Z's on BAT and other places collection

[HS30-H]

19 minutes ago, Zed Head said:

Frankly, I'm starting to feel embarassed for you guys.  The "Flat-Earth Society" insult is an obvious sign that the discussion has degraded.  There are no winners when things get this bad.  Why not just stop posting?  At least if you start a new thread we can all use the Ignore function of the forum so we don't have to see it.

Personally speaking, I get the feeling that classiczcars.com has degraded every time I look at the New Activity and see another ten photos posted on the 'Boobs' thread.

Of course, you always have the option of the Ignore User function if you don't want to see any of my posts. I don't use it myself, because I'm always trying to be open-minded (LOL).

[DatsunZGuy]

23 minutes ago, Yarb said:

Please exchange email accounts and handle it privately.

I agree. 

This is becoming about as interesting as a diatribe on who invented the potato peeler 🙄  

[Zed Head]

To clarify - I appreciate Carl's rational on-point posts.  You know who he is, he describes his history, and replies with the facts as he understands them.  He has contributed to the Z car world with his web site and his respectful participation in conversations on the various forums.  He makes a new person want to "join the club".

I don't really know who HS30 is.  Apparently his name is Alan (or Allan).  He seems to have a small circle of people who respect his opinion but does not give much reason for anyone new to the field to do the same.  He seems to assume that people should already know who he is.  Can't really tell why his words should mean anything.  He's just a loud voice on the forum.  He makes a new person wonder "do I really want to be a part of this?".

Carl adds, HS30 subtracts.  I appreciate Carl's efforts but sometimes it's best to move on to more productive endeavors.  

[Mark Maras]

 Perhaps we could all agree to disagree on the subject of the Z series question. Knowing that there were improvements throughout the model years I will continue to describe the difference between Series I and II 240 Z as the hatch vents move to the C-pillars. I believe that was all it was meant to describe (in the USA) originally.

[zspert]

I'm going to downshift to 2nd here - heel and toe of course. I was taught, by employees of Datsun US and several parts mgrs, to refer to all MODELS of their products by the production date. Vins only came into play in a VERY FEW ISOLATED cases. 

When I get a call from a Z owner who starts the conversation by calling his baby a Series 1.75 I cut him or her off and ask for the PD, just as I was taught by the persons already mentioned.

 

[HS30-H]

57 minutes ago, Zed Head said:

To clarify - I appreciate Carl's rational on-point posts.  You know who he is, he describes his history, and replies with the facts as he understands them.  He has contributed to the Z car world with his web site and his respectful participation in conversations on the various forums.  He makes a new person want to "join the club".

I don't really know who HS30 is.  Apparently his name is Alan (or Allan).  He seems to have a small circle of people who respect his opinion but does not give much reason for anyone new to the field to do the same.  He seems to assume that people should already know who he is.  Can't really tell why his words should mean anything.  He's just a loud voice on the forum.  He makes a new person wonder "do I really want to be a part of this?".

Carl adds, HS30 subtracts.  I appreciate Carl's efforts but sometimes it's best to move on to more productive endeavors.  

The name's 'HS30-H', not 'HS30'. 

Pretty much everything else in your post is in your head, and you'll have to take responsibility for that yourself.

 

[siteunseen]

(LOL)

[Zed Head]

A not-bad 78 is up, no reserve.  Big bumper delete.  Looks like it might have had a diff swap in the past, it has a yellow mustache bar and an R180.  Could be a fun daily driver.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1978-datsun-280z-160/

[conedodger]

10 hours ago, HS30-H said:

Personally speaking, I get the feeling that classiczcars.com has degraded every time I look at the New Activity and see another ten photos posted on the 'Boobs' thread.

Of course, you always have the option of the Ignore User function if you don't want to see any of my posts. I don't use it myself, because I'm always trying to be open-minded (LOL).

@Mike started that thread. Maybe complain directly to him? 

[Gav240z]

11 hours ago, Zed Head said:

To clarify - I appreciate Carl's rational on-point posts.  You know who he is, he describes his history, and replies with the facts as he understands them.  He has contributed to the Z car world with his web site and his respectful participation in conversations on the various forums.  He makes a new person want to "join the club".

