The hardest part to find

[hls30.com]

At Cleveland, Judges were asked not to take points for faithful and proper looking parts(reproductions), or for later versions of earlier parts.

Unless there is a perfect example of an original part on a car in the show, I can't imagine any judge would take points for a presentable reproduction, and unless the original version of a superceeded part is plentiful, I can't see a judge taking points for using a new version.

I do think that if someone had taken the time and energy to hunt down original parts (as opposed to readily available superseeded genuine Nissan parts), that time and energy should count in the score, though I can see how a big budget restoration could afford original parts when a home grown wife regulated(as far as she knows)restoration probably could not.

Will

Edited March 13, 2009 by hls30.com

[Mike B]

The fuel door knobs being reproduced have a similar difference with regard to the base plate as I understand. I still need to compare, but the early plastic thumb latch aligns in a different position to the base plate of the later style latch mechanism. Perhaps in this case, one cannot outwardly tell the difference however the mirror thing has me baffled.

Chris,

The bases are exactly the same on both the plastic knob and the later pot metal one. The latch orientation is determined by the notch on the back of the knob. It is in a different location on the plastic and the pot metal knobs. The repros that Bryan made are exactly like the plastic originals, except the chrome is a higher quality and will last much longer.

The red dot knobs are only correct for early cars (1969 production, maybe some very early 1970's) with the earlier thinner mirror stalks. A red dot knob on a later 1970, even with the early mirror stalk would not be correct, nor would it be correct for the later style mirror stalk used on later cars.

-Mike

[Unkle]

''Wife regulated''.

Good points all, but here : the original thread started as ''The hardest part to find " is suddenly the easiest . I now want my grey dash panels please . How many cars need the rare parts , like the chrome 240Z sail panel emblems ? Oops, wait, I just got an email saying one chap has 20 repros ready at 5 bucks each ! ( Just kidding ). This is really a lament on what was once almost impossible to find is now just a click away , IMHO. :disappoin

Mike , chrome and paint aren't my points - that's an unfair comparison , like ''Japanese paint and chrome '' are not the same as very specific early rare parts that really early car junkies look for when at a show, or anywhere one of these cars are spotted. These parts separate and identify rare early cars from later years . I don't think I meant and take it as far as having to have the original Japanese paint on the car, or the original Japanese chrome on the bumpers.

Edited March 13, 2009 by Unkle
clarifying a point

[Mike B]

This is really a lament on what was once almost impossible to find is now just a click away , IMHO. :disappoin

That should be a good thing, shouldn't it? More people will have more original looking cars, if they chose too. By the way, a good chromer should be able to fill the hollow Z's on later pot metal emblems to look like the ealier style "chrome Z" emblems.

-Mike

[hls30.com]

...I now want my grey dash panels please . How many cars need the rare parts , like the chrome 240Z sail panel emblems ?...

This is really a lament on what was once almost impossible to find is now just a click away , IMHO. :disappoin

Mike , chrome and paint aren't my points - that's an unfair comparison , like ''Japanese paint and chrome '' are not the same as very specific early rare parts that really early car junkies look for when at a show, or anywhere one of thes are spotted. These parts separate and identify rare early cars from later years . I don't think I meant and take it as far as having to have the original Japanese paint on the car, or the original Japanese chrome on the bumpers.

In making plans to furnish reproduction parts, I worried about similar things,

Making it too easy for an unscrupulous Datsun Seller to dress a later car as a low vin, and present it as such. Zedd Findings requires a copy of your title to sell data plates and they come pre-punched. I considered similar measures to limit the availablity of the early parts to those who actually have early cars. Not to keep the parts rare, but to keep them from being used for the wrong purpose.

Will

[Mike B]

In making plans to furnish reproduction parts, I worried about similar things,

Making it too easy for an unscrupulous Datsun Seller to dress a later car as a low vin, and present it as such. Zedd Findings requires a copy of your title to sell data plates and they come pre-punched. I considered similar measures to limit the availablity of the early parts to those who actually have early cars. Not to keep the parts rare, but to keep them from being used for the wrong purpose.

