Rally anyone?

[Doehring]

Howdy Mike,

you started that thread and I think your intention was to find out who is rallying today with our "elderly ladies" and what our experiences and technical hints are. I#m interested in that ,too.

Now the thread changed a bit and at the moment some of us are becoming experts that work out Datsun's works rallying history step by step. Together we are strong, I hope. So Mike, let me propose to split the thread, one for exchange of experiences, one, where the experts can work on history. What do you think and how is this accepted by the "expertgroup" ?

EricB and Sennavsprost

welcome to the "club of experts". Perhaps you can find out some informations on the "american" Zs of the early 70s in the world

rallye championship, for instance on the Smiska's car in the '72 and '73 "Press on Regardless". There must have been another 240Z within the first top 5 in '71. Can you get pictures ?

Hi Alan, Fred , Sean , Guus and friends from "down under"

we will have a longe weekend now and I will try to structure the information that I can find in my rallying books from the seventies

(pictures, result lists, stories) , in my Z book collection and in my collection of articles on Z rallye cars. I hope to find a scanner so that I can copy the photos for you. Perhaps together we can fill the gaps in information. Alan is right, some informations are confusing and sometimes I have the feeling that Datsun used the same licence plate for different cars. Maybe I can also find Hans Schuller. I heared he lives in Germany again. He should know a lot. The german Z club already contacted Graf Goertz, the Z designer, who became a member to the club.

Guus, yesterday I first times saw the 1:18 model #5. Was it Exoto or Kyoshi ? Whatever it is, it is very detailed, it is great, it is a must

[Caen Fred]

Gutten täg

That's as far as my German go... my English is poor and rusty, my German is disloved.

You are not far from the truth, it was an ice race at Serres-Chevallier, in 1973, well done!

Fred

[Doehring]

Bonjour Fred,

merci pour la medaille d'or. The car seems to be one of those that have done the Monte Carlo before, the licence plate is a Japanese one and in the middle of the fron window you can see that stripe from the additional window heating that the works cars had. Interesting to see a Z in the sandwich of 2 Renault Alpine at an Ice event.

Thanks for the picture !

Rolf

[EricB]

Dear Alan, Cher Fred,

When I was in Japan last (last week of April) I did pick up a new Fairlady book which covers of course the whole development of the street car and its various clay model iterations prior to finding the production version (of interest to me since I am to be an automobile designer) but also a pretty thorough section on competition covering both Japanese and American circuit racing and the Rally effort over the rest of the world. It IS in Japanese and off the top of my head I can't remember the author's name (in order to check if some of you already have this book in which case it would be a moot point)

I can however describe the appearance of its cover - perhaps this might ring some bells with someone? Hard bound book with a white dust cover on which there is a large "Z" - the subtitle being as I recall "The Fairlady Story" and at the bottom next to the author's name there's a side view illustration of one of the BRE Z cars.

On a different topic, the latest issue of NosHero is KICKASS - when you see the cover you will buy it instantly. There's an old orange race 432 that is apparently built to the hilt. In the book I've mentionned above this same car is pictured there too. I can scan & upload if interested.

-e

[EricB]

Doehring: that model yesterday was the Kyosho 1:18 12900yen in Japan - Here stateside I've seen them for between $35 and $75.

To all: Should we have a web space created and upload all of our scanned images there and use that to create our history book? I think I can come up with some good ones and I have existing web space somewhere else where I could store my images for the time being - just need the time to scan them in I guess....

-e

[Z-point]

Originally posted by EricB

Doehring: that model yesterday was the Kyosho 1:18 12900yen in Japan - Here stateside I've seen them for between $35 and $75.

-e

Hi guys,

speaking about Kyosho's here's a place made from the Kyosho brochure. There you can find all the inns and outs.

http://home-1.worldonline.nl/~zzxnl/Z43218.jpg

http://home-1.worldonline.nl/~zzxnl/240Z18.jpg

http://home-1.worldonline.nl/~zzxnl/240ZG18.jpg

http://home-1.worldonline.nl/~zzxnl/240Zrally18.jpg

http://home-1.worldonline.nl/~zzxnl/240Z43.jpg

Guus

Z-point

[Z-point]

Originally posted by Doehring

Howdy Mike,

you started that thread and I think your intention was to find out who is rallying today with our "elderly ladies" and what our experiences and technical hints are. I#m interested in that ,too.

Now the thread changed a bit and at the moment some of us are becoming experts that work out Datsun's works rallying history step by step. Together we are strong, I hope. So Mike, let me propose to split the thread, one for exchange of experiences, one, where the experts can work on history. What do you think and how is this accepted by the "expertgroup" ?

A new thread is perfect, but I suggest we take all our post with us!

Guus

Z-point

[Z-point]

Originally posted by Doehring

Hi ev'rybody,

let's go on to the essentials of datsuns works engagements to fill the white spots on the map one by one.

