What makes a Z a Z? What modifacations go too far to be called a Z?

[grannyknot]

I was 10 yrs old when the Z came out and it was stunning! Me and the rest of the guys I charged around thought it was the cats arse. For me the exterior style is a Z,

Nissan built a great car but it had lots of flaws like every other of that era. They had to make a profit on each unit, so,

they cut some corners. Now that I own one I don't have to cut corners, I can put in more comfortable seats in, more reliable wiring, a more powerful engine, better headlights and on and on. As long as I don't screw with the true beauty of the car, the lines, the thing that grabs everyone, then I am only enhancing the practical matters, not the essence.

Chris

[72 OJ]

Hey, guys I just got back from a local happy hour thing, I swear on my way there ,I stop at the 7-11 for cigs and a well dressed guy comes to me and says ''nice Z ''. Then while parking I get a '' super clean 240 ''from a guy getting out of a very nice BMW. Had the mandatory Mojitos, and when I pulled to my driveway ,my neighbor's visitor shouts '' tight Datsun''.......................

[hls30.com]

hls30.com you must be related to EScanlon,,,,, if you use a quote please use it as intended and not just select parts of it to misinformed , MY seduction was to the beauty of the car's condition, its preservation, its provenance and yes the updated drive train. SHE IS ALL ''Z'' with an ATTITUDE.

I have been called worse, but, if the story of Adam and Eve is the correct, I am just as related to you! Oddly enough EScanlon and I had a serious pride filled altercation on line-over a vendor-it is all here in the archives...WE get along pretty well now.

Back to your post. While you do talk about her history and previous condition, No where in there do you talk about your explicit reaction to her beauty, condition, or state of preservation...your intent may have been different than your words, but the only words that point to directly to anything specific are exactly: " big red heart that pulses her seduced me, she growl to me and I took her home." It could be differences in our modes of communication, If someone asks me about my Zs I tell them exactly what pulls me to them-I answer a question with such a passionate answer using active voice, passive voice is for what I really don't get to excited about. You do seem to react differently, and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that, and you don't need to defend it. Your opinion is every bit as valid as mine, we made choices on cars because of them, mine is different from yours-no better or worse, just different, and that just means I won't be competing for what you want, driving up the price!

Don't misunderstand, I didn't knock your car at all, it is well thought out and beautifully executed from what I can see in the pictures you have posted. I can't imagine anyone not being happy to see it at any car show(except maybe its competition).

The point of this thread is not to change minds, merely to expose them to different viewpoints-and you have been a great participant!

As far as your last post...1) I bet you didn't pop the hood before the comments were made, and 2) people who are not experienced with a car and are not informed know only what they can readily observe, and have no chance to comment on what they can't...regardless of whether it is because of a closed hood, or the fact that other than at that moment they simply don't care enough about a Datsun or a 240Z to look into them-or both!

I bet I could put 240Z badges on a well kept Volvo 1800 and most people who would comment and did not really know a 240Z would comment about the nice 240Z...until I popped the hood and the Volvo valve cover caught their attention. If you want to really prove a point about something most people don't know about, you have to prove it using people that actually do know about it and provide full details.

Edited August 1, 2012 by hls30.com

[doradox]

What matters (to me) is what Nissan themselves called the cars, and that is something that you should certainly take notice of.

There, I fixed it for you.

[hls30.com]

I'm with John, although I'll go with the VIN stamped into the body as the ultimate say. And I'll also second everything Alan has contributed. Everything else is as fluffy as a 9th grader's English paper.

The problem with that is your California DMV and your Insurance Company, will tell you different, whether it is by changing the rates they charge, the emissions you must meet, or adding a string to your title for a modified vehicle. Not all states are that way, but I have yet to see an insurance company that did not get keenly interested-and sharpen their pencil-when asked to insure a vehicle with a swapped engine-if it was as original that would not be the case. John is in New England-no clue about their DMV, but I bet John could drive around it!

Edited August 1, 2012 by hls30.com

[TomoHawk]

OK, according to the poll,a deviation from the stock engine is a significant part of what people are concerned with. But the most popular answer involves Too many Exterior Modifications. As long a you keep the hood closed, which is how you see a car as it drives by, you can't really tell what engine is there, but the exterior modifications can stick out like a big red wart of your nose.. I wonder how radical people can get with external modifications.

