Differential dispute

[chicago240z]

I need an answer to my problem? first the problem, I sold a differential from a 1972 240z with automatic trans under the impression it was an r180 for 80 bucks delivered to milwaukee 40 miles from my house fair price right?his buddy met me to pick it up there,now hes telling me that it is a r160 diff and wants money back because according to him they are worth far less than 80?

does a r160 even fit in a 240z with automatic? it was from a parts car but i cant see why the p.o. would have used this if possible the diff looked like a r180 wish I took pics of it

Thanks all

[pwd]

I'll defer to the forum experts, but my data says that no 240Z, auto or manual, ever came with an R160 installed.

[jmortensen]

It's possible that someone installed an R160 later, but not likely. $80 is probably fair for either, but if the guy doesn't want it the easy thing to do is take it back and sell it to someone else. Plenty of pics of both here or at hybridz so you should be able to figure out what it really is pretty easily.

[IdahoKidd]

Carl Beck has some info at

http://www.zhome.com/ZCMnL/tech/GearRatios.html

It doesn't mention the 160 on anything

[jmortensen]

It wasn't a stock diff for a 240Z, but some racers put them in because they're lighter, and everything should just bolt right up, so I think it is possible that someone had an accident and used what they could find. They came stock in the 510 and a LOT of different Subarus.

[Carl Beck]

I need an answer to my problem? first the problem, I sold a differential from a 1972 240z with automatic trans under the impression it was an r180 for 80 bucks delivered to milwaukee 40 miles from my house fair price right?

It wouldn't be a fair price in my opinion. First, how many 3.5 R-180's would one find in that area of the country; and second on top of $125.00 price, there should have been at least a $25.00 delivery fee. If he didn't want to pay the delivery fee - let him pay the shipping $65.00 to $75.00... I'd say it was as steal for the buyer.

his buddy met me to pick it up there,now hes telling me that it is a r160 diff and wants money back because according to him they are worth far less than 80?

I'd ask him why he believes it is an R-160 in the first place. Did he call you the same day or did this revelation take place after some third party told him it was an R-160.??? Ask him to tell you why he believes it's R-160... If his answer is that some one else told him - tell him it is too bad that person didn't come inspect it before the purchase was completed. The second alternative is to tell him to return it to your house - and give him his money back. I most certainly would NOT go get it 40 miles away..

does a r160 even fit in a 240z with automatic? it was from a parts car but i cant see why the p.o. would have used this if possible the diff looked like a r180 wish I took pics of it

Thanks all

It is "unlikely" but possible - - the PO might have found an R-160 with a 4.11 posi unit... out of some other vehicle. If that is the case - grab it back.. then resell it for $225.00.

Just my opinion - but some buyers that don't bother to verify what they are buying - then later decide they shouldn't have bought it - shouldn't expect a return policy from the seller...

FWIW,

Carl B.

[tlorber]

Ask him to take a picture of it. I saw a guy's manual Z once with a 160 in it (I believe he said it was from a Subaru) and it was visibly smaller than a 180. This should not be hard to confirm.

If it IS a 160, personally I'd have the guy bring it back and give him back his cash. Then go sell it elsewhere.

[EScanlon]

...snip...buyers that don't bother to verify what they are buying - then later decide they shouldn't have bought it - shouldn't expect a return policy from the seller...

FWIW,

Carl B.

Nor a rebate if they found it cheaper elsewhere or have a bad case of buyer's remorse. I believe they call that CAVEAT EMPTOR!

If he b!tches, have him read the fine print on his receipt.... which I'll bet you did not give him, and he also failed to provide a purchase order, in which case simple contract law applies: Offer, Consideration, Acceptance.

That he used a proxy to take delivery of the item does not void that.

You offered it for sale, he gave you money for it (consideration), then he took delivery (acceptance). Contract/transaction finished.

Unless you modified that with a written receipt detailing your return policy or price guarantee, and/or he provided a purchase order that specified the condition, price, warranty he expected you to fulfill; THEN he has a case. If not... as my sister says: "Tough Beans!"

