HS30-H

I can't see anything unusual. I think it's a 432 because I think I see the mag wheel centre caps sticking out. Come on, what have you spotted Kats?

Arnie, A 'GS31' prefix indicates a '2/2' variant Fairlady Z, Fairlady Z-L or Fairlady Z-T model made after the big update to Japanese safety and emissions standards in 1976. The 'S31' prefix indicated the compliance to the new standards, but it was still technically part of the S30 series. Body serial number 010623 on a GS31 prefix would imply 1977 build year, and likely June to August build months ( you can cross-reference parts on the car for a more accurate build date ). Engine would have been an L20 six with Nissan EGI injection, and NAPS ( Nissan Anto Pollution System ). Transmissions on these would have been either 4-speed manual, 5-speed manual or Auto, depending on model and/or chosen options. Lots of interesting little doo-dads on these cars: Higher-specced models had electric windows, remote-adjust mirrors and 'eyeball' interior lamps etc. If you plan the part out the car, you might get some interest from the HybridZ crowd as a parts donor for LHD to RHD conversion? Oh, and I think the handbrake / emergency brake needs adjustment...! Here are some S31 sales catalogue scans that you might find of interest: Cheers, Alan T.

Aaaargh! It's all true....! Seriously though, there's more wrong than there is right in that article. I was completely astounded at the story of the loading ramps for the transport ships. It only takes a moment of thought to understand that a 'normal' freighter ship couldn't be converted to a makeshift 'Ro-Ro' car transporter just by adding a ramp to it. The whole structure of the ship needs to be dedicated to driving cars on and off, and that's why purpose-built car transporter ships were added to the fleet when increasing Export volume made it a necessity. Somewhere deep inside each of these stories is a tiny seed of truth that has been exaggerated, misunderstood and repeated many times with extra embellishments over the years. They have grown up with very little resemblance to the simple, and sometimes rather bland, truths that they were based on, and some of the characters involved in the stories have started to believe them themselves. We - the gardeners - really ought to be pruning back some of these stories, and doing a little weeding. Alan T.

Chris, The first ad ( 20th October ) was a Z432, the second ad ( 2nd November ) was a Z-L and the third ad ( 20th December ) is hard to see from the angle, but I suspect is a Z432 again. These cars - and the cool westerner with the pipe! - were used on the ( colour ) ad campaigns used in magazines too. They would, I think, have been very low serial number cars. No idea of numbers though....! Alan T.

Mike, Just to clarify - This was a series of ads, with different release dates. The first was used from 20th October 1969, the second from 2nd November 1969 and the third from 20th December 1969. The dates can actually be read from the tops of the newspaper pages too ( the '44' means Showa 44, ie 1969 ). Any scans of the original newspaper pages will naturally be quite poor quality, which is just the nature of newsprint I'm afraid. Here's the third ad in the sequence:

Thanks Ron, BRE should have you on their payroll..... Cheers, Alan T.

You're going to need more than just a pinch of salt on your popcorn..... Without wishing to upset anyone, some of the statements from that article are ludicrously far-fetched, and it is peppered with mistakes and exaggerations. Doesn't anyone ever edit or critique this stuff before it goes online? The line about the "handshake deal" over sales of the Toyota 2000GT and Datsun 240Z might very well take the biscuit. Those models were hardly even on sale at the same time, let alone seriously competing with eachother in the USA market. Next instalment: 'How Mr K. invented the wheel'... ? * *Don't laugh, it's quite possible...

Chris, Maybe try clicking on the links from the original page: http://www.yomiuri.co.jp/atcars/history/20100629-OYT8T00554.htm Does that work for you? These were full-page ads, as part of the 'Your Dream Comes True' campaign for the Fairlady Zs, taken out in several Japanese Japanese newspapers ( not just the Yomiuri Shimbun ). The first was published on October 20th 1969 - just two days before the Tokyo Motor Show opened to the public. There were actually three different full-page newspaper ads, but the Yomiuri Shimbun history page only shows two of them for some reason? Great stuff, Inf. Thanks for posting! Alan T.

That's a funny looking Camaro...... Thanks Ron, Sorry to trouble you with this at a busy time. Cheers, Alan T.