I don't really know who HS30 is.  Apparently his name is Alan (or Allan).  He seems to have a small circle of people who respect his opinion but does not give much reason for anyone new to the field to do the same.  He seems to assume that people should already know who he is.  Can't really tell why his words should mean anything.  He's just a loud voice on the forum.  He makes a new person wonder "do I really want to be a part of this?".

Carl adds, HS30 subtracts.  I appreciate Carl's efforts but sometimes it's best to move on to more productive endeavors.  

Sorry, but what a load of absolute bollocks.

Alan has contributed a lot of useful insights over many years not just in this forum, but other forums, as well as on social media, BAT comments etc.. and many of us appreciate the insights, information and knowledge he's shared with us. If you care to look you'll find over 20 years of posts on this forum alone sharing a wealth of information with those open enough to receiving it, especially when it comes to the in period rally cars, the 432's and 432-R's, HS30-H models etc.. and the people involved with these cars at Nissan and beyond.

The flat earth comments seem somewhat appropriate given the fact that despite all evidence some people chose to just ignore the facts and continue on believing what they want to believe. Or to quote Jonathan Swift "You cannot reason someone out of something he or she was not reasoned into".

This is my opinion after observing many back and forth similar discussions of a similar nature over the years, on here and via other mediums. Over what Nissan's priority for these cars was, and if it was truly designed with an American market as #1 market in mind or not.

But also the flat out refusal to acknowledge that series 1, series 2 labels are a very loose naming convention with far too many holes to hold factual weight when looking at these cars with any degree to accuracy or critical thinking in mind.

If knowing the facts and understanding what these cars are about and their history with any degree of accuracy is going to put off folks from "joining the club" then perhaps the flat earth society is the right place for them anyway? Or maybe something that's a bit more safe like collecting stamps?

I don't know of other car communities for other makes and models where getting the facts right is frowned upon? After all to the right collector/enthusiast the small details (and prices reflected) matter. Take for example the N1 versions of the R32/R33/R34 GTRs, which I view in a similar light to the 432-r's. They command bigger dollars due to their rarity and specialness and it's all the little details that matter. Prices paid, reflect this. Since this thread is about BAT, you can go look at prices on BAT to see what I mean.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1994-nissan-skyline-r32-gtr-v-spec-ii-n1/

Or to draw another comparison with the Skyline segment, just because Nissan sold a few R32 GTRs into the Australian market (~100 or so), doesn't mean Nissan intended to build them with Australian's only in mind. I mean just typing that out seems preposterous to me.

At the end of the day when most North American's refer to cars as being series 1 or series 2, I get what they are 'trying to say'. But the problem is, when you live in other parts of the world (shock horror) these labels are very problematic, because they effectively mean nothing and therefore if you ask 10 different folks what series 1 vs series 2 means you'll often get 10 different ideas (as seen from previous comments in here just recently also).

[Zed Head]

11 hours ago, Gav240z said:

The flat earth comments seem somewhat appropriate given the fact that despite all evidence some people chose to just ignore the facts and continue on believing what they want to believe. Or to quote Jonathan Swift "You cannot reason someone out of something he or she was not reasoned into".

Insulting people on a friendly forum is appropriate?  C'mon.  When do insults ever really cause somebody to change their views?  And your Swift quote could be pointed at HS30.  Kind of funny.

The sad part of it all is that the insults are like the turd in the punch bowl.  Once the turd goes in the whole bowl is ruined.  Nobody wants to drink that punch.  When I see that HS30 has joned a conversation (he never starts one) I know how it will go and how it will end.  It's just who he is, by his internet persona.

And, despite your half page, I don't know more about who HS30 is.  Overall, your reply kind of helps make my point.  A small group of people who value his opinions, for reasons unknown.  

 

I came across a funny article this morning.  That might be his voice...

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2024/feb/23/you-shouldnt-be-doing-that-female-pro-golfer-films-mansplainer-at-driving-range

[DC871F]

Never worked in a corporate setting, but I think I've heard my wife who does work in a corporate setting say many times over the years to (Take it offline).

Zed tried to by offering a pertinent discussion on the thread "Z's on Bat and other places", but that trial balloon got popped as soon as it was floated.

I really enjoy this thread, I really dont want to unsub.

 

I havnt looked, but is there a specific 240z thread discussing the topic at hand, which I think began with someone calling a car a series 1 or something. BTW, I own a 1/71 car, that was one of the last few made in the image of a 1970, I wont dare call it that forbidden name though.