[hls30.com]

OK, according to the poll,a deviation from the stock engine is a significant part of what people are concerned with. But the most popular answer involves Too many Exterior Modifications. As long a you keep the hood closed, which is how you see a car as it drives by, you can't really tell what engine is there, but the exterior modifications can stick out like a big red wart of your nose.. I wonder how radical people can get with external modifications.

Tomowan,

Remember Zness is in the eyes of the beholder, but by the same token there are some cars that you may not want to see because you cant un-see them, and the visual image may be damaging to your eyes. There are several threads here that have many of these in them-you have even participated in some of those, but some threads are better left unopened...in my opinion...there is one Caterpillar yellow "Z" snow plow that comes to mind...and will not leave-damn.

On that vein Japan had/has a somewhat popular practice of putting seriously oversize spoilers on cars-there is a thread on that somewhere-and that definitely is off my scale for lost Zness.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and to be correct in their own eyes, and to share their opinion when asked, but no opinion is necessarily right other than to its beholder-I am just aS interested in the opinions we have here as I am the cars.

[gnosez]

Since I have a heavily modified 240Z, let me list as many as I can remember and you can decide which one(s) move it into the "no longer a Z" column.

Engine: 3.2L Rebello, triple 44mm Mikunis, TWM air box and K&N air filter, Pertonix in a euro dizzy, MSD 6AL and tach adaptor, MSA jet coated header-wrapped, AZ 6-qt oil pan with Brad Penn 20-50w green oil, GM 120amp one wire alternator, Coolflex hoses, AZ Z radiator, twin fans, custom dampener, 8mm mag wires, NGK plugs (#7), and Mallory comp fuel pump.

Suspension: TTT LCAs, TTT T/C rods, AZJDM outer tie rods, AZ Z RCAs, STS front and rear sway bars, bump steer spacers, poly bushings, GC biscuit style camber plates, cut down struts, Tokico HTS shocks, 275F/250R GC springs, PDK front strut bar, roll bar and MSA rear strut bar, 2.2 neg front camber w/4 degrees caster - 2 degrees neg rear, 0 toe, and corner balanced.

Drivetrain: 1980 280ZX tranny, race balanced drive shaft, Rod Tyler diff mount w/GM ploy bushing mount, 3:90 diff w/Quaife, 300ZXT CVs with MMS stub axles, BBS style CWW 16-inch wheels w/ Yokohoma 225/50 fronts - 245/50 rears.

Brakes: 280 booster, 15/16 MC, Wilwood fronts and 240sx rears (Porterfield pads all around)

Body: MSA g-nose w/headlight trim and covers, custom hinges, FG rear bumper, Classic Datsun rear spoiler, custom gnose airdam and splitter, custom mini-rear flare, paint, left side mirror reversed to fit right side, and AZJDM tow hooks

Interior: Cobra seats, Race Quip 3-inch harnesses, 280 tach, Panasonic radio/CD and Boston Audio speakers, Classic Datsun carpets, dynomat, and CF pedals.

Electrical: H4 head lights, LED rears, Zonthebrain relays, Pilot fogs, and Hella horns.

If not listed it's still stock (un-cracked dash, wiring harness, tail lights, etc.).

Without the since added headlight covers, trim and splitter.

So is it still a Z?

[hls30.com]

Mr. K is the Jean Luc Picard of car designers.

I love that!

I was 10 yrs old when the Z came out and it was stunning! Me and the rest of the guys I charged around thought it was the cats arse. For me the exterior style is a Z,

Nissan built a great car but it had lots of flaws like every other of that era. They had to make a profit on each unit, so,

they cut some corners. Now that I own one I don't have to cut corners, I can put in more comfortable seats in, more reliable wiring, a more powerful engine, better headlights and on and on. As long as I don't screw with the true beauty of the car, the lines, the thing that grabs everyone, then I am only enhancing the practical matters, not the essence.

Chris

Lots of good stuf there!

