Original Rebuild from Nissan

[Zrush]

I don't have that exact certificate they show. I have the Vintage Z program certificate, which lists the same info shown on his certificate, plus more. It is a certificate of authenticity. I was not avoiding your question, I simply misunderstood what you were asking.

I have no reason to BS anyone about the car. I've verified with Nissan, the shop that restored the car and the "Z Store" dealership who sold the car to us. My Collector Car insurance company required proof that the car was not just some old Z that I wanted coverage on. They too verify all specialty autos prior to coverage since so many people believe they have a collector car.

[MikeW]

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that your car was not authentic. Just the opposite; since I knew yours was I thought perhaps the certificate on EBay was a fake if you didn't have one also.

[Zrush]

No problem and no offense taken brother. :classic: Hopefully Santa will bring me a digital camera and I can take some pictures of the 240 and put them in my gallery along with the '77 280 that's in there.

[ZmeFly]

That car has been driven to much to rate a price of 33900, now if it were like Zrushs car then I would say it could fetch a price that high.

This owner of the car on ebay is just dreaming a dream that unfortunately for him wont come true.

[Bambikiller240]

Originally posted by ZmeFly

That car has been driven to much to rate a price of 33900, now if it were like Zrushs car then I would say it could fetch a price that high.

This owner of the car on ebay is just dreaming a dream that unfortunately for him wont come true.

I agree James. Except that I say "fortunately" the dream won't come true. (I hope!) I hate it when a dealer trys to take advantage of someone, even if the buyer should have done more research and used more brain power before committing to the deal. IMO that dealer KNOWS that the car isn't worth that much.

[HS30-H]

May I ask a question here?

Why do these cars so often get described as "Nissan Factory Restored Z cars"?

I know the whole story surrounding them, and I'm certainly not trying to demean them in any way ( I thought it was a very clever bit of PR ) but I DO think the word "Factory" can create a little confusion...........

I was speaking to an automotive journalist here in the UK the other day. We were discussing a UK magazine article that tested a UK-restored 240Z ( owned by Nissan UK ) and made some comparisons with the "350Z" - which has just been released here. This guy was CONVINCED that the Nissan USA restored 240Z's had been sent back to Japan and restored at the "Factory". I asked him WHY he thought this was the case ( after filling him in on the real story ) and he said that as they were being described as "Factory Restored" then they MUST have been sent back to Japan................

So - you can see that the casual use of a single word can make somebody get the wrong end of the stick completely. Maybe those of us who are into these cars will naturally know the most of the facts - but somebody who is only marginally interested in the cars can get quite the wrong idea.

So why do they get described as "Nissan Factory Restored" when all of these cars last saw the Nissan Factory over 30 years ago?

Alan T.

[Gav240z]

As i understand it they were contracted Pierre Z and another Z workshop to restore these cars by Nissan USA. I have to agree it's a loose term and perhaps to be politically correct they arn't "truely" factory restorations depending on what angle you look at it.

But I think the whole concept of a Nissan USA effort to restore these cars to most people indicates that they are a factory restoration.

It would have cost Nissan even more to ship these things to and from Japan to sell them at a fair price would have been even harder and as it turned out they still sold at a loss to Nissan.

It's a bit like my current job description, I work for a company AT&T who have been contracted by another company Optus. Therefore when I answer a phone call I refer to the customer as if I am an optus employee. Even if I don't directly work for optus.

Bit of a poor example but I hope you can see my point. As do I see yours, in a true sense I would not consider it to be a "Factory" restoration but more of a Nissan USA program to authentically restore these cars to factory specification.

As Alan also said I am not trying to degrade these 50 or less odd cars I would love to be priveledged to own one myself.

:classic:

[26th-Z]

You make a very good point, Alan. The Nissan Factory Rebuild program is no more a factory involvement than the Brock Racing Enterprises or Bob Sharp Racing programs. Kas Kastner directed the Nissan IMSA GTP program. Here we deal with an American coloquialism with misleading connotation. I didn't realize how the Nissan Factory Rebuild program operated before I talked with Les Canaday. I am left to wonder at this point if any of the Factory Rebuilds reached outside America, or if this was an exclusive event.

None the less, Nissan did commision the reconstruction of 42 cars Nissan purchased, and sold back to the public through Nissan outlets. My racing heritage would refer to this as "Full Factory Backed". (This is term is also used for bimbos living with a sugar daddy). I understand that no other automotive manufacturer has ever completed such a program, making this program a very unique moment in automotive history, adding to the value and flavor of the 240Z.

I talked with Les Canaday at length about how the cars were actually restored. At the time, I was very interested in the restoration plan and technique, as I was formulating my own strategy. I have a copy of the restoration checklist published by Nissan - would love an original BTW - and note with interest how complete the rebuilds were. I found several nice references, including the specification for wiring harness wrapping, but I am also aware that many components, such as interior vinyl, were commissioned to replicate the original when original stock was depleted. I also want to note that the checklist includes many pages from Wick Humble's book with many references to that publication. I am aware that the reconstructions were not as strick to authenticity of original build and series as we discuss on this site often. I do see "authentic rebuild" interpretations from several of the big Datsun restoration shops around this country which forces me to object to the statement: "Restored by any old body shop". I do see quite a few restorations equal in quality to the Factory Nissan program. I hope mine will be one of them.

Just checking ebay now, the seller has reduced the asking price to $25,000. Probably within reason. I agree with the idea that one of these cars is for show purposes. They do command a high value, however, with 51,000 miles, the car we are discussing is to me a used car with old papers - suitable for restoration - again!

[HS30-H]

Originally posted by 26th-Z

I understand that no other automotive manufacturer has ever completed such a program, making this program a very unique moment in automotive history, adding to the value and flavor of the 240Z.

Hi 26th-Z,

I think that you will find both Aston Martin and Morgan have been selling officially "Factory refurbished" cars for some years now. These cars really DO go back to the factory that they were originally made in.

However, they keep it all a bit hush hush and don't make a big PR event out of it - which would explain why not that many people know about it.

Having been to the original Aston Martin & Tickford factory in Newport Pagnell and the Morgan factory in Malvern, I can tell you that the very nature of these cars enables the factories to re-make and refurbish them with much greater ease than they would had they been trying the same thing with a late-Sixties / early-Seventies mass-produced 'budget' automobile such as the S30-series Z.

In many ways its harder to restore a Z than a virtually hand-made car like the Astons and Morgans.

Alan T.

[26th-Z]

I didn't know that, Alan. So much for Nissan history, eh?

I really can't say enough about the Nissan program, factory in Japan or not. The cars I have seen were very well restored to a very high standard. Some techniques I don't agree with, but the result is equal, I believe.

To address the question of milage, I think the odometers were all set to zero as the instrument was probably replaced during the rebuild. Why would anyone drive one? Because $25,000 is pretty cheap for a brand new sports car in today's economy, and the Z is fun to drive.

[jeffs73z]

Wasn't it actually called the Nissan factory sponsored restoration program?

This would separate the thought of an actual factory rebuild.