ArnieTX

Andrew - I'm 60 miles west of San Antonio but I'm in Spring once a month. PM me your contact info when you get a chance and I'll give you a shout next time I'm heading that way. I'd love to drink a cold one and talk Z with you. AJM - Thanks for the information. I'll block the vehicle good before I pull the motor. The tranny is disconnected and I just need the motor stand bolts. Once I get the motor out I'm going to remove everything from the exterior, interior, suspension, etc. You lost me on the support and alignment part. Do I need to weld some square tubing across the front of the motor from frame rail to frame rail right now while the motor is still in it? So that it's "aligned"? I listen to a local car radio show occasionally and a while back they had some folks who did soda blasting. http://www.acsb-tx.com/ Once I get all the parts off my Z is this the type of "blasting" I need to get? After this , then a primer coat right? I want get this Z into a position where I can see where all the rust areas need repaired and where it won't rust any further. Then I'll see what I can fix myself and what I need to get done someone with more skills. Thanks Arnie

UPDATE I'm now in a position to remove the motor. All I need to do is find 4 bolts, I believe 10mm X 1.5 pitch X 80MM length... for the engine stand I borrowed from a buddy. Car #1 didn't have the attachments for the engine hoist to connect to so I snagged them from car #2. The front right passenger side piece is mounted but the drivers side back piece by the carbs cannot be mounted because the stud it goes on is broken/missing. I pulled a bolt off the intake and mounted it there. Is this a bad idea? Is there an alternate spot to mount it? I don't want to bend that rail, I think I have enough clearence. Please advise. Thanks

The motor broke free today. I've been rocking it back and forth for a week or so. Spins nicely by hand now. I ordered a couple of Z books, one on restorarion and one one motor rebuilding and have been reading them. Going to organize my work area and start taking one apart this weekend. Arnie

Thanks Kenny. I went and picked up an air ratchet, an impact, some items to organize my wrenches and sockets, and a few screwdrivers. I've never been much or had a reason to be much of a tool person so I'm sure this little endeavor will change that. That little 3/8" air ratchet is money! I've been squirting a little ATF into each cylinder daily for the last few days. I decided to take off the valve cover and see if everything in there was fine. Looks normal except for one area on the cam where it had a little discoloration/light rust. I started working the ratchet back and forth and it currently swings from 12 oclock to about 2:30ish each direction before I feel it binding up. BTW - It get's easier if you remove the belts first... . After I went back and forth a few times I squirted some more ATF in the cylinders and put the cover back on and plugs in. PICS of tonights progress: It will take a while to plan the disassembly and read up so while that's going on I'll see if I can't get her running. That would be a small victory. Thanks for everyones help. I am enjoying this. Arnie

The seats were from car #2 and appear to be new or recovered. I found tape underneath with writing, "passenger", "driver". I just wiped them off with some armour all type protectant. They are soft, not dried out. #2 is missing it's fuel tank. #1 has one fiberglass (appears to be) head lamp fender thingy....can't remember the name. My gut says run with #1. It also has the lowest SN#. For some reason I like it better. Thanks

Awesome! Thank you. I jacked both vehciles up and poked around a little looking at the condition of the underbody. Car #1 looks better overall. Car #2 has a rectangular patch behind the front left and right tires where the brake lines attach. Car #1 does not have this...... Question - Is this stock or is this a "fix" from something in the cars past history? Car #2 under the front fender on the sidewall above the frame rail: Now notice Car #1 doesn't have it:

ajmcforester I have both of those manuals and I like how you explained the organization part of it. I'm looking at the exploded dash view now and all the parts are numbered so as I take them out, I can label and put them in the appropriate little baggy, etc. Thank you for that tidbit. That definitely took a little of my process worries away. I want a 240z that is close to stock but has some simple upgrades that take advantage of later technology like toyota brakes, better ignition system, etc. I want it to be dependable and easy to work on, and I want it to be quick. It doesn't need to top out at 140 but I want it to get after it in the first 3 gears. I loved the kick in the pants up to ~ 90MPH my 77' and 78' models used to give me. I bought some jacks stands, floor jack, and a creeper this evening. I'm going to get an 1/2 impact tomorrow when I go to town. Besides the basic hand tools that I already have, is there anything else I can get that would make my life easier when I start taking one of these cars apart? Having the right tool for the job is key, just not sure what that tool is.... I'm borrowing an engine stand and hoist from a friend. Once I get the cars jacked up tonight and get a better look underneath, I'll decide which one to cover and which one to chew on. After that I'm going to write out my plan on paper. As suggested, I'll develop groups and plans for each. Thanks for the help. Arnie

That's pretty.

