Noobie here needs Fuel pump help!

[Zed Head]

I've always thought of "static" as meaning no advance mechanisms in play. Basically idle timing. Maybe I misunderstand the terminology.

Anyway, if the car runs and you have the timing light connected to the #1 cylinder wire and you're getting a steady light just in the wrong place, it won't matter which distributor you have installed. The timing light just tells you when the spark happens in relation to cylinder position. The engine will run the same way at idle with any distributor and module that's producing spark.

These engines will run, sounding like tractor engines, if the spark plug wires are installed in reverse rotation order. Backward. Worth a double check. They probably like different timing in reverse also.

At least it's running well enough to know that you have a timing problem. You've made it quite a way from "fuel pump help".

[JRSGTS]

OK, I call Static timing as when you set the engine to TDC and rotate DIST. till we see a spark on #1. Gives a base line to fire the engine..

I have firing order at 153624 counter clockwise on the dist. At idle I have the timing running way to retarded. Timing mark is way up near the top of the pulley. When I rotate the dist. towards the timing marks it runs like crap and drops cylinders...I was thinking it was bad calibration in the dist. What else could be messing me up? Above 2K rpm's it sounds pretty good, but if you rev it, it will spark knock like crazy...

[Zed Head]

It sounds like your timing marks are not aligned with the #1 piston being at top center on the compression stroke. That's what you should check next. The timing flashes aren't worth anything if the marks aren't correct. If I was in your shoes I would pull the valve cover, rotate the engine until the #1 cylinder cam lobes come up (compression stroke), and stop when the timing mark on the damper pulley is at zero on the indicator.

Then see how close the timing sprocket notch is to the oblong groove on the camshaft retaining plate. If they are aligned, you could assume that the timing mark is within about 8 degree of correct.

Whatever the reason that the timing flashes that you're seeing are not working with the marks and indicator, a new distributor will have the same issue.

I've also seen my timing light pick up the next wire over's pulses. But your problem sounds more like a bad damper or screwed up timing marks.

OR, considering that it's not your car and have no idea what's been done to the engine, and this statement, "Good news is he says it has the bottom end from an 81 so higher Compression.", it might just be that somebody has built an old-school 12:1 CR "race" engine and it will never run with standard timing. Overall, it might just be time to check the basics of the engine; cylinder pressure, confirm correct timing marks, check camshaft timing (notch and groove), etc., to see how much farther you can go.

[FastWoman]

I don't know whether it's a potential issue with Z's, but I've heard of some old cars (e.g. Miatas) having issues with the harmonic balancers deteriorating, such that the timing mark randomly shifts. Have you verified that the timing mark really is TDC? Also have you pulled the valve cover and verified the valve train is aligned correctly to TDC? Just a tooth off can cause pretty crappy running. Also the distributor might be a tooth off, so that the rotor only aligns to the correct plug when the timing is retarded. Advance the timing enough, and the spark skips to the next plug, hence cylinders starting to drop out.

[FastWoman]

Ha! Zed beat me to it! (I had walked away from my computer. I don't type quite that slowly!)

[JRSGTS]

All great info Guys( and Lady) When I "static" Time any engine. I pull #1 plug, Bump the motor over with a switch till it pops my finger off the hole. That way I know it's comp. stroke. The mark is always close, Just a matter of moving it a bit to line up with zero. Then I get spark and fire it over. I'll have to pull the VC to verify Cam position. I need to know it, but I still really feel like this dist. isn't right. I'll get a better look at the balancer. Well aware of slip issues with some cars. Because the mark is so close when I bump it, I'm thinking it's ok. According to the PO. it's not a 12:1 engine, but it is about 10.5:1. So I warned the owner we'll either have to recurve the dist. ( Not my forte) or run octane booster and high test.

As you said Zed, and I know. The dist. just fires the spark when it spins by the plug tower in the cap. But if the cent. advance is locked up or flopping and the vac. advance isn't working. It's going to make things run like doo doo...No... I felt a lot of grit under the screws when I was checking air gap and trying to get to the cent. weights. I decided not to go too deep in case I'm trying to return it. But things didn't look right in there.

Started a motor swap on another dead one today. Not sure I'll get to try the new dist. tomorrow. I'll let ya know when I do .

Thanks for all the input! JR.

[JRSGTS]

They sent the wrong Dist. last week...ugh..Way too busy with frozen pipes, messed up furnaces, Shoveling out. Now it's 50 degrees and about to drop below zero again tonight.

They got me the single pick up dist. If they can't get the right one, I might have to do the GM Module conversion.

Have to fix my own furnace today and help my Mother in law with her frozen pipes.....Maybe this car will be fixed in the spring...

[superlen]

JR,

I'm not 100% sure, but I believe the single pickup disty will work. The second pickup I think is only used on CA models perhaps??? The two pickups are some fixed degrees apart (maybe 6 or so) & the ignition module decides which one to use . Sorry for the vague info. I've not looked at the ignition circuits in a while. Others here will be way more up on that than me at this point. Hopefully, they will chime in.

Good luck with the weather & stay warm.

Len

[Zed Head]

Post #71 and 72 kind of covered the dual pickup issue. The stock ignition module will work fine with one pickup, it just won't use the other ignition circuit. If you convert to a GM HEI module, you will only be able to use one pickup. In #72 I got the impression it didn't matter anyway.

[craZpaul]

Newbie here on sight, starting reading, then jumped to bottom.....didn't feel like reading all that, but I take it ...it still don't start. ? Where in upstate? btw Has anyone mentioned the fuel pump contact inside the AFM? I think this is the year, not sure, but that one stumped me once.....on a 280z. Paul, from ctzcc but live in RI (go to NY a lot) (like next week) (got parts as well)

[JRSGTS]

Thanks Len and Zed! I was thinking about trying this Dis. Now I will!! according to the Chiltons the owner provided. The Federal has dual pick ups, the CA. has the one...Seems backwards to me. Who cares as long as it runs. I still have to pull the V.C. to check Cam position, but I will.

Paul, Yeah you needed to read my exceedingly long thread cause we've(thanks to all the great people here) been down the AFM road and all the others too. Car runs good above 2K RPM's Can't get the timing right. Where in NY do you go Paul?

[JRSGTS]

:beer:IT LIVES!!!! Runs awesome!!! FINALLY!!!! The dist. was F'd.. The new one even being a single pick up fixed everything! Well the exhaust still sounds like crap but.. I'm able to put the timing any where I want it, The motor sounds solid. Sounds like it wants to fly really. Still have a bit high of an idle. 1150 is about as low as I can get it. Played with the idle air bleed, I can shut it right down and it still won't go any lower. Checked for vac. leaks, Nothing. Can't drive it till I change the rear wheel cyl's and shoes or it will grind up a drum. The snow all just melted, so a good window to take it out for a rip..Have to finish one in front of it though so it'll be a couple days.

Thank you again everyone who helped!!! Lenny, the other ECU will be in the mail tomorrow. Sorry I didn't get it out sooner...Weather BS put me back a bit.. I'll keep ya'll posted on how the first drive goes!!

JR.