The perhaps not-so "big problem" was what was originally written on the BRE website. See a quote in post #2 of this thread. See also posts #20 & 21. BRE changed the text on the rear spoiler blurb. However, they might need to change it again. According to Carl, it might be more accurate if they change the text to "..this rear spoiler was originally designed for the Chevrolet Camaro...." :classic: Ron, I think you're right. Although that ribbed rear spoiler was originally designated for the PS30-SB 'Fairlady Z432-R' ( note the 'R' ), and was initially developed and homologated by Nissan's competitions department at Oppama. It was then adopted as an option for other Z variants before launch. I think the BRE site is still somewhat confusing, and also wrong about the height issue. If you order a rear spoiler from their website today, do you receive the 'ribbed' ( 432-R ) type, or the later, taller, non-ribbed type - as per the old Interpart catalog? They appear to illustrate the 'ribbed' version...... Alan T.

Wrong, Carl. Nissan did have their own full-size wind tunnel at their Chuo Kenkyujo facility. They also contributed to the building and running costs of the university wind tunnel you mention, as this kind of philanthropy would help to produce graduates who were skilled in the use of such facilities before joining the Nissan workforce. It's all written up in Nissan's 1964-1973 ten-year report book, including the financial reports. Alan T.

Now Carl, you know what I'm talking about here. I'm not talking about the theory and concept of rear spoilers in general ( of course not ), I'm talking about the size, shape and fitment of that particular rear spoiler, and I'm quite sure you know that. I look forward to seeing you apply the same kind of warped semantics to the rest of the car. When you meet up with Yoshihiko Matsuo next week, you'll be telling him that his title of 'Chief Designer' on the 'Maru Z' project was false, as nothing on the car had been 'designed' first by Nissan. Here's some advice: Don't. It's going to sound a little silly..... I see we are back "here in the U.S." again, and the rest of the automotive world is playing catch-up. After all, your President claims that the USA is "...the nation that invented the automobile..." So whilst we have your attention, perhaps you'd like to comment on the claims made in this thread that both Pete Brock and Carroll Shelby had design and/or engineering input on the S30-series Z before launch? If I popped up and claimed that Mike Costin and Colin Chapman had contributed to the design process, I'm sure I'd be inundated with requests to both prove and quantify it. Shelby ( ) and Brock perhaps sound a little bit more likely as candidates to you, I guess? After all, those 'Japs' just copy everything, don't they? Especially when they are designing an "American Car, Made In Japan"....... Or is it just a matter of semantics....? Alan T.

gnosez, I'm fairly sure that one was a purely American design. Certainly not a 'factory' / Sports Option part in Japan as far as I'm aware. By late 1972, the Nissan works race cars in Japan were using the big three-piece rear spoilers, like this:

You're right, Mike. They've changed it. In reaction to this thread, no doubt. They illustrate the ribbed rear spoiler ( as seen on - for example - the original #46 BRE race car ) but I believe I'm right in saying that the taller rear spoiler was later, and was not ribbed. It was sold with Interpart no.2701010 in the later ( early 1973 ) Interpart catalog. Does anyone ( Ron Carter? ) know for sure that the ribbed rear spoiler seen on the #46 car was actually taller than the factory 432-R rear spoiler? They look the same to me, whilst the later ( smooth ) Interpart rear spoiler does look taller than the later - factory - unribbed rear spoiler. Open question: So which rear spoiler are they putting back into production? The ribbed one, or the ( taller? ) smooth one? Alan T.

moonpup, You're making this thread all about me. Have you got anything to add to the subject that's being discussed, or are you so fixated with my scent that you can't see anything else? Where's the "Laidback purist" that you portray yourself as, and where is your sense of humour ( oh sorry, 'humor' )? Sprinkle a few morsels of conjecture / opinion / evidence in amongst your contributions occasionally, for crying out loud. All I ever see you posting are ebay links and comments about what I'm saying or doing. Post something worth reading, worth some discussion. Where's the content? Got any evidence of Carroll Shelby / Pete Brock input on the design and engineering of Nissan's S30-series Z car? Anything.....? Alan T.

