To Dream the Impossible Dream (Redwing's Z cars)

[rossiz]

once the bugs are worked out your confidence will rise again with her.

i have started many threads on this forum that included pictures of my green-eyed Lillith behind a tow truck during the first months of ownership - i started doubting if she would ever be reliable, but the constant encouragement from the many good people on this forum kept me going.

 

now that i've gone through all the systems, she's as dependable as any car out there. i have done way more than the average owner, but the majority of my work has been things i wanted to do vs. things required just to keep her going. it sounds like you will need to spend some time correcting poor work from previous owners and probably replace a few parts that have exceeded their useful life, but these cars are pretty affordable to maintain compared to modern vehicles.

 

take your time and only replace what you have truly determined to be a bad part - it's easy to spend way too much with the "shotgun" approach and most of the components on our cars can either be massaged back to life or are pretty stout to begin with. we're rooting for you!!

[Patcon]

The coil is one concern but the ignition module is a different issue entirely. I believe it is the black box on the distributor, someone can confirm this for me. When they start failing they get how\t and quit working. You could probably do this test in the driveway like the previous test. Run the car until it stalls, then cool the module and see if it will start.

[jonathanrussell]

Correct me if I am wrong but I don't think the integrated distributor / ignition unit came along until the zx. Both my 75 and 78 fsms show the ignition unit located under the passenger dash side panel. I think 75 and 76 are the same module. Not sure about 77. 78 is different, however.

[FastWoman]

No, it's not an integrated distributor/ignition module.  The ignition module is a small black box (literally) somewhere inside the cabin on the passenger side of the car.  Mine is behind the kick panel, but I think the location might be slightly different for a '76.

 

Jai, I don't consider replacing a fuel hose that difficult at any skill level.  The most important thing is to buy the correct type of hose, cut it to the correct length, loosen and pull off the old one, and then install and tighten the new one.  You only need a screwdriver and a knife.

 

As others have pointed out, though, you will need to be careful with fuel hoses beneath the car, as gasoline can just start running out of them.  You'll need to clamp them (and maybe should wait for help).  However, you should be up for replacing those red garden-hose fuel lines in the engine compartment.  I really think you should, for the sake of safety.  I thought they were merely the wrong material, but from your description they seem also to be too large.  Not good.  Not safe.

[FastWoman]

Also your testing for air flow through the vent system:  You're examining the wrong line.  Perhaps you should get some assistance on that issue.

 

Will the gentlemen coming to your assistance get RB up and running?  Probably.  They sound like they know their stuff.  Your main running issue will be something very specific, e.g. a bad fuel pump or a rusty/cruddy fuel tank.  You might have to pull/service/replace the fuel tank, which is a bit of a project.  However, yes, you will get running again.

 

And as Rossiz said, your RB will become a reliable vehicle, once you chase down all the gremlins -- provided the engine block is basically sound -- good compression and such.

[Redwing]

I found the transistor ignition unit, as the manual calls it. The description of where it is located:

"On the right hand dash side panel in passenger compartment." Nothing else, that's the complete description.

The description where it is at seems incomplete to me. Well, now if only I knew what it looks like, I could hunt for it. No information about that at all. At least now I know the full name of it so I can search for one to look at it.

[FastWoman]

That's the trim panel affectionately called the "kick panel."  If you sit in the passenger seat and kick your right leg to the right, your foot will hit it.  You remove that trim panel to get to the ignition module, which is a black metal box of roughly (for memory) the dimensions 1" x 4" x 5".

 

Personally, I'd bet against it being an ignition problem.  Your run time before shutdown seems too random for that.  I'm still betting on fuel.

[jonathanrussell]

So Sarah....

 

If you think that it is a fuel problem, you must be thinking that the starter fluid test wasn't performed adequately to start the car. Am I right? If not, could you elaborate?

[Redwing]

Yes, sometimes she doesn't start after a cool all night resting. (Maybe showing not a "hot" problem?) Then 3, 5, 10, 15, 18, 30, 40 minutes (approximate actual times) after starting. Not in that order, but slowly working to less and less time. One time she died early maybe at 20 minutes, then went on ok for another 35 minutes. Just no rhyme or reason.

[FastWoman]

Jonathan, yikes...  I honestly missed that.  I didn't realize/catch that the starter fluid test had been done after the engine died.  Dyslexia strikes again! 

 

Question to Jai:  Did you shoot the starter fluid into the hose or into the manifold?  And about how long a shot did you give it?

[siteunseen]

Here's the module on a '77, thanks Blue.  Passenger's side, left of the fuse panel.

 

[EuroDat]

Jai has a 1976 model which had two versions for the TIU (Transistor Ignition Unit). The californian model looks just like Siteunseen's photo and the federal version will have an aluminium casing with cooling fins. The federal version also have dual pick-up in the distributor.

 

The FED used a D6F4-01 & 02 dual pickups for manuals an automatics. The auto had 2° more advance when hot. The Cal version was D6F4-03 singel pickup.

 

There are a couple of ways to tell them apart.

1. If you look at the terminal block next to the coil. The FED models have 4 wires coming out of the distributor (2x Green, Red and Brown) and the Californian has two (Red and Green)

2. The TIU in the FED model has a one piece terminal 7 wires going to the TIU. The californian model has a two piece terminal block and 6 wires, See photo Siteunseen post #95.

 

A photo of either will tell which type of system it is.

 

BTW: I starting to loose track of what it happening with the starting issues. A lot of posts in a short time.

 

I assume its starting and running until it gets hot then stops and will not start/run which sounds a lot like a failing TIU.

Cooling it is a good test. Cool packs will work, but they take a while to remove the heat.

I removed the cover on mine and mounted it back in position without the cover. When it stopped I could spray the circuit board with electrical contact cleaner and let it evaporate to cool it quickly. It started straight away after that.