Terrible Vendor--Datsun Parts

[ljbryan]

I received the 240Z as advertised on E-bay:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=160267158525&ru=http%3A%2F%2Fmotors.shop.ebay.com%3A80%2F__%3F_from%3DR40%26_trksid%3Dm39%26_nkw%3D160267158525%26_nd1%3D%26_fvi%3D1

The car was not driveable. The springs in back were to short and rattled. The brakes would not stop the car. The car vibrated so badly that you could not go over 40MPH. The car was about 30% unrestored. The added paint job was awful. Paint drops were on the hood. The blue original color was showing thru. He said over 25000 in new parts, but could only come up with recipts for around 10000. I have reproted him to e-bay for asking me to pay him directly and not go thru e-bay. I have reported him to the FBI internet Fraud division. l have reported him to the Better Business Bureau in his home town. I have hired an attorney to sue him for fraud which should happen in about two weeks. I have taken the car to Asian automotive in Savannah to try to get the car fixed. Do not buy from this guy. He overstates what he is selling.

Any questions, feel free to contact me by e-mail. lj_bryan@hargray.com

Edited February 14, 2009 by Arne
Post cleaned by Arne

[ljbryan]

The following is a list of emails in chonological order, the text of Als emails has been edited in only two ways, Als comments(his exact and unedited written comments) are in red, and many blank spaces have been removed to shorten the post.

From: Larry Bryan

Subject: Re: 240Z car comments

To: "Datsun Parts" <a2602nv@yahoo.com>

Date: Monday, September 22, 2008, 1:06 PM

I am sorry you feel that way. If you are truly interested, I have a very poor level of satisfaction. You stated in your ad that nothing was left undone, completely restored. I asked you what it would cost to do a great concourse paint job and you told me you could get it done for $2000.00 (no body work necessary). We agreed that you would remove the windshield and back glass. You did not. The paint is not good.

Is the suspension stock. Has it been lowered. The car seemed to bottom out and hit the exhaust pipe. The brakes don't work right. What is wrong with them. They barely stop at all.

Al I am not someone with little financial resources that you may usually deal with. I have just contacted the Police fraud department in your county and asked them how I should proceed. They told me to provide the info on the fraud, which I will have the report shortly and visually they will also be able to see, and to file a report with the local police. The local Blufftom police will contact them and they said they would proceed to contact you. I have also called my local attorney and he is ready to proceed. Pictures and verbiage will hit all of the forums to show them what was received versus described. I have a copy of your sales document. I will call E-bay and tell them what happened and that you asked me to pay you direct and provide them with pictures and verbiage as to what is wrong with the car. I can do all these things or you can work with me to take the car back or pay someone to put the car in the condition you described. If you will tell me your decision, then I will know what I will do over the next week.

Al I don't know why you felt it necessary to overstate the condition of the car so much, but you did. You said the parts were new and genuine new old stock 240Z parts. You can look at the car and tell that not every nut and bolt was removed, re-plated and restored. You can just open the door and see where EACH part of the car is not brand new or restored to better than new condition. The radio did not work, the dash door was not restored, the seat adjustment on the passenger seat is not all there. the door attachment on the passenger door is broken, etc etc etc.

Larry

----- Original Message -----

From: Datsun Parts

To: Larry Bryan

Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 3:27 PM

Subject: 240Z car comments

My comments are irrelevant, all that matters are your and your satisfaction. I have learned how Will thinks and I am sure it impacted your perception. Your recent chosen words are offensive and your standards seem be that you are getting a Barrett Jackson car. This is a daily driver that I put a lot of time, money, effort and energy into.

My description and words to you about the car are very true.

Here are some suggestions on your comments since you asked...

The wheels are the cause the of shaking, I never test drove it after I installed those and it was fine with the steel wheels. Double check the wheels bearing nut and lug nuts are tight.

Every part of the suspension is new, so there is no problem there.

The re-paint work was $2,000 and not $10,000 to $15,000 as most showroom cars get. That car and paint are beautiful and will win many shows for you. The thin paint on the hatch is my fault as I got some glue on it and the cleaner I used wore down the paint. I have included some touch up paint in your parts box which is on the way.

