Finally found a 69 240z, #51 Time to finish a 30 year multiple owner restoration.

[Gav240z]

Actually managed to find the images of other early features on HS30 0004.

Plastic clip inspection lid

AM Radio - no signal seek function and no power antenna switch (similar to Fairlady Z-S specification)

Early style ventilated (hat) brake rotors.

But here is the curve ball, since HLS30 in 1969 had the solid rear glass, no defrost glass. But HS30 0004 is different.

Temperlite stamp

Rear view mirror date stamp and horn date stamps

And the sump plug and sump (welded in sections)

[dspillman]

4 hours ago, Gav240z said:

Actually managed to find the images of other early features on HS30 0004.

Plastic clip inspection lid

AM Radio - no signal seek function and no power antenna switch (similar to Fairlady Z-S specification)

Early style ventilated (hat) brake rotors.

But here is the curve ball, since HLS30 in 1969 had the solid rear glass, no defrost glass. But HS30 0004 is different.

Temperlite stamp

Rear view mirror date stamp and horn date stamps

And the sump plug and sump (welded in sections)

 

Looking at the rear glass appears to be replaced……is dated January 71.  
     I owned hls30-1222 years ago, plastic clips, and vented hats.

[HS30-H]

4 hours ago, Gav240z said:

I guess my question is this: are the plastic inspection lid clips considered a 1969 production date feature?

No, I don't think they are.

Just as an example of personal experience, my 4/70 HLS30U has the plastic clips. I think they continued well into 1970, so not a factor in pinning down the production date of HS30-00004.

I reckon many of the component parts of HS30-00004 will for sure have been manufactured in 1969 (especially the early HS30-specific stuff like the wiring harness sections) but they may not be enough to be conclusive about the date it got its 'OK' sticker...

Key point for me was always that 'HS30-00001' was the seventh car in the factory program to be given a unique identity and the fourth of the 'Ichiji Seishi'/'Seisan Shisaku' production prototypes, as confirmed by Nissan Shatai's own records. For many years 'HS30-00004' was being used by nay-sayers as 'proof' that no HS30-prefixed cars had been made in 1969 and that - by extension - Nissan had not considered HS30-prefixed cars as part of their original plan. We know this to be totally false. 

'HS30-00004' is in my opinion a very significant car in the S30-series Z story. 

[dspillman]

Gav240z…  

   Appears to have the plastic clips, and bolt through rubber hood stops.. putting it in January-ish time span

[kats]

20 hours ago, Gav240z said:

Does anyone know when the plastic inspection lid clips were phased out? Date wise?

Reason I ask is that HS30 0004 has build date features in line with 1969 production HLS30s such as the bonnet (or hood as you'd call it in North America) without the corner support brackets where the hood meets the windscreen cowl panel/inspection lids and the solid rear plastic panel in the boot (no tail lamp bulb access covers).

I've got photos of the above attributes attached, and I can't find them now, but I'm certain HS30 0004 had the plastic fender inspection lid clips too. (I'll try and dig the photo out if I can find it).

I'm fairly certain HS30 0004 started production in 1969 or early 70, but may have been put on pause whilst other things happened at the factory as @HS30-H points out here.

https://www.viczcar.com/forums/topic/36375-1969-240z-hs30-00048-destroyed-seeking-advice/?do=findComment&comment=246026

In my experience to date, I haven't seen other HS30 (AU) market cars with the plastic clips on the inspection lids yet. Hence why I'm wondering when the plastic clips changed.

My own car HS30 00051 had the early Nissan 2400 OHC valve cover, which I know was sort of phased out around July 1970 and many other early AU market 240z's had the 2400 OHC valve cover, but they stopped somewhere between HS30 00100 and HS30 00149.

I guess my question is this: are the plastic inspection lid clips considered a 1969 production date feature?

 

Hi Gavin,

I posted this some time ago,  a Z432 has plastic tabs for its lids. This car has April 1970 seat belt tag. On the other hand, the green BAT 310000 USD 240Z has metal crips was manufactured date 05/70. So we can say there is a border line between them. 
 

BTW, I also posted this, 4 steps evolution of inspection lids. 

