How Long is your Front Sway Bar?

[z boy mn]

Hey everyone, I'm having a basic sway-bar problem, and I can't figure out if it's me or MSA.

About a month ago, I bought this sway bar kit from MSA. http://www.thezstore.com/page/TZS/PROD/23-4101

It arrived and looked great. A friend and I installed the rear one first, thinking that would be the hardest one, and it took a few hours but it all went smoothly. Then, we got to the front sway bar and it wouldn't fit as it was too wide for the strut towers. We measured it against the stock bar (as you can see) and it's about 1.25 inches wider, and it won't fit (it hits both sides). I called MSA and they checked all their sway bars and they were all 41", but clearly it's longer than my stock bar. They also said they haven't gotten any other complaints or returns. One technician said he took one home and will see how it fits his own vehicle on his own time, but he hasn't had a chance to try it yet. I'm not eager to return both bars (they only come as a kit) as the rear one is installed and I want it.

It might help to know that the front suspension is stock except for the torsion kit (from MSA), camber bushings (from MSA), and the progressive springs (Eibach, from MSA)...could it be something else? Is it possible I'm doing something wrong? It IS longer than stock, but maybe it should fit anyway? Does anyone have another stock bar lying around you could measure? Anyone else have trouble with these bars?

Finally, if MSA says it's my problem, I'm probably going to try and make this one work...so, suggestions on bending it (I know it's spring steel) so it fits?

Stumped in MN (and cold)!

 

Edited January 14, 2016 by z boy mn
clarity

[zKars]

I'm having trouble imagining where it is "hitting the strut towers".  Can you describe where this contact occurs? 

Given what I know about the front sway bar, being 1" or so wider than stock would do nothing more than slightly increase the angle of the links at the end of the bar that connect it to the control arm. The thing fits under the car, how can it interfere with the strut towers?

Edited January 13, 2016 by zKars

[Chickenman]

It fits, but it's tight. Put one in my 280Z ( with Eibach springs )  and had the same issue when installing. Different kit number ( 23-4102 ) as the rear bar is shaped different, but I believe the front bar is exactly the same part.  MSA does need to address this issue. It makes it a PITA to install. Poor design.

The problem is if you jack up the front end and support the frame on jack stands, the wheels go into full droop. Because of the location of the sway bar end links, they occupy an area between the Macpherson strut and lower control arm. This forms an acute angle V.... sort of like this   /_

When the wheels go Full Droop, the angle gets more acute and you run out of space to install the bar. The ends of the bar hit the Mac Strut wich leans inward. It hits about 6" up from the control arm. It's a bad design and MSA needs to shorten the bar a bit.

In reality the wheels will never droop that far when the bar is installed, or under any other normal circumstances. Solution is to install the front bar with the front wheels loaded on a Ramp hoist, or if you have it on Jack Stands, lift both control arms with a jack under the ball joint area. This will change the strut angle and give you more room. Like this  I_

I find it much easier to install the front bar with out the front wheels on. You can also grind the outer end of the bar where it contacts the Mac Strut. It's got a square end and if you grind it down on a bench grinder or with a big angle grinder you gain a considerable amount of room. I didn't have to do this on mine, but if it comes off again I will modify it. OP knows where it hits.

Edit: This all being said. You may have one that is slightly longer than normal. They should check there stock to see if you got one abnormally wrong. They also need to round off those ends. Can easily be done in production. I'm going to write them some feedback as well and point it to this thread.

Edited January 13, 2016 by Chickenman

[z boy mn]

Chickenman, thanks again for your feedback, I never thought about how the distance changes when the wheels are suspended.

Of course, this means if I could get the bar in with the car on the ground, every time I lifted it the bar would rub on the struts...so I like the idea of rounding off the ends for a little more clearance and modifying the bar some so it doesn't happen.

I noticed on the stock bar, for example, the ends weren't exactly parallel...I bet it bent because I keep lifting the car off the ground to do work and it was rubbing. Still, it would make a lot more sense just to have a shorter bar (more like stock size) with rounded corner tabs. I talked to the welding instructor at the college where I work (teaching English), and I think we'd only need to add a degree or so to the final bend (which is about 90 degrees) to make it fit properly.

 

 

Edited January 13, 2016 by z boy mn

[Chickenman]

I'm not sure if it actually would hit the strut once installed. It would be bloody close though. Because of the geometry of the front suspension, the front sway bar contributes to anti-dive and anti- lift. So the front wheels won't droop as far with the sway bar attached, as with it disconnected.  Pretty sure mine was OK once I got the danged thing in. Regardless, it would be a good idea to round off the ends. 

 

[z boy mn]

Seems a bad idea to have things that close if I can make it fit somewhat better. I'll start with rounding off the ends and see how it goes. Thanks for your help, Chickenman!

[John Coffey]

It doesn't matter.  The bar ends will only touch the strut tube if both wheels got to full droop.  99% of the time that will only happen when you jack up the front of the car.  It doesnt matter.  Move on to more important thinks.

[z boy mn]

Thanks again everyone for your help. I just wanted to update folks that I found a fabricator with a press and he added a degree or so to each bend...it took just minutes. The result is the new bar is now the same size as the stock one, and as we didn't heat it or anything (it had been manufactured in a press in the first place) the spring function should be the same. I've added a couple photos to show the difference. I'm still going to grind the tabs a little so they're not so pointy as I do have it jacked up fairly often and I'd rather not have them dig into the struts every time.

As John suggests, it probably wouldn't have been a big deal to leave it, but I like it better when things line up more (plus, it will make it easier to install). I've kept MSA in the loop so maybe they will adjust their specs I'm not sure.

[kunzma]

Wondering if you still have the old sway bar?  Need one for my 71.