How to start an argument...

[halz]

The July '03 edition of Australian "Wheels" magazine has an article on the next GT-R. It will not be powered by a turbo charged six cylinder, rather it will have a V8. One of the reasons for this is, and I quote:

"...Another factor in opting for a larger displacement instead of increased atmospheric pressure was potential concern about durability arising because of maintenance-ignorant American buysers."

Any comments guys..?

[Gav240z]

That's a laugh in a half. Our American Z buddies are clever boys so don't take it personally there guys but I think it's gotta be half true at least.

[1 Bravo 6]

OOOoohhh BOY, Oh BOY, Oh BOY,

I sure hope Carl reads this one.

His answer is bound to be a good one. (Of course, we from the Land Down Under COMPLETELY disagree with that statement, don't we fellas?).

I'm gonna PM Carl to make SURE he sees this one.

Rick.

[hmsports]

Isn't that because all of us Americans are so rich we don't change the oil, just buy a new car :classic:

[Alfadog]

I dont care about the reasoning, a V8 in a Skyline... pfffft

It just isn't right.

@ tha yankee comment, I wonder how the Wheels' email inbox will be looking tomorrow morning!!!

[carguyinok]

Wow, Harsh words there.

I feel that there is some truth in there :sleepy: That makes me sad to say. But they did hit it on the head IMO. I have seen alot of real nice cars that had a very early death from lack of maintenance. I know more darn people that will drive a car or truck clean into the ground rather then pull in and get that check engine light taken care of. Half the ones that do take care of that light dont get it fixed. They just pull the bulb and forget about it.

It would seem the other half just keep on driving till there saying "Do you hear that ?" Then act like they didnt know something was going out . :stupid: :stupid: :stupid:

At the same time the car companys are just as much the blame. It was one thing when you could buy a car (like a 240Z) run it till the valves needed checking and do it yourself or pay the dealership for an hour of work . Now think about the bill for checking the valves at the dealer today on a GT-R LOL

If they wanted to insure proper maintenance they just need to add a maintenance program in the price of the car. Its not a far out view IMO.

[EScanlon]

Sadly, the cost of maintenance on a vehicle here in the U.S. of A. is not only exorbitant, but there are so many times that you get news such as:

The flim flam pusher release valve was octupating the misenheimer relay which led to a carburating saturation of the thelapidator. It will only be $500 to get it as good as new, or for $150 we can tweek the phlegmoginator and it will get you by for another 2-3 thousand miles.

Guess what gets done....

Additionally the stories abound of people taking their car in for a simple procedure, (change the oil, filter, air filter, and basics) only to have to return the car a week later because the disproportionator went completely hooey. Then, when you get THAT taken care of, a week later and something ELSE goes wrong. At 3-400 per visit it gets real tiring real fast. So people start to wonder, did my car suddenly turn into a lemon or are the mechanics at the dealer f*cking with me?

Then let's not forget that there are an increasing amount of PARTS-REPLACER mechanics. These are the guys, who by virtue of the computerized training they received at the dealer, know that when computer error code 23 comes up you need to replace the engine piece by piece until the computer clears it.

The true blue MECHANIC, the guy who would listen to your engine, sit there and rub grease into his chin and then announce: Bad Plug in number 3, and then rid your car of all it's evils, is, sadly, going the way of the horse drawn carriage.

So if you find a good mechanic, PATRONIZE HIM.

2¢

[2ManyZs]

Good one Enrique.....

You forgot to mention the people who have absolutely no time or inclination to take care of a car becuase they only see it as a means of getting from Point A to B as many times as possible. Some people have the disposible income that they couldn't care less about what happens to their cars since they'll just trade it in and get another one and let the next poor shmuck try to fix everything that is wrong with a 2 year old car that shouldn't be wrong with it in the first place.

:stupid:

The only reason they bought said car in the first place is because that particular model made them "look good" or more successful than they really are. That is why leasing is such a big business here in the US, people who can't afford a certain car in an outright buy, just want to use one as a status symbol.

[TKR514]

Maybe I am a dumb American, but what the heck routine maintenance is needed on a turbo?

[260DET]

Originally posted by TKR514

Maybe I am a dumb American, but what the heck routine maintenance is needed on a turbo?

Good point. The Japanese are notorious for not changing engine oil, etc yet in both used ex Japan turbo engines I bought the turbo's were in good condition.

It is probably more a question of potential claims under warranty and perhaps some rationalisation as to the range of engines Nissan produce. Anyway, the cam drive belts do not last forever, turbo or not.

[Bambikiller240]

I just received Rick's invitation to read this thread, and wouldn't you know it...........Enrique (EScanlon) and Keith (2ManyZs) have just about summed up my opinions on the situation. Between :

1. the wankers who don't know or care how a vehicle should be maintained
   
2. the wankers who believe they are "mechanics" because they can read a computer screen or error code device telling them to replace "this" or "that" and if that doesn't fix the problem, "replace something else" until the code goes away, or the wallet runs dry.
   
3. the wankers who think they were put on earth with a license to "mine" the public for profits based on un-needed / unwarranted repairs
   [/list=a]
   the real honest to gosh "Master Mechanic" has largely disappeared because he cannot compete and make a living by using his skills to diagnose and problem and fix it, charging only for the small individual part (and the labor to replace it) that was the cause of the problem. To meet the business overhead (pay taxes, employee wages, benefits, equipment costs, rent, etc.) most automotive repair businesses must spend a minimum amount of time to diagnose and repair (while still charging "the specified labor charge in the flat rate manual ), and they must sell a significant amount of parts (at a high profit margin). Other automotive repair businesses use the additonal tactic of diagnosing and repairing problems that do not exist, or creating problems that require a more costly repair that what the car arrived at the shop needing. These folks depend on a segment of the public needing their cars fixed, and fixed now; since they need it to get to work everyday. They have no time to argue or shop around for a different diagnosis. Add the ignorance of another segment of the general public regarding the ever more complicated systems in modern cars to the equation too. They have to trust someone since they have no knowledge of the car themselves, so they are easy prey to the "wolves".
   Sure there are many "American buyers" who are maintainence ignorant, but many more are tired of being treated like they are a natural resource to be "processed like cattle to create profit" for less than honest auto repair businesses. Between these two groups of consumers, a significant percentage of the population cringes at the thought of taking their car to a shop for anything, and will put it off until it cannot be put off any longer.
   We, the folks who expend time and effort to understand and maintain our own cars are (increasingly) a rarity in modern US society.

[1 Bravo 6]

:finger:

Thanks Carl, Enrique and Keith.

I reckon you blokes have hit the nail on the head there.

I have a 2002 model Ford Falcon Fairmont. Once a week I pop the bonnet, check the oil and water, top up the windscreen washer tank and close 'er up again. I'm not bloody GAME to do more than that. The automatic transmission fluid can not be checked. There's no bloody dipstick.

Rick.