Can you define "body"? Are you talking about only the outside of the car which gets paint or are you talking about the outside, interior, and underneath areas? My untrained eye thinks the outside is in decent shape, but I'm not experienced in picking out areas that have had work done. My main concerns lie with the areas I cannot see. I think I should pick one of these and remove everything on it and in it until it's just a shell. Then take it to bare metal and see what it needs. I'm a little confused. I think it would be a good experience to remove everything off of the car to see what the body looks like. My biggest fear is figuring out how to put it back together. I would have a template for that though in the other car. So, should I run with car #2 and take everything off? Thanks everyone for answering my NOOB questions. Arnie

It's almost a tossup. Both need new floors. #2 has rear damage to the thin metal under the bumper.#2 has some surface rust under the battery area where #1 has a pretty big hole. I always thought #2 was worse because of the rusty floorboard holes were bigger. But having to replace both anyway makes it a non issue. #2 has a dent free roof and a better hatch area. Flip a coin at this point. Arnie

Car #2 Arnie

Good advice from everyone! So many good points and guidence. I've been going back and forth on this. The more I poke around in these cars the more I find. I just need to commit to car #1 and do like AJM suggested and take it apart down to the metal to see what I have. From the naked eye it's definitely better than car #2. From what I have seen being restored on youtube and other sites, car #1 isn't that bad off. And I don't think waiting around for a better vehicle is the right thing to do. I need to take what I have and run with it. What's the worst thing that can happen if it is beyond repair? I only have $300 bucks in these cars. I'm going out to my barn to stare at my girls and drink a beer. I'm in the mood. Thanks Arnie

After reading and re-reading this post a lot I think NCOLZ has a great idea. Since I want to have something I can mess around with and drive on the weekends, kinda get some instant gratification while using the rusty car as my learning test bed, maybe I'll tackle the rusty one first. At this stage I'm more interested in learning how to do things properly and by getting the rustier one running and patched up first, I can have a little fun and gain experience. I can also chip away at taking the better one apart until it's just the body. The rusty one definitely has some "donor" pieces that can be cut out and thrown on car #1. Thank you everyone for advice and ideas. Still thinking about the process.... Arnie

TZ I posted an ad on craigslist that said I was looking for a project z from 70-78 for me and my boys to work on together. A guy sent me an email about these two. Apparently the landowner was selling their place (ten acres) and a lot of their stuff to a auction type house and the guy that runs it sent me an email saying he saw two of them parked on the property. He gave me the contact info and they said $300 bucks and two days to get them off the property before they sold. I found out the rustier one has a 5 speed in it last night. The one I want to clean up has a four. Still need to verify what motors are in both. The rustier one is not as "Stock" looking in the engine compartment as car #1. I live west of San Antonio off HWY 90 between D'Hanis and Sabinal. I appreciate the support. Arnie

Thank you. I guess anything I hose up can be fixed with enough money. Keep it coming. Arnie

Very nice!