Will

Will,

VIN plates (especially the firewall VIN etching) make a low VIN car, not early parts, no matter how many of them you add. I agree with limiting access to VIN plates, but nothing else. Should we also limit sale of JDM parts for fear that someone will try to pass off a modified non-JDM car? If someone with a later car wanted to add a few early parts because they like the look, shouldn't that be ok? Similar to someone with a US car that wants to add certain JDM only parts that they like?

-Mike

Edited March 13, 2009 by Mike B

[Arne]

I'm with Mike on this one. My car is a late '71 - but I would really like to have a hand throttle. Not even remotely close to correct for my car's build date, but I'd like one anyway. Should I be allowed to buy and install one?

[BryanM]

''The hardest part to find " is suddenly the easiest .

wasn't that the point of the original post? (even though this one's been available for quite some time now) who woulda thunk a simple hobby could cause such controversy?

-Bryan

[AZ-240z]

I agree that there is nothing wrong with reproduction parts when there is no longer a NOS part available. How many would, after a nice restoration, keep the old tattered under -hood decals if they were even still there, or use new reproduction decals of very high quality to enhance all of your hard work? NOS decals? I don't think so!

Didn't we have a discussion some time ago about resolving some of these questions of originality by adding an "Unrestored Original" catagory to the Stock Class at National Z Car Shows? There aren't many unmolested orignal 240z cars around anymore that could qualify for a #1 or #2 car. If you don't happen to own one of these, should you be penalized or disqualified or not allowed to compete in our shows? All of this would be totally counter-productive and have a large negative impact on our hobby in my opinion.

Just my thoughts,

Dan

[Unkle]

Again , paint, chrome and decals not included - We're talking very specific early parts only . Am I the only one besides Wil who's catching the drift ? And by the way, Zedsaver sold me an ID plate no questions asked, and I had to ask him to stamp it . ( The paint shop lost the door jamb ID plate ).

[geezer]

If someone has taken the time to locate and paid the exhorbant cost to use an NOS part, that has to count for something. Some kind of special consideration should be made while judging, to be used in the event of a tie perhaps? The problem with the reproductions being so well done and indistinguishable is only a problem for the judges and participating owners who are competing. The rest of us benefit from top notch reproduction pieces that have become available. I don't think creating a seperate judging catagory is the answer. I ultimately would side on what benefits our cars appearance and furthers the hobby. Otherwise, where is the incentive for someone to spend the time and money to produce high quality reproductions instead of just mediocre parts that are not show quality, but only good enough to get by.

[hls30.com]

Mike,

I agree the data plates make the car, but the data plates are increasingly easy to get as we have had sellers in the past offer to remove and ship portions of the firewall, the plates, and the title...'corse if you have them...

I have not come to a suitable answer on the question at hand, but I do agree that it is a problem, and that it should be addressed.

Arne,

Absolutely not:finger:, you shouldn't be allowed to buy or install anything else:finger:-your car is too nice as it is;)!

Ron,

I must admit, I am setting my '72 up to be partially dressed as a low vin or as the "72 it is with a console change(until I get my low vin). For my own use an indistinguishable reproduction part is preferable-I have two little boys who I would like to teach to enjoy 240Zs-because I would not spend a second thought over a broken reproduction Aperture Mask where as I would be highly irregular if the original was broken.

In my own reproductions, I will not offer them until they are visually indistinguishable from the original part.

I heard a quote the other day that makes sense here(in terms of its parallel)

Guns kill people exactly like a spoon made Rosie O'donnell fat.

High quality reproduction parts availability makes a fraudulent car the same way. Having said that, it does bother me that nice things can be used by the NGAJr.s of the world for nefarious purposes.

My conclusion is some people will speed given roads and posted speed limits, and some people will not-the honesty of the individual is the guide, and that does not mean we should not have roads.

I will make the parts as close to perfect copies and technologically possible, make them as available as possible, and the NGAJr.s of the world will do what they are going to do-regardless.

Will