1971 FairladyZ-L starter circuit problem - help needed

[Kerrigan]

The 1971 FairladyZ-L for a while would occasionally just make a single "click" relay-type sound somewhere under the dash when I turned the key to "Start" and the starter didn't do anything. I would turn the key off, and then try again sometimes with the same result. Usually it would work the second or third time and the starter would engage. We replaced the starter, the switch on the end of the ignition tumbler, and checked the battery. All those checked out okay. When it just made the click there wouldn't be any electricity at the starter solenoid b/y wire where it connected to the solenoid tab. I jumped from the battery to the solenoid and the starter worked.

Now it doesn't work at all; just the "click" noise when I turn the key to start.

The wiring diagrams I have don't show anything between the ignition switch and the starter solenoid except for a lock-out on a car with an automatic tranny; we have a factory 5-speed manual transmission.

Something under the dash makes the "click" sound when I try to start the car with the key.

What I should be looking for causing the problem of no electricity from the ignition switch to the starter solenoid?

Thank you.

[SteveJ]

The click you hear is the accessory relay. The coil energizes when the key passes through the ON position and de-energizes in the Start position.

The ignition switch can go bad. Disconnect the wiring harness from the back of the switch. Turn the key to Start and check for continuity between the pins where the White/Red wire and Black/Yellow wire would go.

If you have continuity at the ignition switch pins, check the continuity of the Black/Yellow wire from the ignition switch plug to the solenoid. If you don't have continuity, check the condition of the harness and check plug between the dash harness and the engine harness.

[black gold man]

Have you ever heard of ford solenoid fix it has been used for years on many cars.

http://www.google.com/search?um=1&hl=en&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&biw=1024&bih=629&q=ford%20%20solenoid%20240z%20starter&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=iw&ei=E42wT4GjFpGo8QSawYTcCA

http://www.google.com/search?um=1&hl=en&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&biw=1024&bih=629&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=H42wT__HN46y8AT21_D5CA&q=ford%20solenoid%20240z%20starter&orq=ford++solenoid+240z+starter#um=1&hl=en&tbm=isch&sa=1&q=ford+solenoid+wiring+diagram+&oq=ford+solenoid+wiring+diagram+&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&gs_l=img.12...25851.26682.11.29018.12.0.2.10.12.0.0.0..0.0...0.0.YDNoEcw2VyE&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&fp=be09e5fa3374c191&biw=1024&bih=629

[beermanpete]

There is likely too much voltage drop in the wiring. Check the voltage at the solenoid when you turn the key (with the wire connected to the soleniod). If it falls below about 11 volts there is a dirty or corroded terminal somewhere. There are a lot of connections between the battery and the soleniod. It is likely there is a little voltage drop in each and the total is enough to cause the problem.

If you can't fix it by cleaning the connectors a relay will work, as Black Gold Man said. You don't realy need the Ford realy though. A horn realy will work just fine.

[zKars]

This has been a pretty common problem for many.

One of the more unusual situations that I struggled with at one time was the connection between the wire and the spade terminal on the end of the wire at the starter solenoid. It had gone bad from I'm sure from pulling the connector off by pulling the wire rather than by grasping the connector when pulling it off, and the repitition of doing so while trouble shooting the starter problem.

The bad connection inside the dirty rubber/plastic connector sheath was invisible, and it was intermittent. Take it off, put it on, it would work, then stop working. All it took was a quick snip and a replacement terminal attached. A standard 1/4 female spade terminal is all it takes. Strip back the insulation, clean the undoubtly dirty wire strands inside, crimp on a new connector, solder it for security, add shrink tube, and your back in business.

Momma used to get git so mad when I was little when I yanked the cord for the chainsaw out of the wall from 10 feet away. Made me use the machete to clear that bush for a week to learn me a lesson. Never did it again. After I started kindergarten she finally let me use the tractor to clear that last acre. Some lessons you never forget.

[Kerrigan]

Ah Ha!

That makes sense.

Thank you!

The click you hear is the accessory relay. The coil energizes when the key passes through the ON position and de-energizes in the Start position.