This "report" you speak of has no validity to me. This car was sold to you as is based off our phone conversations and agreements. I never offered to make any additional changes and this transaction was considered complete once you took position of the car. I have fulfilled all of my statements about how this transaction would be completed.

Trust me, I want you to be happy as I do every customer. I value your business and respect your opinion. I am sure once you realize what you have and compare that to what you paid you will be more then satisfied. I welcome your comments and will do what I can to assist you to resolve them.

Datsun Parts

Al Allen

909-684-8814

http://myworld.ebay.com/datsun-parts

--- On Mon, 9/22/08, Larry Bryan wrote:

From: Larry Bryan

Subject: Re: 240Z car

To: "Datsun Parts" <a2602nv@yahoo.com>

Date: Monday, September 22, 2008, 11:33 AM

Al no comments on the condition of the car?

----- Original Message -----

From: Datsun Parts

To: Larry Bryan

Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 1:48 PM

Subject: Re: 240Z car

Incredible! I paid to have that shipment over-nighted, it has un-replaceable documents. Let me know when you get it.

Datsun Parts

Al Allen

909-684-8814

http://myworld.ebay.com/datsun-parts

--- On Mon, 9/22/08, Larry Bryan wrote:

From: Larry Bryan

Subject: Re: 240Z car

To: "Datsun Parts" <a2602nv@yahoo.com>

Date: Monday, September 22, 2008, 10:36 AM

Al I have not been to the mail box today to see if the documents arrived. I did get the car Sat. I was shocked when I got the car. It shook so bad trying to drive it home I could not go over 40MPH and the brakes don't work right. The suspension appears to have serious problems. Will just came over and looked at the car and documented which parts of the car were not restored as described. "Every last nut and bolt removed, re-plated and restored." "Overall every single part is brand new or restored to better than new condition." In addition, the paint has many flaws and the blue is showing thru in several places and the paint around the hatch, when up, shows blue in several places.

It is obvious upon inspection that the statements you made are not even close to correct. Will came over to inspect the car and took pictures and is going to send me a detailed write up as to where your sales statements are not true.

It saddened me to see what I got versus what you said I would get. When I get his report and pictures I will be back to you to determine what I want to ask you to do.

Larry

----- Original Message -----

From: Datsun Parts

To: Larry Bryan

Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 1:07 PM

Subject: Re: 240Z car

Did you get the car and the documents safe?

Datsun Parts

Al Allen

909-684-8814

http://myworld.ebay.com/datsun-parts

--- On Sun, 9/14/08, Larry Bryan wrote:

From: Larry Bryan

Subject: Re: 240Z car

To: "Datsun Parts" <a2602nv@yahoo.com>

Date: Sunday, September 14, 2008, 4:23 PM

Al thanks for the info, but I wish I had know many of the items below before now. I guess I am surprised. I will do my best to fisnish the car. The glove box looks old in the latest picture, and looked different in the e-bay pictures. Am I right.

----- Original Message -----

From: Datsun Parts

To: Larry Bryan

Sent: Sunday, September 14, 2008 4:11 PM

Subject: 240Z car

Larry-

I have recently learned you have have developed a relationship with my biggest credic Will Stokes. I also wanted to advise you the the Z is on the way and will arrive a week from today, Saturday the 21st. Here is a list of problems with the car.

1. I lost the door key, it is a DT13 blank single sided which is hard to find. I ordered two and will send them to you so you can have it cut.

2. There is not spare tire, or jack, I never had those. There is one in it now but it is part of the 4 steel wheel set, the driver has the other 3 and the hubcaps.

3. There is a dent on the fuel tank, it was always there and has no effect on the functionality of the tank.

4. I noticed one brake light was out when the driver was loading it in the tailer, may be just a bulb.

5.Engine only has about 500 miles, you should change the oil soon.

6. The A/C compressor switch is in the center console, it is direct power to the battery through a relay, so make sure the switch is off when you park it.

7. The 10 cent spring clip on the passenger side door window crank is missing. You can get one at any autoparts. I removed it when I was trying to get a key made and lost it.

8. The passenger side rear tire was a bit low on air, may have a valve stem leak, the tires have ZERO miles on them as I only istalled them just before the driver arrived.

