FastWoman

Kacrow, I bought a set of the Standard Ignition injectors (probably the ones you're looking at), and they've worked fine for me. I have third-hand knowledge of some people (don't know who) having some issues with those injectors. Some people have their original OEM injectors reburbished and flow tested, but I've read of too many of those injectors leaking for me to think this is a good approach. The only thing about the eBay Standard Ignition injectors is that you'll have to cut off the shorter hoses and attach longer ones. This has to be done very carefully, so that you don't nick the aluminum barb underneath (which would cause a leak). Before you replace all your injectors, you might want to see how they're spraying. To do that, you'll need to undo all 12 injector screws and the retaining bolts on the fuel rail, and pull the whole assembly out, injectors and all. Then lay out a lot of newspaper over the top of your engine, and set the fuel rail down on it. Crank your engine, and see what sprays out. You should get one quick spritz from each injector (all at the same time), once per engine rotation. The spray pattern should be healthy (a nice mist), and each injector should spray the same amount of fuel. Then after you stop cranking, make certain none of the injectors dribble. Before you go any further, go to xenons30.com to download a free copy of Nissan's factory service manual for your car. With the FSM, you'll be 5 times smarter than you are now -- guaranteed! Oh, and please don't get turned off to this list. These is a great list with some really friendly and helpful folks. We do like punctuation and capitalization here, because otherwise it takes twice as long to read a post. However, we're pretty forgiving of rough starts. Hang around, and we'll warm up!

Captain, I didn't have any instructions, and it wasn't a great flaring tool. I just concentrated on CAREFULLY centering all the parts, checking that the mandrel didn't tilt during the compression. My first attempt was off center. The second was much closer. The third was spot on, and so was the real thing. I've got my fingers crossed that it doesn't leak. If it does, I'll fiddle with it, and my plan B can be to have a brake shop make the tube for me.

I figured with a MityVac I wouldn't be running the master cylinder past its usual travel points and wouldn't risk damaging the seals. (I don't know that I don't have rust in the thing.) That said, I've always bled my brakes manually, and I just checked the ETA on the MityVac -- TUESDAY! That's quite a long time. I might just do the rears manually. The MityVac should be here by the time I'm ready to bleed my fronts.

Everything that Zedyone said. Kacrow, there are a LOT of lurkers on this list. Most of the 35 who read your post are lurkers. Maybe a few were not lurkers but didn't have an answer. Maybe others who might have had an answer for you hadn't read your post yet, because we were doing other things. The backfire through the intake indicates at least some of your cylinders are lean, but you already know that from the plugs. Off hand, it sounds like you might have some clogged injectors and maybe other injectors that are stuck open and partially clogged. What did your old fuel filter look like? A new set of cheap injectors would be around $150 off of eBay. That might be worth considering. Also try cleaning the electrical connections to the injectors. Those are notorious for going sour at this age.

Thanks, Captain! That's exactly what I wanted and needed to know! It's strange that this topic isn't really discussed in any detail in the FSM. There's almost no info about the adjuster mechanism. Weird. Steve, I can see that the flaring is an art, and it's not particularly easy. I practiced a few times on extra pieces of tubing and then did the real thing when I felt I could get the flair centered and symmetrical, which is how it did seem to come out. However, I won't know much until I get my brake bleeding tool. (drumming fingers on desk, waiting for the truck to bring it) Oh, yes, I did one side at a time. I'm glad I did, because I did have to consult the other (intact) side for reference a couple of times.

Steve, about the two-factory/two-style thing, I'm not saying the two styles are raised and not raised. I'm saying the two styles are raised/flat and raised/sloped. This is what was told to me by someone else (can't remember who) in a similar thread I started long ago. Supposedly it was about two different factories of origin. One produced the sloped raised hatch floor, and one produced the flat raised hatch floor. I have no idea whether this is correct, but nobody said anything different at the time. Grant, if I were you, I'd take out the false floor (and bulky "space-saving" spare) before I'd modify to the flat style. There is SO MUCH wasted space from that hatch floor. I swear I could almost use my '75 as a tiny pickup truck back in the day. I mean I could get a WHOLE LOT of stuff into that hatch. What I have now, in my '78, is tiny by comparison.

