KONI Sports for Classic Z's

[LeonV]

18 hours ago, Captain Obvious said:

I'm no suspension expert and I'm going to go out a little too far on my limb here, but I don't think that's quite right.

I believe the force exerted by the gas is proportional to the diameter of the strut shaft where it exits the cartridge, not the diameter of the internal piston. I don't think the diameter of the internal piston has any effect in this case.

My understanding goes like this:

The more the strut is compressed, the more of the shaft is INSIDE the strut.
The additional volume of the shaft (A*L) inside the strut assy will displace oil inside the body.
That volume of oil displaced will compress the gas inside the strut, but only by the amount of VOLUME of the strut rod which has entered the strut.

The internal gas pressure is static across the internal piston. At least that's how it appears to me way out on my limb here. 

You are correct, thanks for catching that. Everything else I said stands. ?

[Joseph@TheZStore]

Koni Test Drive Z Owner Ian Stewart’s Impressions

"Hello everyone, my 260Z was used as the test vehicle for the new Koni struts. The car was the perfect candidate as I had already rebuilt the suspension with new ball joints, Urethane bushings throughout (both front and rear), stiffer springs and Illumina struts. The only change that was made for the testing was replacing the Illumina’s with the Koni’s. 

The Koni’s are an improvement over the Illumina’s in my opinion. You need to get used to not having a way to tell where you are at as the Koni does not have an indicator, but the adjustment range is much wider and you can really feel the difference when you make a change. I never really noticed differences when I adjusted the Tokico’s, whereas I can definitely feel the difference when I adjust the Koni’s. My car is fitted with 160in-lb front and 180in-lb rear springs that lower it about 1.5 inches from stock. Note that these spring rates are similar to most aftermarket spring sets for Z-Cars, at roughly 2X stiffer than stock springs. At full stiff on the Koni adjustment the car is too harsh, but at full soft, it is comfortable (to me) for street use, I like the ride. I have not auto-crossed the car yet, but expect the full stiff setting will work very well." Ian Stewart.

[gnosez]

I have a question regarding the diameter of the new 240 and early 260 shocks. Given that the race versions (8610 and 8611) are about 1 thousandth or more larger than the strut tube are the new "Sport" Konis smaller than the Race versions?

How do I know they are larger? Ask me how much paint is still on my new 8610s (none) or how much time I've spent honing out each strut tube. When my street 240 needs shocks it would be nice if I didn't have to go through this again.

[KONI Lee]

10 hours ago, gnosez said:

I have a question regarding the diameter of the new 240 and early 260 shocks. Given that the race versions (8610 and 8611) are about 1 thousandth or more larger than the strut tube are the new "Sport" Konis smaller than the Race versions?

How do I know they are larger? Ask me how much paint is still on my new 8610s (none) or how much time I've spent honing out each strut tube. When my street 240 needs shocks it would be nice if I didn't have to go through this again.

The new Z-car KONI Sports are a perfect drop in, easy fit to the factory Z-car strut housings so there is no need for any modifications to make them fit.  The KONI RACE inserts are not Z-car specific but are a generic fit-all insert valved specifically intended for racing usage with a range of dimensional options in a wide range of cars including Mustangs, Porsches, Nissans, Mazdas, etc..  There are a number of vehicles that really respond well to the RACE valving but the factory strut housings are very tight such that one might need to take extra efforts to increase the ID of the strut housing (hone or bore) or decrease the OD of the RACE inserts (sanding down paint, etc.).

If the car is a dedicated racing car, the extra effort to fit the KONI RACE into a Z-car is worthwhile and has been proven with a number of championships.  If the car is used for the normal and performance street driving, autocross, track days, etc. but not up to the level of racing with very high spring rates, the KONI Sports are the right answer.  Also, the KONI Sports do carry the full normal KONI Warranty because they were made for street use on that specifica car whereas the KONI RACE carry no warranty because they were specifically designed for racing on a wide range of cars. 

