Last Chance To Stop Me: Going Coilovers?

[oranngetang]

Long story short. My fairly rust - free Series I is getting some cash thrown at it right now.

3.0L Rebello with zTherapy 4 screw round tops @ 10:1, 15x9-0 Shakotans, 225/50R15 Kuhio ASTs, front air dam, lots of electrical and weatherstrip/interior parts and.... suspension.

So my initial plan was to go with a narrower rim and tire with Tokico kit. Sadly since it's now discontinued, and Eibach/Koni seems to be the only other option for a drop and stiffening, it's going to be coilovers I guess.

Now... it is a series I and I've kept all of the original parts, so welding in camber plates is something I really don't want to do. That said, I've looked at alternatives, and while a MSA has their kit, but apparently not struts for it in stock, I put a call into ground control this evening. It seems it's taken about the amount of time to find out what isn't in stock or instant available or whatever, that I would have liked it to rake for the order to be here in my hands. That and the consensus online of the MSA kit seems to be overpriced and poorly finished and still requires cutting and welding of your strut housings, just to save the weld in plates.

So after I cook some supper, I'm throwing on some coveralls, pulling all 4 corners and disassembling my strut housings to be shipped tomorrow for sectioning and permanent conversion to GC coils.

That said, it's not too late to suggest an alternative to me. These need to come out anyway.

I've been reading forums for the past couple of years making a decision on how to do this and I'm constantly running into false information or posts. So here is why I THINK I need the coilovers

1. Despite several posts that say a 15x9 with 225 wide tires WILL fit stock suspension / eibach springs, it appears they probably will not clear the spring perch without spacers. I don't want spacers... or rims sticking out noticeably beyond fenders. I refuse to install flares.

2. Ride height.. seems like a of discrepancy on where the car will sit with the eibach springs. Also it seems there are 1000 posts where someone installed the rear springs in front, etc. Um... coilovers will let me set the exact height and camber required to fit the tire under the fenders leaving sufficient gap and travel for driving... i hope.

3. Way more adjustability and aftermarket support once this is done, with springs and strut inserts... next year will Koni stop making struts for our cars?

And so the pros and cons... basically repeating myself. ..trying to convince that yes I'm doing no wrong...

Pros

Adjustability, wheel clearance, spring and damper selection

Cons

Bastardizing my strut mounts and price...

So yeah... GC seems like the plan as of now. Let me know why or why not. I understand the irreversibility of this... i have already eted smog and had the carbs redone and welded in new frame rails and floor sections. The car isn't stock.

I intend to drive the **** out of it and with the poly bushings and coilovers, I get it. Rough ride. I'm fortunately not 100 years old and also willing to gain some asthetics and performance rather than driving an underpowered 2100 lb car with a squishy lift kit. This car was an inheritance and wasnt running or legal to drive when it fell into my hands. My goal is fast, nimble and fun while looking era specific and somewhat unmodified. Might some autocross weekends, more or less my street weapon.

No time to proof read...2 percent battery on this stupid phone.

[Zed Head]

Nice work, from a phone.

The struts are not number-matched, so could probably be fairly easily sourced in the future if someone decided to restore your car. The bigger question for restoration is "what happened to the original engine?".

By the way, all of these cars have "coilovers". What you're having done is adding adjustable spring perches, and shortening the strut tube so the damper (aka shock) will have acceptable travel when the spring perch is lowered. It's funny that everyone keeps calling them "coilovers". It's kind of a nonsensical word.

Are there more damper varieties available with the shorter tube? Is the top mount different with the GC kit? I don't know myself, but it would be a consideration. Tokico is gone entirely.

[oranngetang]

I think more for the simplicity of saying you have camber plates and welded in height adjustable 2.5" springs on modified macphersons. I'm just adhering to the "coilover" precedence set forth by z forums internationally

Factory engine is in the car. Drove it last night and it runs like a top with only a leaky rear main and cylinder 4 valve seals.

Top mount on these conversion kits is different than out struts. Depending on who you go with you'll find different mounting plates. I think they all use a an adjustable pillow ball style mount of one form or another rather than an insulator/mount.

