How Do You Properly Run An Oil Catch Can?

[Av8ferg]

That makes sense, I was wondering why most modern engines don’t vent out the block as in our L-Series engines but only out the valve cover(s).
It seems that maybe the best approach is a duel catch can approach. Saw several people doing this online. One for the crankcase with a PCV valve before the catch can to the inlet side of can followed but the outlet side to port in the bottom the intake. The one from the valve cover to another small can and then to the rubber boot before the intake. This should mitigate all the vent issues while catching the oil and minimizing what gets put back in for combustion.


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[Av8ferg]

That makes sense, I was wondering why most modern engines don’t vent out the block as in our L-Series engines but only out the valve cover(s).
It seems that maybe the best approach is a duel catch can approach. Saw several people doing this online. One for the crankcase with a PCV valve before the catch can to the inlet side of can followed but the outlet side to port in the bottom the intake. The one from the valve cover to another small can and then to the rubber boot before the intake. This should mitigate all the vent issues while catching the oil and minimizing what gets put back in for combustion.


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[Racer X]

15 minutes ago, Av8ferg said:

That makes sense, I was wondering why most modern engines don’t vent out the block as in our L-Series engines but only out the valve cover(s).
 

Emissions regulations eliminated open crankcases way back in the late 1970s.  Since then all engines reingest the crankcase vapors to be burned with the fuel/air mixture.

[duffymahoney]

6 hours ago, AK260 said:

 

 

So here’s a recent DSI engine pic below.- he doesn’t block them.



I’m not convinced by the suggestion that if you block it, the fumes would just come out of the top. Why would Nissan and other manufacturers have gone through the trouble of putting vents at the top and off the block? But I don’t know enough about how sealed the bottom is from the top to have an informed opinion.

And here’s a novel approach by [mention=32065]jonbill[/mention] - I love the no nonsense mindset! But maybe he can shed light on how he fixed it to the block.

 

 

I have 2 friends with DSI motors with the PCV port blocked.  Glad he isn't doing that anymore.  

[Av8ferg]

Emissions regulations eliminated open crankcases way back in the late 1970s.  Since then all engines reingest the crankcase vapors to be burned with the fuel/air mixture.

Smarty Pants....amazed you guys have kept up with regulatory changes in the automotive industry. ICE engines are being outlawed in CA In 2035. The final nail in combustion engines coffin. When CA closed the San Onofre Nuclear power plant about 8 yrs ago they essentially added 1 million cars to CA from a emissions perspective. Thought that was an interesting factoid.


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[jonbill]

fwiw, my block that Ali pictured above is a mid 80s v57 LD block. It came with no crank case vent holes of any kind.  We drilled and tapped it (1" NPT maybe?) and I fitted that hose connector. 

[Racer X]

1 hour ago, Av8ferg said:

Smarty Pants....amazed you guys have kept up with regulatory changes in the automotive industry. ICE engines are being outlawed in CA In 2035. The final nail in combustion engines coffin. When CA closed the San Onofre Nuclear power plant about 8 yrs ago they essentially added 1 million cars to CA from a emissions perspective. Thought that was an interesting factoid.


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I was a journeyman mechanic for 30 years, and a state certified diesel and gas emissions specialist (among many other certifications). I’ve probably forgotten more than the average shade tree mechanic knows.

I am interested to see how California is going to get by without internal combustion engines. Agriculture is the state’s largest industry, with plenty of tractors and trucks. Then there is the trucking industry, and no manufacturer is currently producing all electric long haul trucks. Locomotives are another one that is going to be difficult to replace with pure electric. 
 

I wonder if anyone has worked out how they will be able to generate and distribute enough electricity to run all the cars, trucks, buses and trains.

Oh, and as far as I know, no one is trying to work out how to make commercial airliners and cargo plane work reliably and safely on batteries.

 

 

[psdenno]

12 minutes ago, Racer X said:

I am interested to see how California is going to get by without internal combustion engines. Agriculture is the state’s largest industry, with plenty of tractors and trucks. Then there is the trucking industry, and no manufacturer is currently producing all electric long haul trucks.