I'm not 'attacking' anyone, let alone you. The people who have something to sell are BRE, and they are the ones claiming that Pete Brock designed that rear spoiler. I don't believe that he did. It's all quite simple. This is a Forum, yes? Please can you tell me the titles of these books, as I would like to read them too? Authors? Publishers? Any clues at all? I feel like I've missed out. I've read - and heard - plenty of stories about the S30-series Z, but proof of Carroll Shelby's involvement is one I can't remember. As I said above, I'm not "on the attack". I think we can pride ourselves on this forum for trying to see through the fog and get down to the truth about these cars and matters historical, so stories which I personally believe to be apocryphal written on a website which is selling something ( BRE ) are certainly within our range and collective remit. If they are true, then they'll hold water. If they are not, then we are all the better for it ( I believe ). Your first reply to me quite obviously misunderstood my initial points ( I wasn't talking about the 'Spook', and this is nothing to do with 'Europe' ), so what I am supposed to say? If you're looking for an example of a personal attack post, take a peep at post #10 ( but mind you don't slip on the vomit ). Apologies if I come across to you in a way that you don't like, but I assure you that is not the intention. I'm just interested in the facts. Alan T.

Maybe because they have something to sell, and I don't. In this particular case ( the rear spoiler ), I believe the 'evidence' quite clearly contradicts BRE's claim. If we are to believe that Pete Brock designed the rear spoiler seen on the Fairlady Z432-R at launch ( I remind you, in November 1969 ) then there's a whole BIG story out there that has so far not been told. It would involve Brock working with Nissan's engineers in Japan many months before November 1969, and almost nobody knowing about it. Or perhaps you believe he sketched it out on a napkin and posted it to Nissan by Air Mail ( after all, Pinin Farina, Yutaka Katayama and Walt Disney 'designed' the whole car after lunch in 1967 - so why not? That Farina guy could even design cars whilst he was dead )? Call me a cynical old fella, but I think - if Brock had been designing for Nissan - then the BRE publicity machine might have made a little more mileage out of it all. Meanwhile, back in the real world, I don't believe Pete Brock actually even saw an S30-series Z car until October 1969 at the earliest. You believe Brock designed that rear spoiler, I take it? Or perhaps you haven't 'come to a view' about that yet. Maybe you'll put some thought into the subject now that you've pointed out my personality defect ( again ) Nice to see that I'm still not on your ignore list, too Alan T.

No disrespect to you, but it might take a little bit more in the way of proof to convince me. Nissan had their own stylists, designers and engineers at the time we are talking about. They even had their own wind tunnel. They were quite capable of designing that rear spoiler themselves, and I believe that they did. Which 'performance shops' in the USA had some input into the S30-series Z's concept, design and/or engineering before it was launched in November 1969? What did Carroll Shelby have to do with the car? Sorry, but I think much of what we are hearing is just the echoing of past lies ( read: advertising and PR ), still bouncing around long after they were first uttered. These days - forty years later - we should be a little less gullible. Talking of forty years later, I'd expect those "original" moulds to be a little er, fragile by now too...... Alan T.

I'm not talking about Europe, I'm talking about Japan. I'm not talking about the BRE 'Spook' ( that's a well-documented BRE creation ), I'm talking about the rear spoiler. Well, given the fact that an identical twin-ribbed rear spoiler was seen on the debut of the Nissan Fairlady Z432-R model shown at the Press Preview event at Nissan's head office in Ginza, Tokyo on October 18th 1969, and assuming that it would have needed to have been designed, tested, productionised and produced some weeks or even months before that, I'd say it was a fairly good bet that BRE had nothing to do with it. I believe that what's being called the first 'BRE rear spoiler' for the Z was actually the rear spoiler that was fitted to the 432-R as standard equipment, and was an optional accessory on the other models. Later on, I believe BRE made their own unique moulding which looked similar to the later ( non-ribbed ) factory rear spoiler. But the ribbed rear spoiler was a Nissan factory designed and produced item. Alan T.

Yeah, right.... With all the talent, history and kudos behind BRE, why do they feel it necessary to come out with such blatant nonsense? Does Pete Brock actually check the sales blurbs on his site, or is it just written by minions who don't know the truth? BRE don't actually need to lie about things like this.