In my opinion, if you are looking to "save face" with this individual... for whatever reason, THEN pacify him. If you are NOT looking to save face, tell him to take a long walk off a short pier.

If he tries to slander you, remind him that THAT may be actionable in court (that's where you check with a lawyer and take his pants away.)

JMO

E

[olzed]

Just for info. I had a Subaru LSD 4.1, which I removed from a vehicle at Pic A Part, cost $45. Modified the drive stubs, to allow bolting up the origional half shafts from my 72 240. Took one drive down the highway, came home and removed it. Made the car into a dog IMHO.I went back to a 3.5. Much nicer drive. BTW the 240 and Subaru diffs look exactly the same. The Subaru was a R 160.

Oh and I would just ignore this fool.

He may have already removed your good diffs internals and put in his stuffed parts.

Edited September 29, 2010 by olzed

[doradox]

Nor a rebate if they found it cheaper elsewhere or have a bad case of buyer's remorse. I believe they call that CAVEAT EMPTOR!

If he b!tches, have him read the fine print on his receipt.... which I'll bet you did not give him, and he also failed to provide a purchase order, in which case simple contract law applies: Offer, Consideration, Acceptance.

That he used a proxy to take delivery of the item does not void that.

You offered it for sale, he gave you money for it (consideration), then he took delivery (acceptance). Contract/transaction finished.

Unless you modified that with a written receipt detailing your return policy or price guarantee, and/or he provided a purchase order that specified the condition, price, warranty he expected you to fulfill; THEN he has a case. If not... as my sister says: "Tough Beans!"

In my opinion, if you are looking to "save face" with this individual... for whatever reason, THEN pacify him. If you are NOT looking to save face, tell him to take a long walk off a short pier.

If he tries to slander you, remind him that THAT may be actionable in court (that's where you check with a lawyer and take his pants away.)

JMO

E

Are you saying that if I misrepresent something to you and you purchase it but it turns out it really isn't what I told you it was then it's your tough luck?

Steve

[Glockrebel]

Are you saying that if I misrepresent something to you and you purchase it but it turns out it really isn't what I told you it was then it's your tough luck?

Steve

I’d take Carl’s advice. Misrepresentation, intentional or unintentional, is all the same.

[EScanlon]

Are you saying that if I misrepresent something to you and you purchase it but it turns out it really isn't what I told you it was then it's your tough luck?

Steve

emphasis mine

No, and don't put words in my mouth.

Misrepresentation puts a different spin on things. That's what false advertising is all about.

If the item was intentionally (tricky to prove by the way) misrepresented, then it's fraud ... period. Not much more can be said.

If it is unintentional, then a simple offer to refund would suffice. Or in the case of a business, a price reduction to what the item's actual selling price would be. (Interesting to note that when someone gets the better part of a deal, they're NOT going to come back and allow the seller to charge more.)

However an individual who is not in the business of selling parts or wouldn't necessarily know the selling price of the lesser item shouldn't be forced to accept the price reduction tendered by the buyer. The buyer is not going to offer an equitable price. It would be up to the seller to decide what would be correct. If the buyer doesn't like it,, then get a refund.

But, and this an important but, if the original advertisement or offer for sale SPECIFICALLY expressed that there is/was some uncertainty as to the item's actual or supposed characteristics, then it's up to the buyer to ascertain whether it meets his purpose and/or whether it is or isn't what the item is purported to be. And at that point, if the item proved to NOT be what the buyer thought it would be... then YES, tough luck.

However, let me turn it around on you and see if it isn't an unfair question both ways.

Are you saying that if the item is misrepresented / mis-identified and instead of being a lesser item (as apparently an R-160 vs an R-180) instead it is a highly desireable item such as a Racing LSD, would you go back and offer to pay the seller MORE money for it?

I'll bet you don't even let them know.

A FAIR transaction is fair, regardless of which side of the transaction you are on. If it favors one side over the other, then it's obviously NOT fair.

In this specific example, only the seller is explaining his side. The buyer could just as easily be lying as to the identification of the differential. So, have the guy return it, and get his money back.

Wonder if he would accept that? That would be the true measure of his dissatisfaction.

E