I am all for correcting the accountants compromises in our Zs, I just want to do it with parts specifically made or dressed to fit the nature of a Z. I took out the clock in the radio faceplate of my Z32, and moved the 12 outlet from the ashtray area to the faceplate-I cut up both to move them-everything I used except the energy, epoxy, the filler and the paint was 100%Z- that is my commitment to keeping Z-nes in my cars, now I did upgrade to HID lighting with a generic kit marketed for Z32s, I also have some JDM Nissan Parts on the car as well-mostly lighting, I try to upgrade with actual Z parts when ever possible, and when not, I usually modify what is already there. I did add a Plug for the 12Volt outlet to finish it-came from a Volvo, but sculpted and painted to match the Z-I will keep looking for a Z part to do that job, but in the meantime it is handled by a modified an unidentified volvo part.

Since I have a heavily modified 240Z, let me list as many as I can remember and you can decide which one(s) move it into the "no longer a Z" column.

Engine: 3.2L Rebello, triple 44mm Mikunis, TWM air box and K&N air filter, Pertonix in a euro dizzy, MSD 6AL and tach adaptor, MSA jet coated header-wrapped, AZ 6-qt oil pan with Brad Penn 20-50w green oil, GM 120amp one wire alternator, Coolflex hoses, AZ Z radiator, twin fans, custom dampener, 8mm mag wires, NGK plugs (#7), and Mallory comp fuel pump.

Suspension: TTT LCAs, TTT T/C rods, AZJDM outer tie rods, AZ Z RCAs, STS front and rear sway bars, bump steer spacers, poly bushings, GC biscuit style camber plates, cut down struts, Tokico HTS shocks, 275F/250R GC springs, PDK front strut bar, roll bar and MSA rear strut bar, 2.2 neg front camber w/4 degrees caster - 2 degrees neg rear, 0 toe, and corner balanced.

Drivetrain: 1980 280ZX tranny, race balanced drive shaft, Rod Tyler diff mount w/GM ploy bushing mount, 3:90 diff w/Quaife, 300ZXT CVs with MMS stub axles, BBS style CWW 16-inch wheels w/ Yokohoma 225/50 fronts - 245/50 rears.

Brakes: 280 booster, 15/16 MC, Wilwood fronts and 240sx rears (Porterfield pads all around)

Body: MSA g-nose w/headlight trim and covers, custom hinges, FG rear bumper, Classic Datsun rear spoiler, custom gnose airdam and splitter, custom mini-rear flare, paint, left side mirror reversed to fit right side, and AZJDM tow hooks

Interior: Cobra seats, Race Quip 3-inch harnesses, 280 tach, Panasonic radio/CD and Boston Audio speakers, Classic Datsun carpets, dynomat, and CF pedals.

Electrical: H4 head lights, LED rears, Zonthebrain relays, Pilot fogs, and Hella horns.

If not listed it's still stock (un-cracked dash, wiring harness, tail lights, etc.).

[ATTACH=CONFIG]55336[/ATTACH]

Without the since added headlight covers, trim and splitter.

So is it still a Z?

If you keep your foot out of it while inside a huge concrete building with me, yes!

Most of what you have done is with Z specific parts, to me you still have a high level of Z-ness, Modifications don't necessarily hurt Z-ness, Zrush-highly customized, still very Z! Roger Berrys cars, and ex cars lots of Z in them, but lots of distance from Z as well-dosen't mean I don't love to see them and didn't love taking pictures of them at Daytona-hell, my Alpha1 GTO, more something else than Z even with the ZX Turbo drivetrain-doesn't mean I would change anything to make it more Z -or feel bad because of that-It is on the way to being what I want it to be.

Edited August 1, 2012 by hls30.com

[HS30-H]

There, I doradoxed it for you.

Thanks......

[Stanley]

'71 in Option 2 with a 250 mph suspension and the latest Skyline race motor, or a stock resto, or a $1500 rat rod, all beautiful to me.The only ones the make me question if it's really a Z are the ones that act like they want to race and then cheeze at the light.

[TomoHawk]

[ATTACH=CONFIG]55336[/ATTACH]

So is it still a Z?

The first thing I noticed was the bumper, which made me think "Porsche 911" but looking at all if it, makes me think "G-nose Z" so there you go. Since I haven't seen it up close, I'll give you the benefit of "not seeing it up close yet."

I'm not a fan of the big rims, but it looks like there is still a little air between the tires and the fender lip, which is good.

Will-

I remember the snow plow, but I don't remember the image! haha