9. There is a bolt missing on the passenger side front bumper that is causing a 1/8' rubbing scratch, you may not notice it when you add the small bolt, but I will sent tocuh up paint in the package with the paperwork too.

10. There are no horns. I had never found working ones. The horn button on the steering wheel is just popped on so if you want to add a horn or change the ugly steering wheel it is easy to do.

11. There is a door latch spring mechanism that is missing on the drivers side, they are out of production now and I never found one. The door locks and closes fine without it.

12. The is a 1/4 window rubber strip on the drivers side that I never installed, I have it and will send it to you.

13. I have the OEM radio that I will ship to you.

14. Please return the California license plate.

15. The hatch has brown pop rivets on the panel, I wll send you a pack of black rivits as i was out of stock and forgot to order more in black.

16. The windshield and hatch glass were not removed when it was repainted.

Datsun Parts

Al Allen

909-684-8814

http://myworld.ebay.com/datsun-parts

End the email exchange.

The Car was paid for on or about August 5th 2008.

The Car was delivered on or about September 20th, 2008

Please Note In the email exchange above, Al states, "My description and words to you about the car are very true."

Please Note Als Description of the car:"

"Datsun Nissan Z 240Z Restored 1970 All New NOS Parts

Up for bid is a Series 1 240Z. Production date of 3/70 it was one of the first 8500 made. This restoration includes over $25,000 in New and Genuine New Old Stock 240Z parts. Every last nut and bolt was removed, re-plated and restored. This Z was a personal project car that I took special pride in to make sure it was a true award winner. Nothing was left undone, completely restored interior includes and NEW Dash, New Door Panels, New Seats and New Carpet. All of the gauges including the clock work perfect.

The factory spec rebuilt engine is a L24 block with a E31 head. Every part of the engine was disassembled and rebuilt to factory OEM specs. It has been professionally tuned and runs great. OEM 4 speed transmission is also rebuilt with all new parts.

Overall every single part is brand new or restored to better then new condition.

Please be advised that the paint work was not done to Concours requirements. If you wanted a true 100 point car you would need to have it repainted. During assembly it suffered a few bumps and bruises that will need to be fixed."

Please note In the Same Email exchange above, Al also states:"Your recent chosen words are offensive and your standards seem be that you are getting a Barrett Jackson car. This is a daily driver that I put a lot of time, money, effort and energy into."

Edited February 24, 2009 by hls30.com

[hls30.com]

Pictures of the car as it was delivered can be found here:

http://www.classiczcars.com/photopost/showgallery.php?cat=3526

Will

[Carl Beck]

I received the 240Z as advertised on E-bay:

The added paint job was awful. Paint drops were on the hood. The blue original color was showing thru.

Like everyone here, I'm sorry to hear that this turned out like it has. I can also say that your not the only one to have an experience like this.

As I recall, in his original ad he said that the paint job would have to be redone if one wanted it to be show quality. Perhaps I don't understand your statement that "The added paint job was awful." Did you mean the paint job that was on the car as advertised, covering the original blue, that the seller said wasn't show quality?

FWIW,

Carl B.

[ljbryan]

Like everyone here, I'm sorry to hear that this turned out like it has. I can also say that your not the only one to have an experience like this.

As I recall, in his original ad he said that the paint job would have to be redone if one wanted it to be show quality. Perhaps I don't understand your statement that "The added paint job was awful." Did you mean the paint job that was on the car as advertised, covering the original blue, that the seller said wasn't show quality?

FWIW,

Carl B.

I paid Al extra to put the concourse paint job he said it needed. He was to take off the trim and the front and back windows out. The trim was not removed nor were the windows mentioned.

Larry

Edited October 21, 2008 by hls30.com

[ljbryan]

I asked Al to take the car back. He would not do so. I made a stupid mistake here. I always buy new cars. I was not familiar with the Z. Al told me about his creditials, his past winners. I looked at his high rating and thru talking to him, I trusted him. While this money was not insignificant, it fortunately was not a really big deal to me. I am not worried about the money really, I just don't like being cheated. I am going to sue Al for the cost of getting the car to the condition he advertised. "Every part is new or restored to better than new". I am going to sue for the return of my money I paid to have a quality paint job put on the car. The attorney is planning to start this process next week.

