280Z 5-speed in an early 240Z Console Cutting

[redzedsled]

New user to this website so bear with me. I have a 12/70 240z and am in the middle of installing a 5-speed transmission from a '77 280Z. I know this topic has been batted around quite a bit, and I have read most all previous threads on this topic. I understand that to facilitate the later B-Type 4-speed or 5-speed transmission, one has to trim the frontmost part of the transmission tunnel and install the later boot from a 72-78 Z car. The reason is obvious once installed, as the transmission is set forward considerably. The car had been hacked slightly 1/2" with the previous owner using the later B-type 4-speed transmission. The 5-speed is about 1/16" shorter than the 240Z 4-speed B-type. As it stands now the early boot will not actually slip over the shifter as there is simply no clearance. I am OK with removing some metal and installing the new boot... but when I mocked up the console today, it was clear that some of the console was also removed by the previous owner. I now have a console that I picked up which is in rather exceptional condition with no altering of the fibreglass construction. I have a lot of hesitation in cutting the tranny tunnel metal, and now to alter this nice console is killing me. There is no way for the early console to sit correctly without removing a portion of the console. I have a later S-shaped shifter from another 240Z, but this alone is not enough to gain clearance. Is there anyway around the cutting of the early console, or is it something that just has to be done. Rob<p>

Edited June 26, 2011 by redzedsled
adding image

[Arne]

Rob, there is another option. It requires cutting and welding on the later shift lever. Here's a couple of places with some details and info.

http://classicmotorsports.net/project-cars/1970-datsun-240z/digging-datsun-details/

http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?31383-zx-5-speed-shifter-modification&highlight=weld+shift+lever

http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?24759-5-speed-in-a-4-speed-question/page3

[redzedsled]

Thanks for the links... I just had my shifter re-chromed (shame). It's either alter the transmission tunnel and console or alter the shifter then... which is the lesser of the two evils?

[Arne]

To me? The shift lever, hands down. I refuse to do anything to the car itself that isn't reversible.

[redzedsled]

Arne, I think that is wise advice, afterall the positioning of the shifter is too far forward, so it makes sense to increase the bottom length of the shifter closer to its original position. Having stated that, I will move forward and mig-weld the tranny tunnel "hack job" back to stock specs, use the the smaller early shift boot, and then alter the shifter as specified in the link you so kindy sent me. I appreciate your tips, this seems to be the best way to go. Rob

[redzedsled]

After some review, I think the small area that was cut by the previous owner is important. Even if I alter the shifter there is still a shortage of space to move into the uppermost gears. So i think I will leave the 1/2" notch alone, otherwise the shift path would be obstructed. The old style shorter shift boot was a bit of hastle stretching over the shift bracket, but it can be done. At least no further cutting of the tunnel will be required.

[redzedsled]

Just thought I would post an update and a few pics to demonstrate how the 5-speed in a Series I 240Z went.

I chose to weld the transmission tunnel back to original stock specs.

I drew out a plan at 1:1 ratio so I could match the contour of the drawing. I then fabricated a shifter by means of a few cuts, welds, and a little bit of straightening with heat to create an offset shifter that will not interfere with the metal in the transmission tunnel.

I have now chosen to use a 5-speed from a later model 280ZX, the one with the close ratio gears. This particular 5-speed has a hole for the shifter pin that is significantly lower in position than the conventional 5-speed from a 280Z (please reference pic). The ears of the shifter supports have to ground down to about 1" from the base of the ears. Whatwith the lower positioning now, it gives me an extra 1/8" clearance between the the transmission ears and the body of the transmission tunnel, giving me a total of 3/8 total clearance.

Now that the modified shifter has been installed, it brings back the center position of the shifter handle directly through the original position through the console. I made sure that there was clearance in all gears to ensure a smooth path to all gears without obstruction. The offset matched the difference in length from the 280ZX tranny and the stock transmission it came with.

By modifying the shifter this way, the shifter worked out to be only about 3/8" shorter than the original s-shaped shifter it was made from. With all these mods to the shifter and transmission, I can now enjoy a shifter that comes straight up through an unaltered Series I console without hitting the console nor the body metal of the tranny tunnel.

