1974 206Z electric fuel pump question

[Shawninvancouver]

will car run without this electric pump working? what are effects without it?

how hard to change???  

can someone show me one?

 

do they just start working when power is on car??

will the ac delco gm  /  or nappa one work fine???

Edited June 2, 2021 by Shawninvancouver

[SteveJ]

1 hour ago, Shawninvancouver said:

will car run without this electric pump working? what are effects without it?

how hard to change???  

can someone show me one?

 

do they just start working when power is on car??

will the ac delco gm  /  or nappa one work fine???

It should run without the pump working. Lord knows my 73 did (ran until parked...). However, that is only if the rest of the fuel system is fine.

Symptoms of the bad pump could be low fuel pressure or hard starting when the car is hot (vapor lock).

It's not that hard to change, but you better have something to clamp off the line. It might be better to diagnose the system than just throwing parts at it. Maybe even bench test the old fuel pump.

Here's what it looks like: https://www.google.com/search?q=260z+electric+fuel+pump&sxsrf=ALeKk00okqF6AEt_qSB308PAhruYMtew0Q:1622676245782&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiQ9tuJjPrwAhUvU98KHePYB-UQ_AUoAnoECAEQBA&biw=1920&bih=880

Of course, if the fuel lines back there are old, expect to have to replace them. The stock hoses were formed hoses so you have to get some 5/16 metal elbows with extra hose clamps or have long lazy bends to prevent cutting off fuel because the hoses are kinked.

[Shawninvancouver]

what 73 did you have with an electric pump?? i thought they only started on the 74 260s?

engine issue was sputtering... we assumed bad fuel flow..

[SteveJ]

From the factory it started with the 74. The factory had a retrofit kit for the 73 that has the same design for the electric fuel pump...for the same problem (vapor lock). That kit was also when wrapping the fuel rail started, and that's genuine asbestos on the fuel rail, too.

You have presumed much, but what have you diagnosed? What is the fuel pressure? Have you inspected ALL of the fuel hoses from the tank to the mechanical fuel pump? What is the condition of the fuel filter? If you haven't found the electric fuel pump, you probably haven't found the filter.

As for the electric fuel pump, is the wiring intact? Is the pump still installed? Are the relays working? If it's a bad relay, it's a much cheaper fix than replacing the fuel pump and then realizing you need to replace one (or both) of the relays.

It's easy to throw parts at a problem, and it's easy to get frustrated when you realize you have spent a fair amount of money without solving the problem. I ask a lot of questions and tell you to read the FSM because I want you to fix the car right and as cheaply as possible. You have better things to do with your money than waste it on a wild goose chase.

Pay attention to the questions and post answers. If you don't understand the question or how to get the information to answer the question, ask. Just put some effort into it. You'll learn a lot, and you'll get a lot of help.

[Shawninvancouver]

ok.. will do - only thing is alot of stuff is not stock and not in manuals.  asbestos on covers? what do i do????

so there is a filter by the pump??

one last little thing.. where are the relays?? how do i check them?

[SteveJ]

Yes, there are things not covered in the manuals. Trust me. I've spent years reading posts on this site and others to learn. However, do not discount what is in those manuals, such as the location of the filter and the relays. 😉 Your fuel problems could be anything from junk in the tank, to a clogged filter or pump, to a cracked hose that lets air into the system. The maps for most of the things you want to test/inspect are in the FSM.

For the filter, look at page FE-7, just don't look for the word filter.

The relays can be more of a challenge to test, but they can be tested. You'll need a voltage source (a 9 volt battery can work for this) and a multimeter set to resistance to check the contacts. You use the voltage source to activate the relay and ensure the contacts operate properly. When you have the materials together to test, we can go more into the details of testing. That way you don't have to search through as many posts. Also familiarize yourself on how relays work if you haven't played with them before. https://www.explainthatstuff.com/howrelayswork.html

As for the asbestos, yes, the insulation on the fuel rail is asbestos. It's mostly a sleeping dog. If you don't disturb it, nothing happens. If you need to move it some, wet it down well before touching it so it doesn't throw off as many fibers.

 

 

[Shawninvancouver]

cool thanks... i have the FSM -  i still cant find the relays though.. have looked at fuel system and electrical..  can you find the relays in there???

[SteveJ]

The relays are at the passenger kick panel near the fuse box. They are most easily identified by matching the wiring diagram to the relays.

[Shawninvancouver]

Man. I’m no electrician.  Are they the standard square boxes ? It looked like they have wire harness plugs.   Are there others under there or just the fuel pump ones??

[Patcon]

Shawn,

Let's slow down a little bit...

You have one of the best people on the forum to walk you through this and he can teach you the electrical but you have to do your part.

People on the forum are trying to help you repair your car from hundreds or thousands of miles away. When we ask questions you need to answer each one in order. You also need to read the FSM's some. You won't understand it all but it will make it easier to help you fix things the more familiar you are with the manual. If you can do those things the people on the forum will help you figure it out.

Ive seen it happen 100's of time. Steve is giving great advise and there is no reason for any of else to give advice and confuse the issue. Just be patient

 

[SteveJ]

Charles has a good point, Shawn. Start with the easy stuff first. That would be the first paragraph in post #6.

It sounds like the electric fuel pump operation will be more challenging for you to diagnose, but that's okay.

Also, let's pause to talk about safety. There is a good chance you'll be needing to work around the gas tank. Do you have access to a lift or solid jack stands? Jack stand points are shown in the FSM. Wear safety glasses to keep all of that old grease out of your eyes, and your Covid mask will keep that crap out of your mouth (experience talking here).

If you need to replace the hoses in the tank, drain the gas tank. There is a drain plug on the tank. Just make sure you have enough storage to catch the gas. I like using a huge oil catch pan (5 gallon) and have a couple of 5 gallon gas cans in case the tank was pretty full. Have plenty of 5/16 fuel line (low pressure fuel line will work). If you remove lines, do it section by section so you don't accidentally mix up your supply and return from the tank. As I mentioned before, if the fuel line around the electric fuel pump has never been touched, it is definitely old and brittle. When I dropped the tank to remove the rear bumper many years ago, those lines snapped like dried twigs.

Have compressed air available to blow out the hard lines, too. It doesn't hurt. You may need to drop the tank and clean it out, too. That is a technically easy but time consuming process the first time you do it.

[Shawninvancouver]

Thanks Steve.  I will eventually get to all that.  I think the first thing we will do is make sure car runs from fuel right by the mechanical pump.  Last owner had a Jerry can right by mechanical pump abd that’s how they were testing car. If car runs ok off Jerry can they I can tackle fuel flow from tank to machanical pump.  Can the 260 run like the 240 with just a mechanical pump?

is there a way to clean the metal fuel line?