Clock question

[Humbug]

The clock in my '76 starts when I connect 21 volts, runs for a few minutes, and then stops. The hands do not move.

I know this because I have removed it to look inside it.

Everything looks clean. I lubed it with three-in-one oil, with no satisfaction.

Can someone say with certainty that a new board would fix it?

Joe

[Patcon]

Oiling can be bad for the clocks

[cgsheen1]

From the web:

Place the 1-quart container in a well ventilated area. Pour the oleic acid into the container. If pure oleic acid is unavailable, Murphy’s Oil Soap may be used a substitute, as it is essentially the same substance, and works well as an ingredient in clock movement cleaning solution.

Add the acetone to the oleic acid. Slowly pour the ammonium hydroxide into the mixture of oleic acid and acetone. Do not pour too quickly, or the mixture will splatter. Ammonium hydroxide, 26 degree Baume, is a common, commercially available preparation of ammonia. The 26 degree Baume refers to the strength of the solution, and is equal to a solution that contains roughly 30 percent ammonia by weight.

 

 

Let the mixture stand for a few moments after adding the ammonium hydroxide. Clumps of soap-like material will begin to appear on the surface of the mixture. Lightly cover the opening of the 1-quart container. Do not seal it airtight. Leave the mixture in the container for about two hours, or until the clumps have completely settled out into the mixture.

Pour one gallon of water into the large container. Add the contents of the 1-quart container to the large container to form the clock movement cleaning solution.

Things You'll Need:

• 1 quart container
• 4 ounces oleic acid
• 8 ounces acetone
• 12 ounces ammonium hydroxide solution, 26 degree Baume
• Large container – 5 quarts or more
• 1 gallon water

Tip

If using the clock movement cleaning solution in connection with an ultrasonic cleaner, dilute the finished solution with an additional one quart of water.

If making larger or smaller amounts of clock movement cleaning solution, increase or reduce the ingredients proportionally.

Warnings:

• Wear rubber gloves when working with ammonium hydroxide. Avoid breathing in the fumes.

 

Simple, ya?

 

Actually there are pre-made clock cleaning solutions available and most people also use an ultrasonic cleaner. That works for cleaning the movement parts if they haven't been damaged and/or not excessively worn.

Edited October 15, 2021 by cgsheen1

[Jeff Berk]

I think if the clock has reached the point of requiring 21volts to run at all, there is a problem. Those old auto clocks, unlike modern quartz clocks, should be professionally cleaned and oiled (yes oiled) periodically. Oiling is needed at specific friction points and requires clock oil, not 3-in-1. I'd be a little concerned about dumping the whole clock in a cleaning solution. 

The clock has both a mechanical and an electronic part. In a clock, there are two plates with shafts holding moving parts pivoting or spinning on axils between the plates. Where the axils rest on the plates, there are holes that need to be kept clean and lubricated or the holes become elongated and would need to be repaired with bushings. If you have a grandfather clock sitting around, you'll notice that these holes in the plates actually have oil cups. You might want to try and clean these holes then use clock oil applied using a needle tip.

A bit of advice, don't let the battery in the car run low. A low voltage can damage the "points" that trigger the winding mechanism.

If all else fails, several people specialize in replacing original clock mechanisms with quartz which do not require maintenance. There is something about the tick-tick-tick which I like to hear (before I start the car and drown out all noise with my header exhaust).  

I was able to fix my '74 clock by cleaning and LIGHT oiling so repair is possible.

This goes in depth and specifically shows where to oil and with what:

https://www.oldcarsweekly.com/features/putting-the-ticktock-back-in-your-old-car-clock

Edited October 16, 2021 by Jeff Berk
Added link

[dutchzcarguy]

10 hours ago, Jeff Berk said:

if the clock has reached the point of requiring 21volts to run at all,

I thought the same but then.. i thought it's just a typo! he meant to say 12 volt..  

[Terrapin Z]

Ron specializes in Z clocks. 

https://zclocks.com

[Humbug]

1 hour ago, Terrapin Z said:

Ron specializes in Z clocks. 

https://zclocks.com

Yes, well aware of it. That’s a big reason I’m trying to find out the source of my clock’s problem. I’d not want to order and install a new circuit board, only to find that wasn’t what was wrong. 

[Humbug]

4 hours ago, dutchzcarguy said:

I thought the same but then.. i thought it's just a typo! he meant to say 12 volt..  

Yes, it was a typo. My old eyes are no longer reliable. 

[Roberts280Z]

I replaced the transistor and capacitors in my 280z clock, and that got it running again.  You would need soldering skills.  There is a procedure for this somewhere, and I can probably find it again.

[Humbug]

1 hour ago, Roberts280Z said:

I replaced the transistor and capacitors in my 280z clock, and that got it running again.  You would need soldering skills.  There is a procedure for this somewhere, and I can probably find it again.

Thanks, I’ll look for it. I think I can handle the soldering, but don’t know where to buy the parts, now that Radio Shack has departed. 

[Roberts280Z]

I bought everything from Mouser.  I agree with you on Radio Shack, but it must have been a difficult business selling one or two components at a time.

[zclocks]

I noticed this tread and have a couple of comments. There are three clocks talked about here which are all different and have unique problems. The 74 260z was delivered with two clocks. Very early 74 the clock was the same as the 240zand the later clock was the 280 version. So we have the 240, 280 and what appears to be a  VDO clock that are all different.

As far as the 240z goes if you put 21volts on any of the clocks you will cook the parts. This clock is very sensitive to dirt, grease and oil. If you look at the enclosed you will see what oil does to the clock gears. Oil collects dirt like a magnet and turns into grease. This is what stops the 240 clocks. Disassembly and cleaning is the only way to put the clock back in service for many years. Also, inspection of the bearing points in necessary or you will be disassembling the clock within a short time. Again the enclosed shows a worn bearing  and this part needs to be re-bushed. All the oil in the world won't help this condition.

The 280z mechanism has very few bearing points and does not need any oil. The caps on the circuit board are the main problem and the spring is the second as well as the pink gear (missing teeth) on the enclosed. The other problem is the coils on the circuit board. Either of the two can be open,shorted, or incorrect resistance.

As far as cleaning DO NOT use the cleaning solution as mentioned. This is an old clock makes formula and is VERY VERY caustic / dangerous. This is as dangerous to your lungs as using epoxy paint without a respirator. The cost to make such a formula is about $60--80 depending on where you can get the items. Also, the ammonia(20%) can only be purchased at a chemical supply house and runs about $35 / quart!  Also, this formula will destroy and degrade the nylon and plastic of your clocks. DO NOT use it. Isopropyl alcohol is the best solvent and yes it takes a little elbow grease, but it works.

I am not a clock maker, but I have repaired , cleaned and refurbished many grandfather clocks as well as hundreds of 240- 280 clocks. Oiling is something you should due for a grandfather clock as it has weights that drive the mechanisms that weight several pounds. With this kind of force on pivot points and bearings need to be oiled. Our Datsun clocks do not have this kind of force on the pivots. The 280z mechanical clock has several bearing that support pivots that are plastic and they do not need to be oiled.

The correct way to oil something, if you must, is one drop of oil on the bearing/pivot and wipe off all visible oil. Clock oils today are synthetic and have a much higher load and degree of temperature resistant than organic based oils of the past.

Hope this helps.

Ron