Running Rich or Lean? How to really tell?

[argniest]

http://www.autometer.com/media_newsarticle.aspx?yr=2007&mo=5&pg=1&aid=66 Check this out, might be the closest you will get to your search. I love the autometer stuff, tough as nails and really accurate.

It looks like those are showing AFR, which is good to know, but I was also looking for something with an LED readout for my fuel pressure too. Im a computer programmer, so I like having data I can see in real time.

I wonder if they make fuel pressure guage that can display its output on an LED, like the guages you mentioned above??? I suppose it must be possible, hey, we put men on the moon didnt we in the 1960's

madkaw: you wrote: Think about spending(wideband O2) 200+$ to ideally tune your car . These work on carberated cars as well as Elec fuel injectoed cars too, right? I know thats a dumb question. But I would think they work the same, once the exhaust leaves the engine, who cares how it got that way....

Is this the kind of meter that would be useful to help monitor AFR while I am testing and experimenting with the different systems in the car, as I go along....

http://www.amazon.com/Innovate-LM-1-Digital-Ratio-Meter/dp/B000N8DL4G/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1295070641&sr=8-3

Also, they make an exhaust clamp for the LM-1

http://www.amazon.com/Innovate-Motorsports-3728-Exhaust-Cast-Stainless/dp/B000CO9MF8/ref=pd_bxgy_auto_text_b

Then they have the LM-2 http://www.amazon.com/Innovate-Motorsports-3837-Digital-Wideband/dp/B001S7W836/ref=pd_bxgy_auto_img_c

hmmmmm which is better or more useful for my sitation ...I am not sure, I will have to read these specs over again. They seem similar to me. Maybe its just the data logging that is a main difference?????

Edited January 15, 2011 by argniest

[madkaw]

Wideband is for internal combustion engine. It doesn't matter if it is N/A or boosted, carburated or injected.

[TomoHawk]

Why bother with an Oxygen sensor or those fancy gauges? The E. F.I. system, is so simple that there is almost nothing to adjust or that is adjusted. You only need to adjust the AFM bypass for the proper CO reading (at the tailpipe) and that's it, IF it needs to be adjusted, if ever. The FSM doesn't even have the word "oxygen" anywhere!

If your water sensor, TPS, and AFM are giving the correct resistances, and the wiring/connectors aren't contributing anything, then it should be right on the spec, like mine is.

I'm almost expecting to be reading about somebody wanting to "chip" the ECU, like the "fuel injection experts" have mentioned to me, twice so far...

BTW, on a 280Z, you can adjust the fuel injection system with a swiss army knife too.

Edited January 15, 2011 by TomoHawk

[argniest]

Why bother with an Oxygen sensor or those fancy gauges? The E. F.I. system, is so simple that there is almost nothing to adjust or that is adjusted. You only need to adjust the AFM bypass for the proper CO reading (at the tailpipe) and that's it, IF it needs to be adjusted, if ever. The FSM doesn't even have the word "oxygen" anywhere!

If your water sensor, TPS, and AFM are giving the correct resistances, and the wiring/connectors aren't contributing anything, then it should be right on the spec, like mine is.

I'm almost expecting to be reading about somebody wanting to "chip" the ECU, like the "fuel injection experts" have mentioned to me, twice so far...

BTW, on a 280Z, you can adjust the fuel injection system with a swiss army knife too.

I am saying all this in a positive tone, but you may not think so. But I am. :-)

OK so, I have called several garages around here, and so far none of them have a CO meter. I dont know how else I can get a CO reading at the tailpipe if I dont have a meter to do it?

Do they sell CO meters that a novice like me can purchase and use to help me as I work on the Z car. I would pay for it. I dont mind. I have saved money for toys.

Look, my car is 33 years old. And while its in good shape and running OK, I know it needs a lot of TLC. Because I have had a few mechanics look at the engine, listen to it, take some AFR readings, inspect some things, read the spark plugs, pull the head cover, etc....

Its not simple to me at all. The FSM has dozens and dozens of pages of things to check out in the EFI. To me, that is not easy in any way.