As far as my sources are correct Datsun engaged itself with Z cars OUTSIDE AFRICA 1st times with 4 Group 3 240Zs in Sept. 1970 in GB (RAC-Rallye). Drivers were Rauno AAltonen, Tony Fall, Edgar Herrmann and John Bloxham. A 5th Z was for services. All 4 cars had problems because of differential overheating. Only Aaltonen finished, having 3 best results on special stages in between.

In 1971 a Z finished in 5th position at Rallye Monte Carlo. Also in 1971 Tony Fall won the Welch-Rallye. In 1972 Aaltonen finished 3rd in Monte Carlo. Also in 1972 Shekar Mehta became 6th at the greece Akropolis Rallye and Tony fall finished 4th in Portugal. In 1973 Aaaltonen was long time in 2nd pos. at the Monte Carlo until a fuel line broke. Also in 1973 some works drivers startet as privateers. So Mehta damaged a Z in Maroc and Hans Schuller, Herrmanns Co-driver in Africa, started in Germany. The licence plate of this car was SU 6470. The portuguise importer prepared 2 Zs (drivers nn) and in NORTH AMERICA at the "Press on regardless -Rallye" the couple Smiska finished 2nd in '72 and 3rd in '73.

The 260Z was no big success . In '74 a 260Z finished 5th in Portugal. In '75 Schuller was engaged in Le Mans.

AFRICA:

In 1971 Datsun prepared 4 Zs for the East African Safari. The engines for Africa did not base on the Z 432 but on the L24 with about 210 HP, 200 km/h top speed with a long 4th gear (4,625:1). Totla weight was 1250 kg. Herrmann/Schuller startet with car #11, #12 was driven by Aaltonen/Easter,#31 by Mehta/Doughty and the 4th Z was run by Jack Simonian. Herrmann finished 1st in front of Mehta. Aaltonen became 7th. In '72 3 Zs started (Aaltonen/Fall, Mehta/Doughty and Herrmann/Schuller). Herrmann finished in 5th, Aaltonen in 6th and Mehta in 10th position.

In 1973 the 240Z became a 2,5 Litre, 240HP, 205 km/. 89 teams started, only 19 finished that 5000 km event. Mehta was the winner over all. In 1974 Datsun engaged 3 260Z in East Africa. They finished 5th and 6th with Kallstrom/Bilstram and Ramtulla /Jivani (3rd team n.n.) Only 16 of 99 teams finished that tough 5100 km event.

How many Zs were engaged as "mules" (training cars) or for services I don't know Perhaps anybody knows the id-#s of the works cars so that we can trace their lives.

Rolf

Way way back I started to make a webpage as a contribute to our beloved Z cars

Now it’s a matter to finish it. Let’s go for it!

http://home-1.tiscali.nl/~zzxnl/victory_lane.htm

Guus

Z-point

[Mike]

Originally posted by Doehring

Howdy Mike,

you started that thread and I think your intention was to find out who is rallying today with our "elderly ladies" and what our experiences and technical hints are. I#m interested in that ,too.

Now the thread changed a bit and at the moment some of us are becoming experts that work out Datsun's works rallying history step by step. Together we are strong, I hope. So Mike, let me propose to split the thread, one for exchange of experiences, one, where the experts can work on history. What do you think and how is this accepted by the "expertgroup" ?

Hi Doehring,

I'm up for anything...... I haven't been a part of this thread in quite a long time and I come back to find just TONS of information about rally racing.

Yes, I am interested in getting started and trying to determine where I can make my first step into this type of racing.

All of this content is perfectly OK and I am learning a lot from it, so, please don't stop doing what you are doing. This forum was set up for the free exchange of information, so, please use it!!

-- Mike

[Doehring]

Guus,

you started a good overview on your z-point page "victory lane".

I took that as the basis, checked it (sometimes you jumped a line for instance) and added all informations I could find on Zs in world rallye championship ( and some oteher) events between 1970 and 1976. Next week I'm out of my bureau and I will present my results to you all a little bit later. There will still be same white spots on the map that we can shurely fill together.

Rolf

[norcal z]

Hi everyone -

I haven't checked this forum out in quite a long time, but went racing this past weekeng and got the "bug" back. So I thought I'd check out the racing forum here, and this was the first thread I looked at.

All I can say is, "WOW"! This is great. Sorry, but I can't offer anything to the discussion, but hearing about it from all of you is very interesting. I hope you will continue it here.

Perhaps it is because these cars primarily raced in series on the European and African continents, and media coverage of the events back then was almost non-existent as compared to today's events, that most of us here do not know more about them. The Indy and NASCAR have mostly been featured in the media here, and so that's what we've grown up with (well, until Speedvision, I guess!).

gary

[Caen Fred]

debriefing time!

I saw the Le Mans car!

Ok, after investigation, it is NOT the car that raced, I looked at all the "Alan pedigree spots" and most of them didn't match!!!

The owner then told us that it was a car that was imported from Japan by the owner of the Le Mans car????

It is still one of the best racing Z around here, fast, and well maintened.

Too bad that peoples have to brag when they already have products that stand alone

I had a good time, and I still have to sort out a few things on the history of that car, but I have plenty of time! I belong to the club :sleep: ZEN :sleep: de France after all.

Fred