I think the governor and his crew will be phased out long before gasoline engines in California.  Here's what the plan calls for:

California Air Resources Board will develop regulations to mandate that 100 percent of in-state sales of new passenger cars and trucks are zero-emission by 2035 – a target which would achieve more than a 35 percent reduction in greenhouse gas emissions and an 80 percent improvement in oxides of nitrogen emissions from cars statewide. In addition, the Air Resources Board will develop regulations to mandate that all operations of medium- and heavy-duty vehicles shall be 100 percent zero emission by 2045 where feasible, with the mandate going into effect by 2035 for drayage trucks. To ensure needed infrastructure to support zero-emission vehicles, the order requires state agencies, in partnership with the private sector, to accelerate deployment of affordable fueling and charging options. It also requires support of new and used zero-emission vehicle markets to provide broad accessibility to zero-emission vehicles for all Californians. The executive order will not prevent Californians from owning gasoline-powered cars or selling them on the used car market.

Edited July 30, 2021 by psdenno

[Patcon]

I agree that electricity is one of the biggest hurdles. California already has issues producing and transferring power. With an enormous demand added, how will that be accomplished.  Definitely not hydro! The lakes are already painfully low. Nuclears out, coal, nope. Natural gas is still an emitter.

Green sources are erratic and storage of excess energy is a problem. Will be interesting to see how it plays out

[Zed Head]

On 7/26/2021 at 10:26 PM, Ownallday said:

fume up the cabin slightly

If you want to avoid the fumes you'll have to run a closed system, like a PCV.  So any vents under the hood won't work.  Or you could run the vents to an area that is clear of the cabin, maybe all the way back the rear of the car.

If you run a closed system it needs to be properly balanced so that you don't have high air flow through the crankcase pulling suspended oil out before it can settle.  I've been hanging out on a Ford truck site and people get on there all the time talking about how they're pulling like a pint of oil a week in to their catch cans.  Maintaining their catch cans turns in to a full time job.  I think that the catch can system designers might be designing their system to pull a lot of oil.  The people that have them want to see stuff in the can.  If it's empty they'll think the can is not working.

Even Ford has jumped in to the "upgrade" game but their system has to meet the PCV needs.  It's more complex than the typical shiny metal can aftermarket systems.  Interesting to study.  Read the hype in the a copy.

https://www.cjponyparts.com/ford-performance-oil-air-separator-kit-passenger-side-mustang-5-0l-2018-2021/p/M6766A50A/

https://www.cjponyparts.com/ford-performance-oil-air-separator-kit-gt350-gt350r-2015-2020/p/M6766A50K/

https://www.cjponyparts.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=+Ford+Performance+Oil-Air+Separator

[Zed Head]

p.s. we used to build vent filters for our vacuum pumps that were about 8 inch lengths of two inch pipe packed with stainless steel wool.  The steel wool collected the suspended oil and let it drain back in to the vacuum pump case, while the "cleaned" evacuated gases could exit.  The same basic concept as the steel wool in the block side port in the Datsun blocks, I think.  If I was going to run a vented valve cover I'd build something like that, concept-wise, to keep the area cleaner.  It would probably be ugly, but might be effective.

[Av8ferg]

The amount of carbon deposits on the head and pistons on the engine I rebuilt was remarkable. I’d like to mitigate that from happening again. Those deposits, hurt fuel efficiency and create hot spots I’ve read and can hurt CR. I think I’ll probably run two small independent cans like I mentioned above and see how it works.
As far as CA power problems this has been brewing for years. I have no problem with going to cleaner energy sources but they have to have replacements in place before making restriction laws. I lived in Ca about half of my life. Everything has become crazy expensive there especially electricity and water. If they went full EV they’re going to need serious power plants to make that happen. New nuclear plants are illegal the CA and they’re work hard to ban coal plants too. I know they buy much of their energy from AZ. That’s just exporting your CO2. It’s going to be an interesting experiment, glad I don’t live there anymore.


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