16 Year Olds RB25 240z

[jchoi]

However, in many ways engineers are like pilots.  There are old pilots and there are careless pilots.  But, there are no old careless pilots.  Like most 16 year olds he's probably not going to take sound and reasonable advice from old experienced adults.  Maybe there should be a new forum on this site where teens with Zs can bounce wild ideas and schemes off of each other.  [emoji14]

Dennis

 

 

Thanks for the kind words. I'm taking the advice of people who are some what resonable. I'm not going to pull a fuel system that just set me back a grand to put back a rusty tank form the 70s that were built to the standards of the respective times. I am only 2 months into my build, don't have an engine and am still working on the car. I came to this forum to learn and listen. I think even a grown man would be able to see that a car without an engine in the engine bay is not drivable, or even close to being done.

-Johnny

 

 

 

Sorry about that. I do see the advice I am receiving as helpful but it's too late for me to change it. I would like to apologise for my reply and hope you can continue to help me along with my build.

 

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[jchoi]

Now I feel bad.  Until I think back to all of the unsafe things I did at 16.  Besides that, the bling factor is strong for that tank.  Seems way early in the game to be buying and installing a fuel cell.  The path of bling is fraught with peril and expense.  You'll need Triple A, for instance.  Or friends with a Z car bolt pattern, close by.

You're right[emoji23] [emoji23] . The bling factor us high but its also FIA approved for racing as long is I secure it to specs. I'm currently trying to prep the car for the arrival of the engine. I'm redoing the fuel lines and the brake lines while there is no tranny or engine.

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[Zed Head]

No offense intended.  Better to hear it early than late.

Looking forward to watching the build.  Carry on.

[rturbo 930]

41 minutes ago, jchoi said:

 I'm taking the advice of people who are some what resonable. I'm not going to pull a fuel system that just set me back a grand to put back a rusty tank form the 70s that were built to the standards of the respective times.
 

Well I can only assume that was directed at me. I was 16 not that long ago, and I remember what it was like. I also remember the vision I had for my car, and yes, it did include a fuel cell. Thank god I never cut out the spare tire well ahead of time. You think I am being unreasonable, but you are new to cars, and you haven't thought this through - and you wouldn't be the first. In my time on these boards, I've seen a handful of people cut out their spare tire well, install a fuel cell, and realize it was stupid later on. In your case, your fuel cell is smaller - 12 gallons vs 17 - and now your range will be shortened by a good amount, and you will also be opening your hatch every time you have to fuel up. You might think it's cool the first few times, but it's going to get old. And of course, your fuel tank is now in the cabin. Yes, you could create a bulkhead, but why do that when you could put the stock tank in and bypass the problem to begin with? You think that just because the car was designed in the 70s that the tank is no good. It could be improved with baffles and an in tank pump, which can be done, and has been, but I assure you that it's perfectly suitable. Many people still have their stock tanks. If it's rusty, you can have it recoated. And it won't cost you a grand. Fuel cells belong in race cars.

I didn't come in here to pick on you, but if your argument boils down to "it's bad because it's old" then I'm going to have to respond to that. The entire car was built to the standards of the late 60s, same as the fuel tank, but it doesn't need as much improvement as you think. I would suggest spending more time reading and researching to figure out exactly what needs to be improved, and how it would be best to do so, rather than just throwing money at race car parts. The good news is, you still have your spare tire well, so you can still go back.

[jchoi]

Well I can only assume that was directed at me. I was 16 not that long ago, and I remember what it was like. I also remember the vision I had for my car, and yes, it did include a fuel cell. Thank god I never cut out the spare tire well ahead of time. You think I am being unreasonable, but you are new to cars, and you haven't thought this through - and you wouldn't be the first. In my time on these boards, I've seen a handful of people cut out their spare tire well, install a fuel cell, and realize it was stupid later on. In your case, your fuel cell is smaller - 12 gallons vs 17 - and now your range will be shortened by a good amount, and you will also be opening your hatch every time you have to fuel up. You might think it's cool the first few times, but it's going to get old. And of course, your fuel tank is now in the cabin. Yes, you could create a bulkhead, but why do that when you could put the stock tank in and bypass the problem to begin with? You think that just because the car was designed in the 70s that the tank is no good. It could be improved with baffles and an in tank pump, which can be done, and has been, but I assure you that it's perfectly suitable. Many people still have their stock tanks. If it's rusty, you can have it recoated. And it won't cost you a grand. Fuel cells belong in race cars.
I didn't come in here to pick on you, but if your argument boils down to "it's bad because it's old" then I'm going to have to respond to that. The entire car was built to the standards of the late 60s, same as the fuel tank, but it doesn't need as much improvement as you think. I would suggest spending more time reading and researching to figure out exactly what needs to be improved, and how it would be best to do so, rather than just throwing money at race car parts. The good news is, you still have your spare tire well, so you can still go back.