One thing I think worth making clear is the timeline involved in this particular car's case: The 're-shell' which resulted in the car as it stands now took place in the middle of 1974! We are not talking about something that happened long after the career of a race car finished, and the greater part of the 'Big Sam' story is in the car's current bodyshell. Interestingly ( and perhaps somewhat unusually! ) no attempt to change or obscure the chassis number and 'identity' of the 'shell was made either in period or subsequently. And mercifully, there's been no miraculous 'resurrection' of the previous 'shells as yet, although there must have been some people in the past who were tempted..... Alan T.

Great video, Ron. Congrats! The car looks stunning on the move. Can I ask: Is there anything on the car that you think isn't representative of the original '46' BRE car? Anything that you couldn't accurately replicate, or were not allowed to replicate ( EG due to modern safety regulations, etc )? Anything you'd ideally like to change? Any missing parts you'd like to find? After seeing the video, I'm wondering about springing & damping too. Does your car have similar spring / damper / ARB rates to those on the original car? Cheers, Alan T.

Craig, I think your original post made a very good point, and deserved a reply. It's a subject that a few people over here are talking about now that the car has come up for sale. I think there's little doubt that the major part of 'Big Sam's' history is with the 'shell that it's in now. This is the 'shell that won the Modsports championship and everything that came after that. It also happens to have been an ex-Works rally car ( with it's own interesting history, including a connection to the 1973 Monte Carlo Rallye, the 1973 Scottish Rally, the 1973 Burmah Rally and some other notable events here in the UK ) which is an interesting side-story. Getting too fixated on the re-shell ( re-shells! ) is to miss point - this iteration of the car is arguably its most successful, and this iteration is 'Big Sam'. A few years ago, Bonhams sold a couple of cars that were described as genuine ex-Works rally 240Zs. In fact they had both been re-shelled, and the replacement 'shells were standard road cars - one a Fairlady Z-L, and one a UK market 240Z. As the original rally cars were both 1970-built lightweights ( proper PZR style bodies, with all the FRP and Plexiglass ) this was a case of like not being replaced with like, and it amounted to a conglomeration of some ex-Works parts being attached to a pair of standard road cars. The baby was thrown out with the bathwater, so to speak. That's clearly not the case with 'Big Sam'.... Bonhams have given 'Big Sam' an estimate of £40,00 to £60,000 GBP, which I think - if we were to compare it to other marques and models with a similar level of history - is decidedly conservative. Alan T.

It's an interesting question, and brings us to the concept of what is now known as 'Continuous History'.... The story of 'Big Sam' includes three bodyshells if we include the identity of the ex-Rob Grant race car ( what I have been calling 'Big Sam Version 1' for a while now ) and the fact that this itself was a re-shell. We can draw a continuous line from the very first Rob Grant race car - which was based on a 1970 RHD ex-Works rally car - through the second Rob Grant race car ( a re-shell following a major crash ) which also used a 1970 RHD ex-Works rally 'shell. This became the first 'Big Sam' ( not much more than a re-paint and some signwriting at first ), which was comprehensively crashed mid-season - requiring yet another bodyshell. The replacement bodyshell used was from a 1972 LHD ex-Works rally car, which itself needed not a little straightening and conversion from LHD to RHD. I call the result - the car that is being sold by Bonhams - 'Big Sam Version 2'. Anybody who fells a little confused at this point has my sympathy.... So, no less than three bodyshells ( all of them ex-Works rally car bodyshells, but the first two being arguably a little more special than the third ) converge into the 'Big Sam' story. Some of the components from the first and second are incorporated in the third. Anyone who buys 'Big Sam' as it is now is also buying that 'Continuous History', but would probably be well advised to concentrate on what the car is now rather than all the other stuff. The world of old racing cars is quite familiar with such questions of new chassis, new body, old identity and the cans of worms therein. It becomes a question of philosophy in the end. The car as it stands now is eligible for competition in more than one race series, and it would be great to see it rubbing shoulders with it's contemporaries again. It's a great package. Alan T.

Just a quick heads-up on a forthcoming event here in the UK: 'Big Sam' - the Datsun 240Z race car of some repute - has been entered into the Bonhams auction at the Silverstone Classic meeting ( http://www.silverstoneclassic.com/ ), to be held on Saturday 24th July 2010. Attached below are some scans of the auction catalogue. I'll let the catalogue description of the car speak for itself. It's a very interesting car, with a fairly complicated history. It will be interesting to see what price it sells for.... Cheers, Alan T.