Not quite overheating

[siteunseen]

My Dad used this stuff a couple of times so I guess it worked for him anyway in old El Caminos? Says not to use in aluminum radiators though.

https://www.amazon.com/Permatex-80030-Heavy-Radiator-Cleaner/dp/B000HBGHPY?th=1

 

[chaseincats]

I'm guessing at this point its stuff hanging out in the coolant passages not the radiator.  Regarding the IR temp gun, I tried that today and the gauge is indeed reading right.  With the car in my shady garage it was apparently around 88 degrees in there and after running for maybe 15 minutes with the AC on and the hood closed it got up to around 195.  Any thoughts on that number?

[w3wilkes]

With Dallas being fairly close to sea level the boiling point of water is right about 212*F. Based on that you've got about 15*F to play with if you ran straight water. Then mix that with antifreeze which has a boiling point of around 387*F a 50/50 mixture would have a boiling point around 223*F so you would have almost 30*F to play with before you boil. You will have a little more room due to the cooling system being pressurized which will raise the boiling point temp even more. One other little thing is that water typically is the best at heat transfer where the 50/50 water / antifreeze may not be quite as good at transferring heat from the engine. This is kind of just off the top of my head. I'd bet @Captain Obvious or @siteunseen would be able to provide more and probably better enlightenment!

My thought is you should be okay at 195*F and I'm sure as soon as you start moving it will come down.

[Captain Obvious]

2 hours ago, siteunseen said:

My Dad used this stuff a couple of times so I guess it worked for him anyway in old El Caminos? Says not to use in aluminum radiators though.

https://www.amazon.com/Permatex-80030-Heavy-Radiator-Cleaner/dp/B000HBGHPY?th=1

 

The active ingredient in that stuff is  "HYDROCHLORIC ACID    7647-01-0 10-20"

I wouldn't put that stuff in my aluminum headed Z motor. Especially hot.

[chaseincats]

More numbers for you guyw

15 hours ago, w3wilkes said:

With Dallas being fairly close to sea level the boiling point of water is right about 212*F. Based on that you've got about 15*F to play with if you ran straight water. Then mix that with antifreeze which has a boiling point of around 387*F a 50/50 mixture would have a boiling point around 223*F so you would have almost 30*F to play with before you boil. You will have a little more room due to the cooling system being pressurized which will raise the boiling point temp even more. One other little thing is that water typically is the best at heat transfer where the 50/50 water / antifreeze may not be quite as good at transferring heat from the engine. This is kind of just off the top of my head. I'd bet @Captain Obvious or @siteunseen would be able to provide more and probably better enlightenment!

My thought is you should be okay at 195*F and I'm sure as soon as you start moving it will come down.

More numbers for you.  Today it was 95 and after a long drive with the AC on the whole way, with the sun directly shining on the hood, when I got off the highway it got up to 203 when I shot it with the IR temp gun when I got home.  I put water wetter in it the other day for what it's worth.  I took a look at the overflow bottle (which was never filled but I filled the radiator to the top of the neck and it was empty if that helps at all.

 

Any ideas?

[w3wilkes]

8 minutes ago, chaseincats said:

Any ideas?

Sounds like everything you're doing should be raising the boiling point of your coolant which I believe is a good thing. Once  coolant starts boiling in the block the air bubbles touching metal cannot pull heat from the metal anymore which can lead to bad things happening.

Didn't you say you were running a 190*F TStat? You could try changing that out for a 160*F TStat and see if that helps bring your temps down. From what I've read here you would want the TStat with the centered valve rather than the one with the smaller offset valve.

[chaseincats]

3 minutes ago, w3wilkes said:

Sounds like everything you're doing should be raising the boiling point of your coolant which I believe is a good thing. Once  coolant starts boiling in the block the air bubbles touching metal cannot pull heat from the metal anymore which can lead to bad things happening.

Didn't you say you were running a 190*F TStat? You could try changing that out for a 160*F TStat and see if that helps bring your temps down. From what I've read here you would want the TStat with the centered valve rather than the one with the smaller offset valve.

It has a 170 degree thermostat currently.  The thermostat that was in there was a Nissan center feed 170 degree thermostat, and after putting the new 170 one with the offset valve (before changing any other part of the cooling system) I had the same issues so it shouldn't be that.  I do remember it getting even hotter last year when i was sitting in traffic with the AC on so it really shouldn't be the new thermostat.

Is the radiator throwing coolant into the overflow bottle the sign that things are too hot?  Basically asking if I should care what the temp gauge is saying if it's not hot enough to push coolant out of the rad.

Edited May 28, 2022 by chaseincats

[Zed Head]

On 5/24/2022 at 12:06 PM, chaseincats said:

I believe its coolant since its white (not blue) and has a sweet smell

Seems like you might be avoiding the hard truth.  Flushing the passages of a cooling system that used to work fine instead of verifying that your head gaskets are in good shape.  If you have a blown head gasket flushing will not help.

You can get a test kit for not a lot of money.  Harbor Freight, OReilly, Amazon.

https://www.lislecorp.com/specialty-tools/combustion-leak-detector

 

Is your heater core connected?  You don't have it bypassed?  Bypassing the heater core can cause cooling problems.

 

[chaseincats]

3 minutes ago, Zed Head said:

Seems like you might be avoiding the hard truth.  Flushing the passages of a cooling system that used to work fine instead of verifying that your head gaskets are in good shape.  If you have a blown head gasket flushing will not help.

You can get a test kit for not a lot of money.  Harbor Freight, OReilly, Amazon.

https://www.lislecorp.com/specialty-tools/combustion-leak-detector

 

Is your heater core connected?  You don't have it bypassed?  Bypassing the heater core can cause cooling problems.

 

Alright, I'll give it a look.  The heater core is connected - I did not turn it on while testing the temperature max though.

[Captain Obvious]

5 minutes ago, chaseincats said:

Is the radiator throwing coolant into the overflow bottle the sign that things are too hot? 

If everything is working as intended, then pushing coolant out into the overflow bottle is not only "not a problem", but it is actually a good thing.

There should always be some coolant in the overflow bottle and the level should actually change as the engine heats up and cools back down. When the engine heats up, it pushes coolant out into the bottle, and then when the engine cools back down, it should suck the same amount of coolant back into the engine.

I'm actually more concerned that your bottle was ever completely dry. That should not be the case.

[chaseincats]

1 minute ago, Captain Obvious said:

If everything is working as intended, then pushing coolant out into the overflow bottle is not only "not a problem", but it is actually a good thing.

There should always be some coolant in the overflow bottle and the level should actually change as the engine heats up and cools back down. When the engine heats up, it pushes coolant out into the bottle, and then when the engine cools back down, it should suck the same amount of coolant back into the engine.

I'm actually more concerned that your bottle was ever completely dry. That should not be the case.

After I changed the radiator, I had enough coolant to fill the radiator to the top but not enough for the bottle.  I figured the radiator would fill the bottle if the engine got warm enough so I didn't get more coolant.  Is that not the case?

[Zed Head]

It's not an "overflow" bottle.  It's a reservoir.

Edited May 28, 2022 by Zed Head