Larry

Edited February 14, 2009 by Arne
Post cleaned by Arne

[hls30.com]

Here is another update,

1)Larrys car has had the springs corrected( the ones on it were short to the point the rear suspension was resting on the bump stops and the springs rattleing anytime the car went over a bump-from no longer being under tension),

2) One caliper replaced, as one was frozen, and there is still an issue with the car pulling hard to one side when braking-the pads will be replaced, they appear to be mismatched left to right(one pair of high performance-one set of run of the mill)

3)Four proper sized tires put on it-the ones on it were too small-put there to allow more clearance to address the clearance issues from the severe lowering of the car.

4) the Muffler was reinstalled(Al had put it on upside down and backwards),

5)the check valve for the mastervac was re-installed correctly(it was installed backwards-meaning the car had no vacuum to power brake booster-and thereby no power brakes)

6) There is still a shimmy in the front end, meaning the rack probably needs to be

7) serious Dents in the floor from jacking the car in the wrong place to replace the wheels have been removed.

Most of the issues left to correct are:

a) restore the steering wheel,

clam shell,

c) restore/replace the turnsignal switch-only works one way,

d) restore the hazzard switch and its hardware,

e) Restore the original radio(completly dead, worn and broken face plate),

f) correct the after market radio -lights up but no sound)

g) Restore the scratched shifter, replace the torn shifter boot,

h) restore the worn/missing/broken hardware for the ps door, seats, visors, mirror and seatbelts

i) restore crazed/worn/broken console,

j) cracked rear trims(all but one),

k) cut shock tower upholstery,

l) worn tunnel upholstery,

m) scratched up gage lenses,

n) cracked knob(s) on HCP,

o) replace the mismatched fasteners through out the car,

p) no key to the doors(ign Key only),

q) several dash lights are out,

r) replate the engine hardware that was painted instead of replated

s) correct Fit of the PS headlight cover that was installed improperly(3/4" off)

t) correct the core support damage

u) Remove the dents in the car that was said to be ready for a concours paint job he was paid extra(exactly the amount he asked for) to do and did not.

v) replacement of the hatch(raw bondo squished in all over the inside)

w) replacement of the hood

x) hatch shelf/corner replacement (slathered filler all over the swiss cheese)

y) Strip the car, professionally repaint(Al was paid what he asked to remove the glass and paint the car properly-he did not)

Z) Put the car back together in the condition AL chose to advertise it as being in-even though it was no where close:

Quoting from ALs Ad: "Datsun Nissan Z 240Z Restored 1970 All New NOS Parts

... This restoration includes over $25,000 in New and Genuine New Old Stock 240Z parts. Every last nut and bolt was removed, re-plated and restored. This Z was a personal project car that I took special pride in to make sure it was a true award winner. Nothing was left undone, completely restored interior includes and NEW Dash, New Door Panels, New Seats and New Carpet. All of the gauges including the clock work perfect.

...

Overall every single part is brand new or restored to better then new condition..."

Photos of the car as delivered can be seen here:

http://www.classiczcars.com/photopost/showgallery.php?cat=3526

More photos showing the difference between Als work and the correct way to restore a Datsun have been taken as the work has been done, I will see about adding them over the next week or so.

The car was pretty, but it was not driveable as delivered, and it was far from the description Al gave it on ebay.

Will

PS,

In Als version of "a true award winner", with "Nothing... left undone", and "completely restored..." car, There are a good many more issues to correct than I listed above, but in a project this size, it has to be taken in smaller bites so as not to be overwhelming.

In fairness, Al does seem to have done a good job on the engine/drive train, the car runs well(though the shifter was sloppy-Al forgot to replace the shifter bushings in his rebuild-once that was corrected, the car shifts very well-too bad it wasn't safe to drive as delivered-no brakes(emergency or otherwise, and a steering wheel that was impossible to hold for a 240lb man(me) at 40 miles per hour.

Edited February 14, 2009 by Arne
Post cleaned by Arne

[hls30.com]

Here is another update on The Car AL sent to South Carolina.