Cleaned and greased, yes. And I've retracted the adjuster, by turning the wheel, so that the brakes are retracted enough to accommodate the new linings. However, as I say, the rachet spring catches in the resting position on one side and not the other. It appears to be designed/shaped to release in the rest position, so that it grabs and turns only when the emergency brake is actuated. Maybe whether it (barely) catches in the rest position doesn't really make any difference to the operation of the auto adjust mechanism. Dunno. Any thoughts?

Left rear is now done. The flare nuts came apart just fine, even on the cylinder connection, but the PO had apparently twisted and mangled the hard line that runs around the backside of the drum assembly. So I had to buy some more hardline and bend a new piece, double flaring the ends. I'd never done a double flare before. Cool! I still haven't gotten my MityVac in the mail. I had bought one off of eBay for this brake job. Sure would be nice to have it now. QUESTION: Is the ratchet on the adjusting wheel supposed to hold the adjusting wheel (catch it) when the emergency brake is relaxed, or is it just supposed to sit on the top of the wheel and catch the wheel whenever the emergency brake handle moves so far? The adjuster on one side holds, and the one on the other does not, and I don't know which is normal.

Phew! The right rear is done (not filled and bled, though). The nuts on the brake hose came loose quite easily, but the one on the cylinder didn't want to budge. The fancy Canuck vice grips were too large to get to the problem nut. I went and bought a 10mm flare nut wrench, not the greatest quality, and it slipped around the corners of the nut. Grrrrr... So I pulled out my smallest pair of vice grips and clamped around the flare nut wrench to keep it from spreading. That worked like a charm! (Thanks for the tip!) Putting the new shoes on was an adventure. I finally figured out how to do it. Mount up the leading shoe first, fastening it down. Then attach the springs between that and the trailing shoe, and fold the trailing shoe around to the rear. The anti-rattle spring wasn't so tough. I could put it in place with my bare fingers. That's definitely NOT the experience I had with my '75 Z long ago, which was why I made a special trip to the auto parts store to ask, "Help! What sort of special tool do I need to buy to get this friggin spring into place?!"

Some '77/'78 decks are sloped, and some are flat (but raised). There were apparently two different factories that produced these two different deck styles. Mine is flat too. I've never seen a sloped one in person.

NICE! Very clever! I think the problem has to be electrical, though. The load of an incandescent bulb plugged into the injector connector was sufficient to kill the signal. I didn't catch the 11V part. Yeah, that could be the problem too. I'd definitely charge the battery before drawing too many conclusions.

Well, the interesting thing is that you get a WEAK signal to the injectors. If I understand you correctly, you're getting voltage changes, but no appreciable current. I assume this is true of ALL your injectors. This is interesting because your injectors fire simultaneously, and each has its own ground circuit in the ECU. For all 6 circuits to fail simultaneously would seem odd. The failure point would have to be common to all circuits. Perhaps it's a foil trace or solder joint inside the ECU, feeding the power transistors. (I assume there's 6 of them?) Perhaps it's the +12V feed to the drop resistor assembly. But between those points, the circuits are divided up, and the simultaneous failure of all 6 injectors would be very unlikely. I wonder whether all your connections are solid. A weak connection might give you the correct voltages, but no current handling capability. Try this: Unplug your ECU. Identify the injector ground terminals in the ECU connector. Turn the ignition on, and one by one, manually ground each of the 6 injector wires at the ECU connector. You should hear them click, and if you have a pressure gauge on your fuel rail, you should see the fuel pressure drop. If you can't actuate your injectors this way, the ECU isn't the problem. Our models are wired a bit differently. Mine has a separate fusible link supplying the injectors. I believe your fusible link would be common to other circuits. Anyway, check the integrity of the fusible links, and clean them up. Also my ignition relay has a separate contact to feed power to the injectors. Yours might too. Your relay might have a dirty or burnt contact and might not pass current well. You might be able to disassemble it and clean it. Obviously the relay connector could be a problem point too. The next stop is the drop resistor assembly beneath the master cylinders. I'm less suspicious of these, because I would think you would lose your injectors in banks and not ALL of them. However, this is a place where you can get lots of corrosion. Clean up those connectors too. If all of the above works and connects, you should be able to fire your injectors manually. If the problem is on the ECU end, be certain you have a good ground! If that doesn't work, then open up the ECU and do some wire tracing. Trace the ground to the circuit board and then to the power transistors. I bed you'd find a bad connection somewhere in there. If it really is the ECU, don't worry too much. It's not a big deal to find one and swap it out. I bought a spare off of eBay for $20.