This lesson is only applicable to the Series I 240 owners, who want a 5-speed in their car. This 5-speed will marry up nicely against the 3.9 ratio R180 rear end. The only issue I have had is the fitting of the small shifter boot. Normally the shifter comes out the top of the boot, and in this case the shifter comes out the side of the shifter. The boot does still fit and stay in place but perhaps a better fitting boot could be used. The much larger rubber boot above it, fits without any obstruction, provided you use the later 5-speed from a 280ZX.

Edited February 6, 2012 by redzedsled

[Diseazd]

PJOE just did the same thing with his shifter, but used heat to bend the B shifter to fit the console without cutting the shifter or welding it. It too worked without cutting the tunnel or console. Nice work!

Edited February 6, 2012 by Diseazd

[tamo3]

One of the private shop used to sell similar quick shift in Japan.

http://www6.airnet.ne.jp/~magic-as/transmissionfestival/SuperQuickShift/4907.jpg

http://www6.airnet.ne.jp/~magic-as/transmissionfestival/SuperQuickShift/4909.jpg

http://www6.airnet.ne.jp/~magic-as/transmissionfestival/SuperQuickShift/4912.jpg

http://www6.airnet.ne.jp/~magic-as/transmissionfestival/transmissionfestival081022.html

[LeonV]

Nice job, impressive work!

[Marty Rogan]

[ATTACH=CONFIG]51130[/ATTACH]Just thought I would post an update and a few pics to demonstrate how the 5-speed in a Series I 240Z went.

I chose to weld the transmission tunnel back to original stock specs.

I drew out a plan at 1:1 ratio so I could match the contour of the drawing. I then fabricated a shifter by means of a few cuts, welds, and a little bit of straightening with heat to create an offset shifter that will not interfere with the metal in the transmission tunnel.

I have now chosen to use a 5-speed from a later model 280ZX, the one with the close ratio gears. This particular 5-speed has a hole for the shifter pin that is significantly lower in position than the conventional 5-speed from a 280Z (please reference pic). The ears of the shifter supports have to ground down to about 1" from the base of the ears. Whatwith the lower positioning now, it gives me an extra 1/8" clearance between the the transmission ears and the body of the transmission tunnel, giving me a total of 3/8 total clearance.

Now that the modified shifter has been installed, it brings back the center position of the shifter handle directly through the original position through the console. I made sure that there was clearance in all gears to ensure a smooth path to all gears without obstruction. The offset matched the difference in length from the 280ZX tranny and the stock transmission it came with.

By modifying the shifter this way, the shifter worked out to be only about 3/8" shorter than the original s-shaped shifter it was made from. With all these mods to the shifter and transmission, I can now enjoy a shifter that comes straight up through an unaltered Series I console without hitting the console nor the body metal of the tranny tunnel.

This lesson is only applicable to the Series I 240 owners, who want a 5-speed in their car. This 5-speed will marry up nicely against the 3.9 ratio R180 rear end. The only issue I have had is the fitting of the small shifter boot. Normally the shifter comes out the top of the boot, and in this case the shifter comes out the side of the shifter. The boot does still fit and stay in place but perhaps a better fitting boot could be used. The much larger rubber boot above it, fits without any obstruction, provided you use the later 5-speed from a 280ZX.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]51126[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]51121[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]51130[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]51127[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]51122[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]51119[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]51128[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]51124[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]51120[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]51129[/ATTACH]

So, you just ground down the ears of the tranny where the shifter pivot installs and that gave you enough clearance to install the early style trans tunnel boot? Do you have any pictures showing that installed?

Also, have you driven the car with everything put together? Did the rubber boot pull the shifter out of gear? I had that issue on my yellow car.

Marty

[redzedsled]

At this point the transmission is not in the car, so I don't have any pics at this moment. I will make a point to follow-up with some finished pics. Initially I mocked up the early boot with the 280Z 5-speed (see attached pic above), and was not an easy chore, but it did go on. With the later 280ZX 5-speed as I mentioned, the pin is much lower, so it allows you to grind down those huge ears enough that you are gaining an extra 3/16 or so for the large boot to go around it all.

I could see why the small boot could be a problem for this application, however I have yet to actually test it out on the road. I have been keeping my eye out for other makes and models of boots that would be a better fit. I hope I don't have the same problem as you have had, but perhaps a different boot would be the ticket.

Below see a side by side comparison of the two 5-speeds in question... these pics were taken before I starting grinding down the ears.

Edited February 7, 2012 by redzedsled