[KONI Lee]

11 hours ago, Joseph@TheZStore said:

 

The Koni’s are an improvement over the Illumina’s in my opinion. You need to get used to not having a way to tell where you are at as the Koni does not have an indicator, but the adjustment range is much wider and you can really feel the difference when you make a change.  ..." Ian Stewart.

Thanks for the review and feedback, Ian. 

For clarification on knowing where your KONI adjustment settings are, just use the physical hard stop at the full soft setting (clockwise until it stops)  and then the number of full  or partial turns counter clockwise up from that point. Example: Full soft, 1/4 turn from soft, 1 1/8 turn from soft, etc..  This is always repeatable and easily matched side to side, front to rear if desired.  In general most people probably use 1/4 turn adjustment increments but you can do larger or smaller increments if you want.  We have a highly respected and picky BMW tuner whose recommendations go to the 1/16th of a turn.  If you can discern judge that small an incremental change in your car, more power to you but most people are probably more in the ¼ turn range.  Unlike the Tokicos that had only 5 defined adjustment settings, the KONIs can be adjusted to many more settings across a larger overall adjustment range min. to max. with broader affect across the working piston speed range.

[w3wilkes]

@KONI Lee Do you know how many turns from full soft to full hard?

[KONI Lee]

15 minutes ago, w3wilkes said:

@KONI Lee Do you know how many turns from full soft to full hard?

I don't have a Z-car damper readily at hand to check one but most KONIs have a roughly 2.0 to 2.25 turn adjustment range from the stop at full soft to the stop at full firm.  Depending on any minor stack height difference of the internal valving components used in that application, there is some possible variation but rarely does it go less than 1.75 turns or more than 2.50 turns.

Because all KONIs have greater than 1 full turn of adjustment, having external numbered markings like the Tokico would not work.

[Joseph@TheZStore]

5 hours ago, w3wilkes said:

@KONI Lee Do you know how many turns from full soft to full hard?

5 hours ago, KONI Lee said:

I don't have a Z-car damper readily at hand to check one but most KONIs have a roughly 2.0 to 2.25 turn adjustment range from the stop at full soft to the stop at full firm.  Depending on any minor stack height difference of the internal valving components used in that application, there is some possible variation but rarely does it go less than 1.75 turns or more than 2.50 turns.

Because all KONIs have greater than 1 full turn of adjustment, having external numbered markings like the Tokico would not work.

On the demonstration strut we received, it was just what Lee said, roughly 2 turns. The red KONI "Triangle" on the knob sort of works like an arrow to see how far you have turned ?

[w3wilkes]

Thanks, this is helpful.

[gnosez]

I am in the process of switching out my Tokico HTS shocks for a set of Koni 8610-Race because I am increasing the front springs from 375# to 450# which many folks believe is too much for the HTS's to handle before blowing. While this might not be true, having to replace a shock or shocks at the track would be a PIA not to mention that HTSs are NLA. Like the Koni the HTS had a wider range of adjustment with no numbers to go by just the requirement to remember how many turns you made. Unlike the Koni the HTS could not be rebuilt. These Koni "Sport" shocks look to be a perfect solution for every type of driving one might do.

That Koni and MSA are now producing a Better replacement shock for our Zs is wonderful news and I salute their efforts to ensure we can continue to enjoy these great cars for many more years.

I've attached a picture of the Race shock adjuster which I assume is similar to the one used for the Sport version (once it's set you would remove it from the shock and Koni suggests that you put it in the glove box).

[James@TheZStore]

The first wave of 240Z  and early 260Z Sport struts have arrived from Koni.  Pre-sale orders have already shipped if you were one of the early birds.  A special thank you to @KONI Lee for his knowledge and support for the Z community.  Koni has done an outstanding job and we are extremely proud to be teaming up with them to offer such an amazing product.  I will update everyone once the batch of late 260Z and 280Z struts arrive as well as for the 280ZX.  Thank you!

[That Ozzy Guy]

From Holland to the US and down to Australia. Thanks Koni and MSA.