I picked up the car from Asian Automotive/Carter Racing this morning. I spent the day with the car and drove it in all kinds of dry conditions while getting estimates for correcting Als version of award winning bodywork and Concourse paint(Every estimate included a replacement hood and a replacement hatch-those on the car were too full of poorly done previous repairs, filler and rust to economically repair at $44/hour. The lowest bid to correct the work so far is $4270.11 with the provision that hidden poor repairs will add to the cost of those that were exposed when the back sides of several repairs were examined(anyone know how to take a photo through a non-camera ready borescope?).

1) Even though the car ran strong when I drove it before, it turns out Al tuned the car for idle-IDLE! The carbs were neither balanced nor adjusted for performance. Now that they are tuned really well, the muffler installed properly, the ride height corrected, proper tires installed, and the brakes functioning properly the car is still seriously too loud at and about 2000 rpm, but at least now it is a blast to drive-it is night and day different than the last time I drove it. At 4k you can feel the aftermarket cam come into its sweet spot.

2) Only the headlights and one side of the emergency flashers work. No other lights(other than the one on the new Kenwood radio that AL installed so as to make no noise at all) actually light up! No turn signals, no markers, no running lights, map light dash light or engine light. Replacing the fuses-all of them-made no change!

3) At any speed the exhaust fumes in the car are so bad that the only way it can be driven is with the windows up-since the AC was wired to be on if the car is on(NO THERMOSTATIC CONTROL), it is on all the time, but there is very little airflow through the car, and even less cooling-it was in the 50s here in Savannah today, and with the AC running full blast all the time it was still colder outside than in the car-almost no airflow through the system, and inoperative controls! A fine example of Als HVAC ability-he was paid extra to install a WORKING a/c unit! On a 50 degree afternoon holding any speed up to 70 miles per hour with the Ac blower on full blast and the compressor on continuously, the AC Al installed can't keep up...

What about the heat you ask- the AC was wired to be on all the time!

Will

Edited December 21, 2008 by hls30.com

[hls30.com]

A small and concise update.

Out of 87 fasteners removed today 78 were coarse self-tapping sheetmetal screws-of those 64 were forced into locations with pre-cut threads. Six fasteners were correctly reused, and the balance were 10/24 threaded into metric threads.

There were eighteen missing fasteners including the passenger side seat rear retainers-meaning the rear of the passenger seat was not bolted down-though the studs had been replaced.

The door panels have cut lines and damage underneath, meaning they were probably not NOS, but a recovered set-though nicely done.

The radio install included a dead Kicker Amp under the seat-not secured at all, and grounded with a self-drilling sheetmetal screw through the floor-it appears that the improperly prepared frayed ends of the 8g wires used shorted against the case blowing the underhood fuse, and the amp.

For the fuel and vapor hoses in the back Al used heater hose, and made no attempt to seal the hoses where they passed through the floor. There are also several welding burn throughs at the back of the car-meaning more holes to the outside for fumes to pull through. Pictures will be posted later.

Have a look at the speaker box-yes it is sagging when upside down.

It was attatched at the bottom with a single self drilling sheet metal screw through the floor-right on top of the gas tank.

Will

Edited February 14, 2009 by Arne
Post cleaned by Arne

[hls30.com]

As promised...

[hls30.com]

and more...

No pins on the vent grills-the pins align and secure the inner plenums-meaning without the pins they slide around with each turn of the car-installation hole filled-and not opened up before installation means the grills pins were broken before installation.

Lots of openings in the rear of the car, incomplete and miss-aligned repairs, untreated rust...

The Passenger door is a filler piece too, but because it is painted silver, I could not get the pictures to show the dents inside...

Edited January 13, 2009 by hls30.com

[hls30.com]

and more...

The aftermarket Kenwood radio was installed with all of the speaker wires cut off-using only the rca outs. In reviewing the proper owners/install manual downloaded from Kenwoods web site for the unit-this option is not listed at all-leading me to believe(not tested yet) that the amplifier in the radio was(is) probably dead when the unit was installed. Have a peek at the wiring on the license lamp-indicative of the radio install. Several cut wires(B+) cut not wrapped.

Will

Edited January 13, 2009 by hls30.com