That was not directed at you but thanks for the advice. I understand what you are saying now but my old tank was trashed. It was all rusted and dented. I think the P/O tried to spray paint the inside of the tank to stop the rust. Thanks for clearing that up. Now that's it's too late would you have any ideas to help better secure the tank? Like I have said many time, I am not done. I am going to add the fill tube back to the stock location so I doubt have to open the hatch every time I fill up. I'm sorry about the reply, I came here to post about my build hoping it would go well but now I have all these strangers telling me what to do and what is and isn't safe. I have been at this alone since I started so it's weird to have people telling me how I should build my car.
Thanks for understanding, Johnny

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[rturbo 930]

25 minutes ago, jchoi said:

That was not directed at you but thanks for the advice. I understand what you are saying now but my old tank was trashed. It was all rusted and dented. I think the P/O tried to spray paint the inside of the tank to stop the rust. Thanks for clearing that up. Now that's it's too late would you have any ideas to help better secure the tank? Like I have said many time, I am not done. I am going to add the fill tube back to the stock location so I doubt have to open the hatch every time I fill up. I'm sorry about the reply, I came here to post about my build hoping it would go well but now I have all these strangers telling me what to do and what is and isn't safe. I have been at this alone since I started so it's weird to have people telling me how I should build my car.
Thanks for understanding, Johnny

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I can see why you might prefer this option when the stock tank is absent. As I said, you can still go back, you just need to source a tank. You can do that later if you want. I will give you credit though - at least you used quality parts. However, you were previously suggesting the factory design was poor and prone to explosion, and that's why you made the switch - that's what I had a problem with.

I don't have much advice for you for securing it. I don't know what they recommend, but your straps look like they fit well. The sheet metal they are bolted to is thin though - maybe a few large washers on the underside would be a good idea to spread the load. If you plan to race or autocross, look up their rules and see what they require. Might be a good idea to do that regardless. Your tank filler is higher than the trunk floor, so you might have some issue routing the fuel filler tube to the stock location and having it work properly.

Lastly, you say that you have strangers telling you what is and isn't safe and how you should build your car as if it's a bad thing. We are giving you advice. You don't have to take it, but maybe you should. Again, you are 16, and you are new to cars. It's nearly guaranteed that you're going to do something stupid - take offense to that if you want, but that doesn't make it untrue. Most of us are older and more experienced, and we're trying to help you avoid making stupid mistakes. For the record, I don't think the fuel cell was a stupid mistake like improperly installed harnesses might be, just not really the upgrade you might think it is when used in a street car.

Edited July 12, 2017 by rturbo 930

[montanagrl]

Welcome!
Walnut Creek: my home town!

Charlie, check out ZONC.org.... we are Z Owners of Northern California. We're having our annual car show on 7/22 at the Brisbane Marina. You're welcome to join us.


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[charliekwin]

Appreciate the invite, but I'm about 370 miles south these days  

[Jay.]

Some great replies here. I hope you can take these for what they're worth (advice) rather than taking it personally! 

 

There has been plenty of successful fuel cells installed, and if that's genuinely the way you want to go then it can be done. Lots of examples over on hybridz if you need new ideas (which I suggest you do) 

I'd have to err towards the old boys, there's no real need to swap the fuel tank out for a cell. If yours was rusty then a replacement would have been easier and cheaper. 

However, as you've said you've got the cell now and if you want to use it then it's your project.. Just take some time and consider how you're going to put it in, you've got quite a lot of time to play with right now by the sounds of things. 

Out of interest, who's helping you with the build? 

[JSM]

Oh to be 16 again, especially with all the time you have!

Like Jay said above, it's just the internet, don't take it personally. You have a lot of older, seasoned folks here who only have your best interest in mind. 

All that aside, you've made tremendous progress. Just avoid the girls for awhile to help you keep focused! 

[psdenno]

13 hours ago, jchoi said:

 I do see the advice I am receiving as helpful but it's too late for me to change it

Spoken like a true 16 year old! 

Keep up the good work, but be prepared for comments and advice when you post your updates.  Posting to this forum is kind of like writing a letter to "Dear Abby".  You may get sound advice you don't want to hear.  Just keep in mind that you're going to get comments backed by a few thousand years of Datsun Z ownership experience.  Take the advice you like and blow off the rest, you're 16, we've all been there.

Dennis

 

 

[jchoi]

Some great replies here. I hope you can take these for what they're worth (advice) rather than taking it personally! 
 
There has been plenty of successful fuel cells installed, and if that's genuinely the way you want to go then it can be done. Lots of examples over on hybridz if you need new ideas (which I suggest you do) 
I'd have to err towards the old boys, there's no real need to swap the fuel tank out for a cell. If yours was rusty then a replacement would have been easier and cheaper. 
However, as you've said you've got the cell now and if you want to use it then it's your project.. Just take some time and consider how you're going to put it in, you've got quite a lot of time to play with right now by the sounds of things. 
Out of interest, who's helping you with the build? 

Hello Jay, Got some friends and my auto shop teacher but school doesn't start till end august.

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