@Dave: Thanks! Well, then I think I'll give the black paint a try. I'm not an aggressive driver, so I doubt I would build up more heat than most drivers would, and the black should look nice beneath my silver panasports. I'm going to do my calipers in black too -- nice and neat. @Zed: Thanks! That sounds like a good technique. I'm not very flexible anymore, but I do have a helper available. :-)

Thanks, Jetaway! Yeah, I remember that spring being a bear. I did buy the special tool for it when I did the brakes on my '75 Z long ago. Even then it was a bit of a push, but I got the things on there without serious injury. I still have the tool -- know exactly where it is. Pete: I won't paint the drums, then. Thanks!

Well, I've finally gone with Russell Street Legal stainless braided hoses. These are an Edelbrock product, so I expect them to be of a good quality. Best of all, they're only about $89 for the set of 4, and they're DOT approved. I've also read a number of reviews of AutoZone's Duralast brake calipers, and they've been very favorable. I asked my local AZ folks about the lifetime warranties on these rebuilds, and they say that while the warranty only covers manufacturing defects, IN PRACTICE they will exchange out any caliper, even if it dies from corrosion due to moisture in the brake fluid. They do this for customer loyalty and goodwill. I also asked about the lifetime warranty on their brake pads. Both in theory and in practice, the pads are warranted not to wear. So when they wear down, no matter how much, I'm invited to bring them in and exchange them. The only caveat is that I can't wear them down to the metal, which would mean they couldn't refurb them. Then they won't exchange them. Sounds like a deal! Total price for stainless lines, calipers, and pads, was around $175. I'll have them tomorrow. BTW, I decided not to go with the Toyota caliper retrofit at this time, because that will throw my front and rear brakes out of proportion. It would be better, eventually, to upgrade all the brakes at the same time, perhaps when my drums wear out. Here's what I still don't know: Is it OK to paint the drums? Does it interfere with heat dissipation? I'd be using black, ceramic, Duplicolor 650F paint -- for cosmetic reasons, of course.

To me, there is nothing so cool as a 100% original concourse automobile, and being an engine geek, I LOVE to see antique cars with their original engines. (That's why I'm so reluctant to retrofit my 280 with a MegaSquirt EFI.) That said, there's a place for highly modified cars, and contrary to the assertions here, it's often the most highly modified cars that command the highest dollar. The 30's era chop jobs with Chevy 350's under where hoods used to be are an excellent cases in point. And then there are the daily drivers, such as my own car. Small mods, here and there, ensure that my car remains safe and reliable. It's not a car for purists, but I feel it's a very special car in a way that a show car will never be. It is visible on the road, not just in parking lots, and I think that makes it a proud and honest car -- the automotive counterpart of a blue-collar working stiff. It is also something I can enjoy every day of the week! It's hard to put a dollar value on that.

I heard from Silver Mine and got most of my questions answered. I was confusing the Stage 3 and Stage 4. No spacers needed on the Stage 3. They can make up custom lines for the OEM cylinders -- same price.

