Brand new 'Quick Racks'

[Jason240z]

Hi all

I've been trying to find a source for LHD steering rack bars and pinions, I'm having a batch made here in the UK, they're about 11% quicker than the racks in US spec cars, effectively bringing them to a euro spec 'quick rack'. 

prices are in £240+vat. Thats for a new rack bar and pinion. if you'd like one, as there's an minimum order, i'd have to get a deposit(50%) as I don't want to end up with a garage full of rack bars!

Most of the racks i've had apart have shown wear/loose spots on.

Any interest on here? 

[Jason240z]

just for info, the US market cars were the softest/most dumbed down of all the global range, this is a key part in bringing it 'upto spec'.

[dutchzcarguy]

On 12/27/2020 at 11:31 AM, Jason240z said:

they're about 11% quicker than the racks in US spec cars

Sorry but what do you mean with quicker?  In stead of 2,5 turns it's done from left to right in 2 turns or??  Then you need even more muscles to steer the car.. 😟

Edited December 29, 2020 by dutchzcarguy

[Jason240z]

4 hours ago, dutchzcarguy said:

Sorry but what do you mean with quicker?  In stead of 2,5 turns it's done from left to right in 2 turns or??  Then you need even more muscles to stear the car.. 😟

no, the ratio is changed.

 

Unless you're suggesting the Americans were judged to have weak arms by the Japanese in the 60's and that's the reason they got such 'soft' cars?

[Derek]

16 hours ago, Jason240z said:

no, the ratio is changed

But doesn't the ratio effect the input torque required to turn it? I know in every other application gear ratios and torque required go hand in hand.

16 hours ago, Jason240z said:

Unless you're suggesting the Americans were judged to have weak arms by the Japanese in the 60's and that's the reason they got such 'soft' cars?

Probably had to do with the steering wheel being on the wrong side of the car in the UK.

With the stock width tires on the S30 input torque on the steering wheel is manageable but since most people that own these cars have increased the tire sizes, input torque becomes a valid issue. That is why you see kits available for power steering available now.

 

[dutchzcarguy]

16 hours ago, Jason240z said:

no, the ratio is changed.

What ratio? Maybe i'm the guy standing besides the person with "i'm with stupid" on the shirt? 😉  But i still not understand.   If you mean ratio between the wormwheel and the gearwheel.. then turning the steering wheel WILL be more difficult, as Derek says..

[dutchzcarguy]

18 minutes ago, Derek said:

Probably had to do with the steering wheel being on the wrong side of the car in the UK.

Hihi.. this will be an issue forever..  I don't mind so much to sit and drive on the WRONG side.. although i'm ambidexter i just don't like to shift with the left hand!

 

[HS30-H]

2 hours ago, Derek said:

But doesn't the ratio effect the input torque required to turn it? I know in every other application gear ratios and torque required go hand in hand.

It does, but - for example - a 15:1 steering rack ratio isn't anything like hard work on an S30-series Z. It is well suited to the nature and philosophy of a Sports/GT car, whereas a 17.8:1 ratio - as used in the early HLS30U variants for the north American market - is more like a family car/sedan type ratio. Overly light, and not exactly sharp and responsive, is it?

2 hours ago, Derek said:

Probably had to do with the steering wheel being on the wrong side of the car in the UK.

These cars being Japanese, it is probably more pertinent to look at the Japanese market variants for that. You might not have noticed that Nissan put quite a lot of effort into making sure that the ergonomics of these cars worked just as well in both LHD and RHD forms, even if the layout of the componentry was naturally biased to their RHD market origins.  

Jason's car was originally a US market variant and I believe he considers the 17.8:1 rack ratio to be a little on the 'slow' side. So as part of his rack refurb he's taking the opportunity to 'quicken' up the ratio of the rack and pinion set. I'm not aware of anyone else doing that, so hat's off to him.

 

 

[Derek]

10 minutes ago, HS30-H said:

It does, but - for example - a 15:1 steering rack ratio isn't anything like hard work on an S30-series Z. It is well suited to the nature and philosophy of a Sports/GT car, whereas a 17.8:1 ratio - as used in the early HLS30U variants for the north American market - is more like a family car/sedan type ratio. Overly light, and not exactly sharp and responsive, is it?

 

Well we are now talking visceral vs physics which is a different discussion. A quicker ratio will require more input torque. That I believe isn't open for discussion but I will certainly listen. 

 

14 minutes ago, HS30-H said:

Probably had to do with the steering wheel being on the wrong side of the car in the UK.

That was a joke. If I was in the UK I would want a RHD.

 

15 minutes ago, HS30-H said:

Jason's car was originally a US market variant and I believe he considers the 17.8:1 rack ratio to be a little on the 'slow' side.

I'm in agreement as to the slow side. I installed comp steering arms 20 years ago and have never regretted it.

16 minutes ago, HS30-H said:

I'm not aware of anyone else doing that, so hat's off to him.

Agreed. It's a fair outlay of capital I'm sure. The only reason I've commented is the question about the input torque being higher and Jason's non answer. 

It will require more input torque.

It will have a faster (better) response.

Coupled with the new power steering low speed assists would make a great combination in my opinion. 

[heyitsrama]

I wonder how the steering response is with both a short ratio rack and the competition steering arms. It looks like there are several sellers that offer arms now.

[Jason240z]

As above these are for LHD racks. 

I wasn't altering physics, just pointing out its the same ratio as used in other markets of the car where they sold a more 'sporting' setup.  My 'none' answer was just that its nothing really to worry about, i'm not a fan of power steering, especially these generic kits, just removing the feel that you get with a classic setup.

Its not just about speeding up the rack, its about regaining feel thats been lost from 50 years of use. 

i'm not aware of anyone offering forged steering arms, can you offer a link?

[240260280]

The length of "steering knuckles" also factor in the amount of steering wheel turn to the amount of wheel rotation.

 

@JDMjunkies.ch documented this:

 

I don't know the geometrical details between the various Nissan parts but I would think that new parts would remove slop. This would seem to be the biggest, and most welcome benefit.

Edited December 29, 2020 by 240260280