So with no tokico and as far as I can find, only Koni remaining (KYB isn't an option), modification seems inevitable, if not just for wider tires for the additional power. Right? Say yes and enjoy your ground controls ahha.

Also it isn't the cutting of the struts themselves that bothers me as much as cutting and welding in camber plates under the hood and on the rear towers.

Edited April 23, 2014 by oranngetang

[Zed Head]

Re "coilovers" - it's everybody's right to follow the herd if they want to.

You didn't really say that you were going with the camber plates. I think that you can do adjustables without the camber plates. There are also bolt-on styles out there.

Still not clear on if you're saying that there are more shock options with the GC units or just the same choices. You might get on to Hybridz and check out the Stance system that someone just worked worked up. He's a member here also but probably doesn't think of classiczcars as a good market for the product. Has the bolt-on camber plates also.

Sakura Garage Stance USA Coilover Kit - Vendor's Forum - HybridZ

[oranngetang]

From my understanding (and I could be incorrect), since the aftermarket kits like GC and TTT use common sized springs and struts, finding replacement options should be easier and now plentiful.

Bolt-in plates still require cutting off sheet metal.

Maybe there is a way too use the factory hats with these systems, but nobody seems to post any information or instructions on installation. So as it appears, you order a kit and then follow whatever modification instructions come with it.

[Zed Head]

It doesn't look there's any benefit as far as choice of shock. All you'll be getting is the adjustable height from a lower starting point and adjustable camber.

From the GC site - "This kit fits 70-74 Datsun 240 and 260 Z WELD with stock, Sachs, Boge, Tokico Premium Performance, Tokico Illumina, Koni, or KYB shocks (please specify shock type before ordering)."

Those are all typical Z car shocks, from low budget Rockauto type to the type that aren't available anymore (Tokico). And you have to supply your own. So you'll still be looking for shocks, just shorter ones, when you get the parts back.

It's a problem.

[oranngetang]

I think adjustable height and adjustable camber are alone with the switch. I'd also gain perch to wheel clearance. I appreciate the post to those bolt in plates, I'm tempted now. I suppose one could always just drill out the 'weld' in ones, or otherwise get as hack and slash customizable as one wanted.

Will attempt to google some stock hat conversions in the am. GC seems to be the best price, sending ready to bolt in pre-segmented sets for a few hundred bucks more than what others are selling just the hardware for. I'll happily pay a few hundred for someone that knows what they're doing to cut and weld my stuff together. Just those damn camber plates...

[gnosez]

We ran the race car with just slotted strut tower tops for several years (2.5 neg front and 2 rear) by grinding down the stock insulator. Two years ago we welded in the TTT fronts but the backs are still slotted. Have TTT RCAs and stock LCAs w/concentric bushings.

My street 240 has the GC puck like pillow ball camber plates that has 4 different threaded locations to mount the strut. Works just fine.

Both cars have sectioned struts and Tokico HTS shocks with the race car using 350# springs and the street 250.

[oranngetang]

How do you like the 250 # springs on all four corners? Sounds like a lot are running a 225F/250R mix, or seemingly 25# stiffer in the rear regardless.

[Diseazd]

I love my GC Coilovers......You can really put the car down, but for the street, it's probably more bling than bang for the buck....I can't feel a whole lot of difference between the GC's and the Eibach/Tokicos. IMO, but it sure looks good. Throw in some front and rear Willwoods and you can really burn some green!

Edited April 23, 2014 by Diseazd

[Zed Head]

It looks like you really want to go with the adjustable coilovers and camber. But if you decide to wait a while, or realize that your budget isn't quite ready, here's another, less expensive option - New S30 Shock and Spring Option - Vendor's Forum - HybridZ

[oranngetang]

I think my decision remains with ground control. Also, I just noticed that their plates are bolt in style. Drill holes, connect the dots for the cutout and then sandwich a backing plate to the mount. It looks easy and similar to the Sakura stuff. It's more expensive but they're sectioning the strut housings and shipping everything ready to go in (other than me mounting the plates). This I can deal with.

Sorry Series I, but you'll be this much better of a car because of it.

So with all of this said.... I suppose strut braces are somewhat out of the question now...

Gnosez are you running braces in the either car? This early 240 is pretty flexy!