minority Report - nobody can charge me with someone else's potentiel future crime.

R.I.P 4944 !

[Carl Beck]

Hi Sean.

Carl B.

[Poindexter]

Sean, the auction simply seemed very shady to me, at first glance, and to many others too, especially because of your carefully crafted "disclaimer".

"Nudge, nudge, wink, wink and all that rot..."

So with that in mind, why would I have bothered to ask a question from the seller of such a questionable item, posted in such a disingenuous manner- especially one who knew of the legal vagueness of this item in the US- as it was on the US ebay site, not anywhere else?

The facts that have come up in the meanwhile, your trustworthiness, etc....all have happened while I've been quite busy, and as such I haven't noticed the goings on in this thread. It just didn't seem worth much more effort, as I'm sure you can understand, when seen from my viewpoint.

So between being busy and deciding that nothing could be gained by trying to get the truth out of some "joker" - from whom I doubted I would get anything factual, and to whom I did not want to expose my ebay identity - you'll forgive me if I didn't follow through with your suggestions regarding various PM's, and ebay messaging. Besides, I just found out that you were a member here about 5 minutes ago.

It still doesn't make much sense to put that auction up, imagining the potential fraud or risk of abuse with such materials. Forget about their apparent illegality in some states.

All that being said, it is very nice to hear that you're a trustworthy Z guy, with best intentions for the Z community.

Edited September 16, 2008 by Poindexter

[Sean Dezart]

No probs. I'm sort of an 'agent provacateur' - I'm not expecting to get anything back from '4944' but the good news is (for me) that someone over here will exchange what's left for a complete 260Z 2+2. The deal excludes the chassis number as I don't want to see that chassis re-born - it's too far gone !

What some nefarious person could do is change their early-ish number for this one to be one of the first 5000 US imported cars.....but why ? Again, what is the reason their is attached reverence on these so called 'series 1' cars ?

Alan may correct me - I beleive that '4944' isn't the 4944th Z to be built - it was probably 5500 or so (?) since this was an HLS and there are S30S AND HS30s. That being so, coveting 'early' cars is not logical (Captain) - it is specific only to the US - but hey, it's your war........sorry, police action.

Been busy Carl ? It's been quiet.

[Poindexter]

No probs. I'm sort of an 'agent provacateur' - I'm not expecting to get anything back from '4944' but the good news is (for me) that someone over here will exchange what's left for a complete 260Z 2+2. The deal excludes the chassis number as I don't want to see that chassis re-born - it's too far gone !

What some nefarious person could do is change their early-ish number for this one to be one of the first 5000 US imported cars.....but why ? Again, what is the reason their is attached reverence on these so called 'series 1' cars ?

Alan may correct me - I beleive that '4944' isn't the 4944th Z to be built - it was probably 5500 or so (?) since this was an HLS and there are S30S AND HS30s. That being so, coveting 'early' cars is not logical (Captain) - it is specific only to the US - but hey, it's your war........sorry, police action.

Been busy Carl ? It's been quiet.

Or maybe some untrustworthy sort might steal a sweet car and seal the deal by changing its VIN with equivalent documentation. Conversion, theft...whatever. Poof, stolen car gone and replaced with....what? And what should then happen if VIN #HLS30-04944 shows up in the USA at some point in the future?

It sounds precisely like you're getting some value back for your paperwork- and a small piece of sheetmetal- you are making an "exchange" as you describe it, for an ENTIRE car yet, "a complete 260Z 2+2"- for what fits in an envelope? That's certainly worth something. Or are you including the mortal, metallic remains too, for incorporation into other cars? This is becoming, so to say, curiouser and curiouser.

Who exactly, btw, has preordained that these Series I cars are worth more money? What forces have the ability to compel this unequal rise in values, skewed to some range of production, or is it merely market forces at work, with a fixed or declining supply? Are they trying to raise the values of cars "they" already possess, or are "they" just causing everybody else's cars (and parts too) to appreciate, and make the barrier to entry higher??

I too have read of something like this "happening" but haven't been able to nail it down, no evidence. I'd like to know, as I guess I have what's considered "outside" that select club.

Edited September 16, 2008 by Poindexter

[Six_Shooter]

Question;

Would there be as much up roar if the vin was 152391? All the same items, dash number, door plaque, firewall cut, ownership, hell what about throwing in the underhood plaque as well? Same worry? or not so much, because it's not an "early" S30?

[geezer]

No probs. I'm sort of an 'agent provacateur' - I'm not expecting to get anything back from '4944' but the good news is (for me) that someone over here will exchange what's left for a complete 260Z 2+2. The deal excludes the chassis number as I don't want to see that chassis re-born - it's too far gone !

What some nefarious person could do is change their early-ish number for this one to be one of the first 5000 US imported cars.....but why ? Again, what is the reason their is attached reverence on these so called 'series 1' cars ?

Alan may correct me - I beleive that '4944' isn't the 4944th Z to be built - it was probably 5500 or so (?) since this was an HLS and there are S30S AND HS30s. That being so, coveting 'early' cars is not logical (Captain) - it is specific only to the US - but hey, it's your war........sorry, police action.

It sounds like a regular Z puppy mill operation in parts of Europe, that you think should be accepted elsewhere. It's too bad you got burned when you bought "4944", but don't expect too many people to buy into the self justification retoric you are putting forth here. The only reason for listing this "VIN package" on Ebay was the hope that some unscrupulous individual would try to use it to circumnavigate the law for their own gain. No, I think a police action would be up to interpol, not us. This is just the way I feel about it.