I cleaned out the second car today. It has a lot more rust than the first one but it's mostly on the floor pans. Some of the rails underneath have some spots. The rear area below the hatch looks like it's been hit or someone tried to tow it by the back bumper. I've decided to make one good car out of the two. The body, except for the roof, is in better shape on car #1. The roof has a few dents in it but probably easily fixed. Generaly, what car #1 lacks, car number #2 has to replace. My plan for the next week is to research how to clean up and somehow seal the rusty spots until I get the car up and running and enjoy it a little. I'm going to follow Carl's write up on another thread regarding an engine that hasn't been started in a while. I also need to buy some rust removal tools and get organized. I have an air compressor and need to investigate what kind of air tools would come in handy when working on a Z. I have a Lincoln Mig welder I use to build ladder stands and tripods for deer hunting, but I've never welded on anything as thin as the floors in this car. I have no formal training in welding but learned how to adjust the settings based on how big a hole I was burning in my victim. . Maybe I can clean the floors up and tack a temporary patch in place. Hitting the search function. Advice appreciated. Thanks Arnie

Some of you guys can tell a lot from these pictures, how original it is, etc. I'd appreciate any insight you guys have. What do you suggest I do from here? Can I get away with trying to get it running and maybe patch up the rusty areas for a while? Can anybody suggest a plan of attack? Should I run away as fast as I can >>>> The second Z has a really nice interior I can hijack ,,, Thanks for all your help. Arnie

Battery area worst:

I just got done cleaning out the one I thought was in the best physical condition. It was full of field mice crap and all sorts of misc junk. I guess my initial impression was wrong. There were only 3 or four spots that had rust and the most significant was under the battery. There were 2 soft areas on the floors that I tapped around and was able to punch througg with a wrench. I busted up the rust until I hit solid metal. The area from front to back below the door area on the side of the vehicle (rocker panel???) was perfect on the passenger side and had a few little pin holes starting on the drivers side. The bottom of the floor boards look good except for the two small rust spots I reamed out. The frame rails running from the firewall and the firewall itself look rust free. I need to look better in the daylight tomorrow but I scoured this car with my light and everything up front looks straight and rust free. Most Z's I've seen have rusty rockers and frame rails where the floors meet them. The back hatch lid was rus free underneath and the hatch portion attached to the frame of the car had 1 little hole. The spare tire area had an inch of water in it so I sucked it out with my shop vac. That area is solid with just a little surface rust and dirt. The dash area has two big cracks in it. That's normal in this part of the world. I squated around the drivers and passenger areas and the floors feel pretty solid. No flex. I've owned worse and ridden in worse before. My Denver Z was a pretty rusty ride but at age 20 I didn't know any better back then. Overall I think I have a great base to work with. I think the car is in good enough condition to try to get running and drive safely. There is a lot of dry rot on everything rubber and plastic, but that's to be expected for a car that's 39 years old. BTW - I'm a month older than the car... Here are some pictures in no particular order. Some spots still have a little moisture from the rains we have had in the last 2 months:

I'm heading out to to start cleaning the one with the least amount of rust out. Will post pics later tonight. I know a couple of guys who restore old military jeeps. They are always working on the bodies. I'm sure I can get some help from them. Another retired fellow in town ( I live in a small town of 500) restores old cars for a living. I don't mind paying to get stuff done. I'll post pics tonight of all the trashy areas I can find. Pics worth a 1000 words. You guys can tell me how bad or not so bad it looks. Appreciate everyone's input. Thanks Arnie

I got them home and in my barn. I'll clean them out over the weekend. The one that I thought was in the best shape has a few more rust spots than I first observed. I have to be realistic about my capabilities. I've never done any real body work nor have I ever taken a car all the way down to the shell. I'm thinking I might just clean these up, figure out what's good and what's not, take tons of pics and see if anyone out there can use these as parts cars. Somebody with more skills than me can certainly make a good one out of both. Or maybe it's better to part them out a piece at a time? What do you guys think? I would rather see someone take a whole vehicle to restore than piece one out. I think I'm better off to continue to save my money and find a z that's in better condition and can be driven and enjoyed. Down the road I can tear into it if I get a woody for a restore. By then I would probably have a better idea on what I would want out of a z. What do you guys think? Am I being a wuss? Thanks Arnie

Carl Is the emblem on the rear qtr panel throwing a wrench in your thinking? That's the only difference I spot. What is the delta between the S1 and S2 qtr panels? Thanks Arnie

Both motors are still in each car. I'm looking at the first pictures of the jacked up one and wondering if that big piece of pipe on the ground under the vehicle is supporting anything. I'll take pics tomorrow as I load them up. Thanks Arnie