The ignition switch can go bad. Disconnect the wiring harness from the back of the switch. Turn the key to Start and check for continuity between the pins where the White/Red wire and Black/Yellow wire would go.

If you have continuity at the ignition switch pins, check the continuity of the Black/Yellow wire from the ignition switch plug to the solenoid. If you don't have continuity, check the condition of the harness and check plug between the dash harness and the engine harness.

[Kerrigan]

I'll check those connections and replace the spade connector.

This has been a pretty common problem for many.

One of the more unusual situations that I struggled with at one time was the connection between the wire and the spade terminal on the end of the wire at the starter solenoid. It had gone bad from I'm sure from pulling the connector off by pulling the wire rather than by grasping the connector when pulling it off, and the repitition of doing so while trouble shooting the starter problem.

The bad connection inside the dirty rubber/plastic connector sheath was invisible, and it was intermittent. Take it off, put it on, it would work, then stop working. All it took was a quick snip and a replacement terminal attached. A standard 1/4 female spade terminal is all it takes. Strip back the insulation, clean the undoubtly dirty wire strands inside, crimp on a new connector, solder it for security, add shrink tube, and your back in business.

Momma used to get git so mad when I was little when I yanked the cord for the chainsaw out of the wall from 10 feet away. Made me use the machete to clear that bush for a week to learn me a lesson. Never did it again. After I started kindergarten she finally let me use the tractor to clear that last acre. Some lessons you never forget.

[LeonV]

There is likely too much voltage drop in the wiring. Check the voltage at the solenoid when you turn the key (with the wire connected to the soleniod). If it falls below about 11 volts there is a dirty or corroded terminal somewhere. There are a lot of connections between the battery and the soleniod. It is likely there is a little voltage drop in each and the total is enough to cause the problem.

If you can't fix it by cleaning the connectors a relay will work, as Black Gold Man said. You don't realy need the Ford realy though. A horn realy will work just fine.

It's a common problem, I'm with Pete on this one. I bet there is voltage going to your solenoid (you may even hear the solenoid click in the engine bay) but there is not enough voltage available. As Pete alludes to, there are many terminals in which voltage drops will occur.

I had the same problem in my 260 when I first got it. The PO wired in a starter switch to bypass the wiring, but had created a dead short of the dash instruments and turn signals in the process. Stupid move. I bought a $2 30A relay from ebay, wired it in, and no problems since. Starts on the first turn, every time.

Here's where I got my relays: http://www.ebay.com/itm/5-PACK-12V-DC-30A-40A-Relay-Socket-SPDT-Bosch-Style-/221021666426?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3375eafc7a&vxp=mtr

[roy-73-240z]

Here's a nice write up on the problem and a fix for it. I had the same thing happen to me a couple times.

http://xenons30.com/starterrelay.html

[Kerrigan]

Thanks Roy.

The click I'm hearing is the accessory relay that cuts out the accessory circuit when the key is moved from on to start. I'm not getting anything to the starter solenoid so I'm going to change the connector, and if that doesn't do it, pull the steering column shroud and check the ignition switch itself for continuity.

I've had this problem ever since I had Nissan make a new key with their punchout device. I'm wondering if it just isn't turning far enough to make the contact. I have to pull the key out slightly to get it to turn at all.

Now if I could just find my original ... stashed somewhere "safe" ....

Here's a nice write up on the problem and a fix for it. I had the same thing happen to me a couple times.

http://xenons30.com/starterrelay.html

[EScanlon]

I would suggest you start out with the simplest thing to check first.... the ignition switch behind the ignition lock. This is a known problem item that over time can shift enough to cause the exact symptoms you mention in your first post... intermittent contact to the starter.

AFTER checking the switch, then go to the more complex checks. Several members have saved themselves hours of troubleshooting simply by replacing the switch.

FWIW

E

[black gold man]

He said switch was replaced. The reason the ford solenoid works well is will work with as little as 6 volts through the old wires.

Edited May 15, 2012 by black gold man