Did Nissan ever Supercharge?

[Zvoiture]

Just curious if there were ever any dabblings with supercharging by the Nissan folks. Currently, a supercharged version of the truck has been available here in the US for a couple years, but I am not aware of it being offered in any other models. I'm wondering if the factory ever played around with it in the '60's or '70's for competition or in some obscure model.

Come in: HS30-H.

steve77

[HS30-H]

Hi Z-Voit,

That kind of post is pretty much guaranteed to get my attention ( as long as I'm looking in, that is ).

As far as I know ( and only the Pope is infallible ) Nissan / Datsun never tried to "soup" any of their race cars in the '60's and '70's. I also don't know of any road cars that they tried to supercharge in the same era, but they might have tried it on some obscure Home-market commercials for all I know. Pretty much most of their induction-side research went on perfecting the fuel injection and engine management systems on the race cars. That's why they were able to jump ahead of their competitors when they applied what they had learned to forced-induction systems.

Toyota were always the forced-induction pioneers in Japan ( not forgetting Mazda who were a little behind them ) and Nissan never really got going on turbos until the Eighties. Once they got into them, they really did do it much better than everyone else. However, it was the aftermarket and street-tuning world where most of the really effective research went on..........

I remember HKS used to sell a supercharger kit ( a proper "everything you need" bolt-on job ) for the L28 engine in the early 1980's in Japan. I seem to remember them also offering a bolt-on supercharger kit too around the same period, and I will have to have a dig into my literature collection to see if I can find any photos to scan and post up. That's an interesting challenge for the coming week..........

Why, are you looking for some "free" horsepower?!?

Alan T.

[Zvoiture]

Thanks, Alan...

While I am not a member of the 'bone-stock religious right wing', I am pro-L-series, pro FI, anti-V-8 and anti-turbo. But the idea of a rock-crusher crossed my mind the other day.....I'm going to do some research too....Imagine building a mechanically FI 3.1 with a little Paxton on the side.......

steve77

[nickbean]

jim cook racing offers a supercharger/efi kit for the L-28 (I'm sure it would fit an L-24) althought I think it's a roots type blower, it sounded to me like you were asking about a centrifugal supercharger. as for nissan ever offering a supercharger......you got me, i've got no idea

http://www.jimcookracing.com/catalog/page24.html

http://www.jimcookracing.com/

P.S. has anybody tested or seen this setup used?

[Cuong Nguyen]

Hi Zvoiture,

I was wandering why are you anti-turbo??? (Anti V8 I can understand)

If you dislike turbo engines due to "turbo lag" (Porsche 930 turbo, BMW 2002 turbo and other cars are famous for this) then - things have really changed and progressed from those early days!

Ball-bearing turbo technology has paved the path to "instant" throttle response from modern turbo setups.

Personally I think that despite what lots of people believe, superchargers are way less efficient than turbochargers.

Remember the Turbo era of Group B rally cars? (Lancia 037, Audi Quattro, Peugeot 205 Turbo 16 etc….) Now there is some nice machinery!!!

[Zvoiture]

Turbo's just seem so fragile. It just seems to me anything that is subjected to those kind of temperatures and spins at those rates is just a failure waiting to happen. Maybe I have heard too many horror stories and have not known anyone who has had a long-term, trouble-free turbo experience. I'm not saying Superchargers are the way to go...I'm just snooping around.

steve

[81na ZX]

Originally posted by HS30-H

Toyota were always the forced-induction pioneers in Japan ( not forgetting Mazda who were a little behind them ) and Nissan never really got going on turbos until the Eighties. Once they got into them, they really did do it much better than everyone else. However, it was the aftermarket and street-tuning world where most of the really effective research went on..........

The first Mazda turbo was the 1984 JDM RX-7 GSL-SE. Here we got the fuel injected 13B, there they got the fuel injected turbo 12AT.

I don't know of any turbos before then, as their cars were 90% carbed back then.

As for turbos being fragile.... I have 110k on my stock turbo'd talon and it runs fine. the turbo is stil in great condition. Some of the old turbos might have been more problematic due to poor design. Modern turbos are well lubricated with engine oil from large passages and water cooled, with proper care they last forever. even with improper care, they still last as long as most the rest of the engine.

Proper care means not turning the car off right after you get on it - letting the turbo cool off. Cutting it hot bakes the oil in the lines, leaving coke deposits clogging flow.

However with modern water cooling, the turbo stays cool enough for the oil to drain out.

And innefficent supers...

Roots type are totally innefficent, something like 20% losses.

Centerfugals are much better, cause they are the compressor half of a turbo.

Example - on a Top Fuel drag car pushing out 6000hp, almost 1000hp is lost in blower use

[Ed]

I understand how the centrifugal superchargers work. How does a roots type blower work?

[81na ZX]

a roots type is an impeller which takes the place of your manifold. Belt driven (obviously), directly shoving air into the engine. No room for an I/C, quite innefficent, but compact. GM uses them on the 3800s, Mazda on the miller-cycle Millenia, Jackson racing SC are roots type.

[sjcurtis]

both of these methods will get you power.

supercharging : roots(gear type) or centrifugal (impeller type) are both methods of increasing power but both require tractive effort to produce power, through geared drive systems. excessive loading and unloading of boost on the engine can cause rapid seperation of piston crowns under certain conditions. these systems can go off the rails if your kit is not complete and well governed.

Turbo charging: in any form supplies you with free horespower because the method is known as power recovery technology utilizing power that has been set free (wasted) through the exhaust pipe.

I have only seen after market supercharging on L series engines and then only the roots design on on the old group c rally P510 cars L16/L18/L20b engines, and the support vehicles.

I have had reasonable success with the turbo charging in the past running an isuzu G180 at 22psi (variable boost) as a daily runner back in 1984 before all the good electronic gear arrived. I just had the old TO4 and twin stromberg side draft carbies and a boost controller.

For my money, "boost it with hot gas" and more boost is better

Steve:classic:

[smg1404]

Heck, a motor is just a source of power.... If you could run faster and perform better on the track with any piece of hardware better than any other piece... Then deciding to stay away from it based on some misguided sence of loyalty to a brand name, or theology ,,, only ensures your losing the race.... If that is not your goal why drive a sports car??? Speed knows no religion.... as I have heard somewhere before,, "If your not winning , you are losing"" If the goal is fun, and you are not having enough fun get a new box to play with... Datsun, Ferrari, Porsche, Lotus, Corvette.... It really does not matter... The trick is what works for you.... The guys that designed these cars did not go home at night an kiss their designs... They did it for the money, and their families.... Had another company offered them more they would have worked for the competition....Thats the key word competition.... I do not believe that any automobile is any more than a tool... If it does a great job, and is efficient, great. But if you have to bust your arse to make it almost keep up with a car costing half as much,,,, who is winning?? Sorry guys, I have joined the ranks of corvette owners... I may not be the fastest, But I feel good... Z for sale anyone???? I have one now..

[Mudge]

Vettes rock, heavier though and parts $$$$, otherwise I considered a C5 several times, plus they will come down in price when the C6 hits. C4 is nice too, and early C3s (the Mako, the Stingray).

Turbos are new, blowers are old news, there are some advantages to either one I suppose but no intercooler, and lower quality gas nowdays, ick. Especially for road racer types, way way too much heat, not an attractive solution

I agree on the Turbos giving nearly free HP, thats why we have guys putting out 4 and 5 HP per cube on "street cars" now, and yes blowers suck about 1200 HP on Hemi dragsters or some ungodly number, gas sucker extroidinaire.