Questions/Comments on #1905 Parts

[zcar70]

Another good thread about the differences in early Zs!

My 5/70 car did have the two screws with clear plastic washers along the bottom of the door panels. The washers were very susceptible to breaking and falling off with age. From what I know, most early 1970 production cars did have the mounting screws. When I restored the car and used NOS Nissan door panels, they did not have provision for the screws AND the factory clips on the new panels did not line up with the holes on the doors. There is a definite difference in mounting points on series one door panels and later versions.

Regarding the plastic seat "bolsters", my car also had them. Once again, the plastic became brittle with age and they tended to break off rather easily (they were not that hearty to begin with and didn't appear to give any support anyway). I believe these were standard on most early Z production, at least up to the fall of 1970. I still have them but removed them during the restoration.

The seat belt hooks to hang the shoulder belts came in 3 versions: plastic coated metal mounted 2/3 up on the seat side for the very early cars (say up to 2/70 or so), same size ALL plastic in the same spot for the rest of the series one cars, and finally larger versions mounted to the quarter window frame. These became obsolete when retractable belts came along.

I believe that Nissan changed subtle items "on the fly" as Z production went along. They also first used up the existing supply of parts before moving on to the "new and improved" version. A good business practice but it also explains the reason for no clear delineation of dates regarding exact characteristics of the 240Z.

Interesting!

[Carl Beck]

Mike my car does not have that ruber mat.

It seems that when the carpet sets made in the US were installed, most of the dealers took all the rubber mats out. A few it seems put the carpet sets over the rubber mats..

Also, was this common on the early cars (factory)....two screws on the bottom of the door panel or common fix for door panels no staying on the door?

Funny - Jim and I talked about this when we were in CT to see #13. The answer is Yes - it was fairly common on early cars.

I can tell you that #20, #42, #239, #584, #1632 And #1777 all had screws holding the bottoms of the door panels in place. #1777 was my first 240Z and at the time - I thought that some of the other cars that came in afterwards were "missing" their screws.

If you pull these panels off, and look you see why. The holes in the door panels that are supposed to hold the door panel clips - - do not line up with the holes and door panel clip holders in the door itself.

On a couple of cars that I have taken apart, the clips were smashed flat and left in place - but most of the time if the door panel had the screws - it was completely missing the clips at the bottom of the panel.

If you have a door panel from a Series I car - that did not use the screws - line it up with the door panel that did use the screws - and see if the holes in the panels are in the same place. If they are, you will know that the holes in the door itself are in the wrong place.

FWIW,

Carl B.

[Duffman]

Mike, my Z (#1399) had the rubber mat under the carpet, like Carl said.

[EVILC]

Great info Carl!

I have some NOS panels I am going to use back on the car. I will take a look at the holes. John, did you have to do anything special with the new panels?

Funny, this entire time....I was thinking someone just screwed the panel to the door to make it fit. Carl, was this a mistake on Nissans part or just made that way. I am also gathering, looks like later in the build process.....Nissan change the hole patteren on the door itself?

I also notice the window roller was in a different spot from where I thought it would be. I thought early Z cars had two on the drivers side near the mirror. My car had one and it was more near the middle of the door. I will check once I get the panel off to see if anything feel into the door.

[Carl Beck]

They usually have one roller per side. There is a right and left roller - don't get them mixed up. If you look at how the window comes up - you will see how the roller should hit it. The windows come up and the glass moves forward..so the roller should be angled a bit forward as the glass contacts it. Also important to have the "stop" in the bottom of the door to prevent the glass from going down too far. {it can drop below the rubber/felt wipers - and when you try to roll it back up - it get caught under them..

FWIW,

Carl B.

[zcar70]

Great info Carl!

I have some NOS panels I am going to use back on the car. I will take a look at the holes. John, did you have to do anything special with the new panels?

Funny, this entire time....I was thinking someone just screwed the panel to the door to make it fit. Carl, was this a mistake on Nissans part or just made that way. I am also gathering, looks like later in the build process.....Nissan change the hole patteren on the door itself?

Clive, I used double sided 3M tape to secure the panels. With the arm rests, grab handle and window cranks, they are quite secure.

[Marty Rogan]

Mike my car does not have that ruber mat.

Also, was this common on the early cars (factory)....two screws on the bottom of the door panel or common fix for door panels no staying on the door?

My car (#5341, blt 6/70) had them when I bought it. I thought someone had done a reair, as I had not seen them before.

Marty

[Marty Rogan]

Clive,

Your bring up a good question that I have wondered about and would like to collect data on: how long were the various early parts used, or what is the highest VIN to have specific early parts? We ofter refer to them as parts for 1969 production cars, but as your car shows many of them were used in early 1970 too. I should make a list of the real early items and start another thread. Does your car have the rubber mats? VIN #1382 is for sale on ebay now http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140371748368&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT and has at least the rear deck rubber mat and I was kind of surprised by that.

-Mike

I have seen the ebay car in person, although briefly, and can attest that it is a pretty nice original example. I didn't go over it with a fine tooth comb or hear it run. The interior is a bit faded, but still pretty nice.

Marty

[JohnnyO]

My car has the rubber deck mat. It was under the carpet when I disassembled the vehicle. I was unaware that this was low vin item.

"You learn more here by accident than elsewhere by design."

[Carl Beck]

About 1800 240Z's came into North America with rubber mats. That included the footwells, the area behind the seats and the rear deck area. By the end of 1970 we had lots of customers ordering the rear deck mat via the Parts Dept. - they used it to protect the carpet in their cars. There are minor differences between the rear deck mats that came in the very early 240Z's and the later type ordered via the Parts Dept. in late 71 and forward. As I recall... the early mats did not have cutouts for the luggage straps to bolt down in front... But I'd have to go dig them all out to be sure...

FWIW,

Carl B.

[Mike B]

About 1800 240Z's came into North America with rubber mats. That included the footwells, the area behind the seats and the rear deck area. By the end of 1970 we had lots of customers ordering the rear deck mat via the Parts Dept. - they used it to protect the carpet in their cars. There are minor differences between the rear deck mats that came in the very early 240Z's and the later type ordered via the Parts Dept. in late 71 and forward. As I recall... the early mats did not have cutouts for the luggage straps to bolt down in front... But I'd have to go dig them all out to be sure...

FWIW,

Carl B.

Carl,

This is a picture of the rear deck mat from HLS30-00032. It does have small holes in the front for the luggage straps to attach to the deck, but the attaching hardware sits on top of the mat and covers the openings, so the holes are not visible one installed. On several 'unmolested' low vin cars I have seen, the rear deck and behind the seat mats were under the original carpet, but the front mats were gone. I assume these were removed by the dealer because both the mats and the carpet have two snaps at the top to attach them to the firewall. If the mats were left under the carpet, the carpet wouldn't be able to be secured and could pose a driving hazard by getting bunched up under the pedals. Here is a link to a thread about the rubber mats http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30706.

[JohnnyO]

Carl, My rear rubber mat does have cutouts for the bolts and appear to be "stamped" out. Not sure what you found with your set.

Edit: Mike, you beat me to the punch. That is what mine looks like, and yes, my front mats were missing but I do have the passenger side Datsun rubber mat. Not sure if that was after market or not.

Edited January 7, 2010 by JohnnyO