Need Original Key Blanks - Plus Lock and Key Info - Rekeying

[inline6]

So, I have a 6/71 Z and have determined that it should have the cool keys... You know, the ones with round heads and painted black.  Any of you hoarders (meant in a nice way 😀) willing to part with your original key blanks?  Come on... You know you will never, ever actually need them.  It will go to a very good new home 🙏 ...

at Christmas 🎄 too.  

This key blank:

Fat groove on bottom when key is pointing to the right.  

 

Thanks for looking.

Edited December 23, 2022 by inline6

[kats]

Hi, I bought a key from him a long time ago, http://www.kuro-key.com/item/?ca_category=15&icon[]=1

if he is still in business, it would be a good choice for your car.

I looked at his key very carefully with my genuine key side by side. Only subtle differences between them, I would say

no one can tell which one is which without having a genuine one in hand.

Kats

 

[kats]

I should look at the title first, you want an original key. Then my recommendation above is not suitable for you.

 inline6, I love originals just like you.. When I finally have got the original keys, I sold blank keys which I bought from him.

Kats

[inline6]

Thanks for the information Kats.  I am looking further into what my situation is with locks and keys.  When I acquired the car, it came with one key for the ignition (R type).  The original hatch lock was missing.  And there was no key for the left and right door locks and glove box lock (but I can tell they are R type as well).  With no key, I cannot confirm so far that the glove box lock matches the left and right door locks.  However, I can confirm that the 1 letter 4 number combination on the left and right door locks match.  I see a 4 digit number on the glove box lock that does not match.  Does the glove box lock have key code information on it?

A spare hatch lock with a key came with the car, but it is the L type.  So, I won't be able to use it if I want to only have one key to work all locks, which is what I desire.  

@DutchZCarGuy sent me information about how to modify the wafers in the key lock to match an existing key, but I'd like to attempt to get a working lock set without modifying them first, if I can.

I am thinking of finding a locksmith who can make a key blank to match the code on my door locks.  I hope that will work the glove box lock also.  Then, I would need to have a locksmith modify the ignition lock and a hatch lock that uses an R type key.  I have a spare hatch lock from a previous car which uses the R type key.  The only downside is that the stainless parts of it are in poor condition.

So, I am having to mix and modify to get a matching lock set that can use one key.  And I want two original keys to go with it. 

 

Edited December 16, 2022 by inline6

[inline6]

Still figuring out my key and lock situation.  I found some locksmiths online who have been in business a very long time and sent them inquiries.  One was a little more than an hour away, but they said they only do "mobile" and wouldn't drive that far.  Yeah.  Whatever.  The other hasn't responded. 

So, in the meantime, I have been messing around with some of the locks I have on hand.  After lubricating two door locks (with the same code) and a hatch lock, I was able to operate all three with a key I have (cut into a Curtis blank).  The stainless covers and key "doors" on all of these locks are in rough shape.  Curiosity got the best of me and I took the hatch lock apart and took some pictures.

What you are looking at here is the hatch lock cylinder in side profile view.  The key is not inserted presently.  Note the little bumps along the bottom of the cylinder - bottom in the picture those are "wafers", which we will see more closely in a min:

 

In this next picture, the key has been inserted.  Note that the bumps (wafers) have moved a bit.  The second one from the right is sticking out from the cylinder noticeably less:

 

Here, I have removed one wafer.  It pushes out (snaps out) with only a little, initial resistance.  

A closer look at the wafer:

 

I'm not sure how they differ, but one thing I suspect after looking at things closely:  The key I have, which works the lock... I don't think it is actually the correct key.  When I insert the key, the wafers are supposed to retract into the body of the cylinder fully, or at least such that, all of them extend out of the cylinder only a small and equal amount.  With all retracted, the cylinder will turn inside the sleeve (not pictured), and thus the lock operates.  With any of the wafers sticking out of the cylinder, the lock is not supposed to turn/operate. 

Found this helpful info.  Maybe I will be rekeying the locks myself.  

https://objects.eanixter.com/PD508330.PDF 

 

 

[inline6]

Just bought this and will play around with it some, see what I can accomplish.  Maybe, the right parts are here to rekey the hatch and door and glove box to match my ignition key.  Or, maybe some other option is possible.  

[Captain Obvious]

9 hours ago, inline6 said:

Here, I have removed one wafer.  It pushes out (snaps out) with only a little, initial resistance.  
I'm not sure how they differ

They differ by changing the where the location of the rectangular hole is with respect to the top and bottom edges.

When you get the right wafers in the right spots and insert the right key, it should look like this pic. Note that the wafer farthest from the key is used simply as a retaining device for the cylinder to be held into the lock body. In other words... It should always be proud, even with a key inserted. Looks like this:

[inline6]

So, the rectangular slot cut in the wafer varies in height.  And thanks for confirming the correct position of the wafers when the key is inserted. 

From looking at key codes on various locks I have, it seems likely that the numeric digits vary for Datsun locks from 0-9.  While investigating the rekeying kits, the one I bought seems to be comprehensive for door locks. The kit, however, has only 4 wafer part numbers. 

How does one use 4 tumbler wafers and achieve all the combinations to correspond to the lock codes (0-9)?  Do locksmiths have to modify to slots in the wafers?  

 

 

[Patcon]

I don't know that you can if they have 9 wafers and you only have 4. You can't invert them because they're not symmetrical.

I rekey kwickset and Schlage locks sometimes and there are only like 6 different pins. I would be surprised if there were 9 different wafers available for a 50 yo Datsun lock...

[Captain Obvious]

12 hours ago, inline6 said:

So, the rectangular slot cut in the wafer varies in height.

How does one use 4 tumbler wafers and achieve all the combinations to correspond to the lock codes (0-9)?  Do locksmiths have to modify to slots in the wafers?  

No, the rectangular slot does not vary in height. It varies in position. The position of the slot will be closer to the top of the tumbler for each tumbler.

If you look closely at the pic you posted of from the ASP catalog, you can see they tried to draw them that way. It's a subtle difference, but enough to make the lock work. Goes like this:

And about the number of tumblers... I'm no locksmith, but I've only ever seen four different tumblers for these locks. Where are you getting numbers between 0 and 9?

I don't know if they changed the number of tumblers in the hatch over the years (like they did with the ignition lock), but my 77 has five tumblers in it. With four choices of tumbler for each position, that works out to different 1024 possibilities.

[inline6]

Oh, yep, I see.  

Regarding the numbers 0-9, if you look on eBay for NOS Datsun locks, there are enough right now to see lock code combinations including 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, 8, 9, and 0.  I'm guessing 6 is valid as well.  So, I don't know how 4 wafers identified as #1, #2, #3, and #4 in the kit turn into codes like M7048, N1709, N1534, (all ebay auctions for NOS Nissan locks) etc.  My hatch lock only has 4 tumblers.  This kit has four distinct wafers  I can't see any evidence looking online of the existence of another necessary kit for the 240z.  So, I am wondering if locksmiths have to use special files in order to modify the rectangular cutouts depending on the code number.  Maybe the wafers in the kit are starting points, and for certain code numbers, you have to file the slot.  Doesn't make any sense to me, actually.  There must be something I am missing.  

 

 

 

[Patcon]

I doubt filing is necessary. Pins and wafers are normally plug & play