Look I am not stupid, I am a very good software engineer of large enterprise ready systems used by the military and big corporations, but I have never worked on automobiles except for very minor stuff.

I bought the Z car because I love them, but also wanted to learn about how to make it run nicely in the process. All the things you said above, will not be easy at all for me to figure out the first time, and to make sure I am doing it right. Sure after the first time getting all those readings, THEN it will be easy.

Eventually, I succeed at what I set out to do. However...with the Z car I need a lot of help and patience to get me through this. This is a big project for me to undertake.

I am glad YOU think its easy , maybe you can come up here and help me get it running to spec.

So, to answer your question, I like having hands on data that can tell me things. I am used to it, from working with computers and technology all the time. I like the idea of guages, meters, readings, etc

Edited January 16, 2011 by argniest

[ChrisZ]

So, to answer your question, I like having hands on data that can tell me things. I am used to it, from working with computers and technology all the time. I like the idea of guages, meters, readings, etc

In that case, you should really consider going Megasquirt.

[argniest]

In that case, you should really consider going Megasquirt.

baby steps man baby steps....first I want to get my current car running close to specs as I can. Drive it for a while, then look into fancy upgrades :-)

[torker]

http://www.vehiclecontrols.com/shopping/shop650/shopdisplaycategories.asp

Long damn URL eh... I just got a VDO tach. from this site. Not sure if they have what you want but they seem to carry a ton of stuff.

[TomoHawk]

No problem, arg. I think you are 'on the path to enlightenment' here.

I like to break things down in to the engine mechanical, the ignition, and the fuel injection systems. Then break it down further from there (battery/charging, vacuum, etc.)

After working on mine for so many summers, I've found that the 280Z fuel injection Bible can help you keep things in top working order. I just go through the trouble-shooting section to verify that every input to the ECU is right and assuming the ECU itself is OK, then the engine should be just fine. If not then go after that item. If you really do have a problem with the ignition system, there are trouble-shooting documents for that too.

IMO, All the talk about oxygen sensors is just not appropriate right now, until you have an engine that is working just right. Most people come equipped with their own AFR sensor, and it should get you headed in the right direction.

Otherwise, just check all the wiring & connections, clean everything, and try not to overdo your driving until everything is just right.

Don't forget to keep a detailed maintenance log of maintenance, repairs and upgrades/replacements- of everything, even wiper blades!

Edited January 16, 2011 by TomoHawk

[FastWoman]

Tomo, it's not as simple as that. The ECU can drift over time. At least that's what Cozye and I have found. We both got EVERYTHING in our systems to spec, and the mix would still be off. We both had to richen our mixes quite a lot to get our engines running well.

The idea of a wideband sensor is appealing. It might be something useful to stick in one of those gauge pod pillar thingies.

[TomoHawk]

Mine hasn't changed over the last 3 or 4 years, according to the tester at the local e-check station.

[argniest]

I really like the EFI bible. But being a noob to working on cars, its all very overwhelming. And its not that I am in a hurry, but I do really want it to be drivable to anywhere in the USA if I wanted. I am anxious to learn some things too.

I am working on cleaning all connections first of all as people have suggested. All the grounds too. I just got all new fuses in their last night and cleaned up the fuse box. I have new fuel injectors but I am not sticking them in the car, until some of these other things have been addressed first

I am hoping I can find a local garage that has a emission analyzer that can tell me my CO levels. Once I get all this stuff cleaned, and see how/what the engine does after that.

[argniest]

Ok, well I got an innovate LM-1 with an external exhaust clamp. Since for now, I dont want to install it permanently because I want to use it on my other cars too. And see what kind of readings I get from them too.

Does anyone else have any numbers they can throw at me, from their experiences, on a 1978 Z car using one of these meters. Im curious what a normal operating AFR should be at idle, accelarate, and high speed.

And should other cars (like a chevy monte carlo or chevy blazer) operate with similar readings? I am just wondering if all cars should have readings that are close to each other, when idling, accelarate and top speed.