Kats

Edited October 31 by kats

[Gav240z]

2 hours ago, kats said:

Hi Gavin,

I posted this some time ago,  a Z432 has plastic tabs for its lids. This car has April 1970 seat belt tag. On the other hand, the green BAT 310000 USD 240Z has metal crips was manufactured date 05/70. So we can say there is a border line between them. 

Kats

 

 

Thanks Kats, I don't want to drag this thread too far off topic to be fair to the original poster building this car.

However with reference to the rear glass and earlier comment, I suspect it was installed later. The car had a mini refresh in the late 90s, very early 2000s. And it's possible someone replaced the rear glass thinking it should have the vertical defrost glass.

The original steel Topy's were also missing and it's now got a later set (with later date stamps) fitted to it. Which would have been another good reference point.

The centre console has the blanking plate over the defogger switch (same with the parker light switches) which is more inline with AU delivered S30Z's where 240z's didn't generally have the defrost glass and we only saw it with the introduction of 260z's 74+).

 

AU Market cars also had their seat belts replaced with an Australian brand (Kangol) - I've not seen date stamps on them.

As you can see they had a latch, didn't clip and were notorious for coming undone if they were not tightened. Not very safe and a strange decision for Australian standards when they were inferior to what I've seen in other markets. You can just make out the "Approved to Australian standard". You can see they were made in St Mary's South Australia. 

Looks like they went bust in the 1980s.

https://www.eoas.info/biogs/A001371b.htm

We also never got the door jamb ID plates like North American cars, which would have been helpful for determining manufacturing date. Instead 'some' cars got compliance plates - when they arrived in Australia, which was likely 1 or 2 months after the cars were actually built in Japan. These compliance plates didn't become a requirement until the mid 70s and so many early cars in particular simply don't have 1. My 72 model 240z, which was built Dec 71 (from the markings on my seat brackets) didn't have 1 as far as I'm aware. But HS30 00150 (which I also own) did, and I believe that car to be an ~July/Sept 70 build date car (compliance plate from memory says Oct 70).

Hence we have to use other car part date stamps to form an accurate picture of manufacture date.

HS30 00051 - still has it's original front guards, but I don't have access to the car and I can't recall looking at it's inspection lids to see if it had the plastic clips. When I do get to see it again (stored with a friend) I'll try and take note.

Edited October 31 by Gav240z

[dspillman]

Gavin,

I would think the hood bumpers may narrow down the date more so then the inspection clips, I remember January build vin 1222 had the tiny shot glass hood stops/bumpers and the plastic clips.  I realize the hood stops could be swapped out for the later stops, as my vin 841 was at some point.

 I maybe wrong concerning the hood "bumpers",  other markets may have differed in the use of these.

[dspillman]

Talk about Japanese land mines!!   Inside rear wheel wells…..Rookie z plug welder back in 1969…..

   I’ll have to remove this original feature for safety sake.   Thick dealer installed under coating hid these gotchas……

[dspillman]

Ready to get busy blocking…

[dspillman]

Really happy how gas inlet area turned out after blasting.   Just clean and reseal.

[dspillman]

While waiting for 51 to take shape , very close to applying primer, keeping eyes open for anything that is super early for this car, picked  up a pair of early      chrome Z quarter emblems, trying to eventually get everything “right” .   
  Interior wise , basically starting from scratch…..   eyes open for anything……

Edited November 3 by dspillman

[kats]

On 11/2/2024 at 7:18 AM, dspillman said:

Talk about Japanese land mines!!   Inside rear wheel wells…..Rookie z plug welder back in 1969…..

   I’ll have to remove this original feature for safety sake.   Thick dealer installed under coating hid these gotchas……

This picture reminds me that my Z432 has interesting spot welding. The welder might have been ‘on the job training’ I am sure! 
PS30-00087 (mine is 00088) has perfect welding for both strut towers, I checked it before. Moreover, my Z432’s left strut tower has perfect welding.

Quality control must have been a top issue always, workers at Nissan Shatai became getting better and better then finally reached 6000 S30 cars per month of production in late 1971. Enigines too, according to Nissan 40th Anniversary book (published by Nissan) it says after 1972 assembly line for engine head was  fully automated to achieve more accuracy and efficiency. L-series was mass production model of course.

Kats