I took a peek under the boots of the cylinders. The left looked fine. The right cylinder had tons of crap under both boots. I assume that's where my slow leak is. The thing is, though, I didn't see any oily residue in that area. There was lots of the usual rusty/dusty junk, but none of it appeared oily. There was one thing, though: I think the rusty/dusty stuff was a bit harder to brush away on the right side. So maybe there's my missing brake fluid. Sound logical? Oh, and even though the lefthand cylinder appears fine, there's a lot more wear on the trailing shoe than on the leading one. The pistons seem to move freely, though. The cylinders seem to be a bit different in age. The PO liked to replace one part at a time. I hate that. Anyway, I've sprayed all the fittings with PBBlaster and will let them soak for a few days.

Thanks, guys! Well, my Saturn is fixed and back on the road. Yay! So now I've got the rear of my Z up on jack stands, and I'm tearing stuff apart to see where I stand and what I need. The drums look great. The wear is within specs. They're the aluminum type. I've cleaned them up. Should I put a coat of black caliper paint on them or no? It's Duplicolor's 650F (?) ceramic paint. Would I screw up the heat dissipation with this paint? The only purpose for the paint would be cosmetic. I still haven't found my hyrdaulic leak. The brake lines don't look bad, but they're probably a bit long in the tooth. I'm still thinking about that Toyota dual piston front caliper conversion. I don't want to have to space out my wheels to accommodate the larger calipers, as I think my wheels will rub the fenders. Does anyone know whether I'd need to use the spacers with 15x7 Panasport rims? It looks like there's plenty of space between the OEM calipers and the rims.

I hadn't seen your question until now, WW2. I think you can still get a GR starter rebuilt at any local auto parts store, but I don't know whether it's possible to get a new starter. Anyway, over these past couple of years, the unwinding groan has slowly diminished, although it's still there. HOWEVER, I have found out the answer to my question on our Chrysler powerboat. The bendix gear got stuck on the ring gear, and the starter made that same groan until the thing retracted. So I think my answer is that the bendix gear is a bit sluggish to retract -- but as I said, less so lately. I don't think it's an issue for ring gear wear. I never hear any grinding. I guess I'll try to clean/lube the thing up when I have some spare time.

Thanks, Zed. No, I didn't know you were referring specifically to the MSA. I was reading that stainless braiding, in general, is DOT-verbotten. I have to admit that there's a tiny twitch that tells me I should go with DOT-approved. I know this has much less to do with quality/suitability and much more to do with beaurocracy. However, if I were ever to run into someone, and if their ambulance chaser layer were to figure out that my brake lines weren't DOT-approved, then I would be caught having to defend how my non-approved brake lines didn't contribute in any way to an accident that couldn't reasonably be avoided. At least with the DOT-approval, someone has signed off on the suitability of the brake lines. Of course that also happens, in theory, with the yearly inspections, but everyone knows those inspections are (or at least can be) rather pointless.

Very cool! I remember my parents wanted me to learn all sorts of life skills, including how to work on my own car. It's served me well. I only wish I had been more successful passing on some mechanical aptitude to my own kids. They were rather embarrassed to be seen working on a dorky old car like a '66 Mustang. Go figure.

Ah, gee... er... Sometimes I have a hard time explaining how my brain works. Yes, noted... Thanks!

Has anyone used the MSA stainless brake lines? They're a lot cheaper: http://www.thezstore.com/page/TZS/PROD/PBC08/24-5121 I don't think they've got a protective clear vinyl outer sheath, and I see no mention of DOT approval. Does anyone know more about these? There's even less info on these, but they're DOT approved: http://www.jdmhub.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=281208&path=2_626_757_89767_90578

30ounce, I've been trying to contact Silver Mine Motors, without any success. Maybe you would know the answers to the questions I'm trying to ask them: (1) Are the steel braided lines actually STAINLESS steel, or just steel? (2) Will their standard braided lines fit OEM cylinders and calipers, or would those have to be custom fabricated? Also... (3) Is there any reason to think this might be a dodgy business, or is this guy pretty trustworthy? Thanks!