Carl Beck

Hi Chris (everyone): Just wanted to point out... as you mentioned earlier.. at least some of the Vintage Z's did not get their original matching number engines back. Note on the Register at least one of them got an L28. (now that's an upgrade!!). Also .. are those the VIN's with Automatic Transmissions that you have as well? Could be A/T equipped cars were less expensive to buy, when Nissan was buying them... or it could be that in general terms the 240Z's with A/T were driven and cared for more carefully. FWIW, Carl Carl Beck Clearwater,FL USA http://ZHome.com beck@becksystems.com

Hello Chris (everyone): Per an earlier discussion related to collecting the VIN's of the Vintage Z's. I've set up a Vintage Z Register on the Z Car Home Page... I have listed the VIN's I've collected so far, if anyone knows of others not listed there... please send as much information as you can. Or if you have additional information about the cars listed please send that as well. With "usual" Registers, it is the owners that register their cars. As we are just trying to get this started, and gather as many of the VIN's as possible, we will start by "reporting" Vintage Z's we have seen either in person or on the net. So far, I only know two of the owners... the rest are VIN's from cars listed on ebay with pictures of their dash plaques or other documentation. In each case I've listed the source of the information. If it's useful, at a later time - I may link the VINs to the ebay listings so people can see the descriptions that the owners/sellers provided. If anyone has kept a copy of the ebay page source.. to retain that information about a car you have recorded.. send it along with the other information and we'll add it to the database. The direct URL Is: http://Zhome.com/IZCC/ZRegisters/VintageZ.htm At least this way we can all see what we have collected to this point. FWIW, Carl Carl Beck Clearwater,FL USA http://ZHome.com beck@becksystems.com

Hi Chris: Today at 7:13AM you wrote: >.."Thanks for the "Mad Mike" letter. Would you please highlight the passages that >refer to a discussion about buying up old Zs, refurbishing them, and selling them back >to the public again? I just can't find it. >Sounds like he had a good time though. So let me get this straight. He "threatened >to make house calls" and that constitutes representation?" Truth is stranger than fiction... I'd say that when the opportunity came about...Mike went to Nissan HQ and represented the ZCCA in the discussions with Mr. Hanawa. Although not planed far in advance, although not as formally structured as Mr. K's quote would indicate... I'd say yes.. what Mad Mike did on that day constitutes representation (at least of the people that elected him Executive Director of the ZCCA). The Mad Mike involvement was first brought up - because you quoted Mr. K saying "a representative from the American clubs was sent to Tokyo to plead with Nissan to revive the Z"... At that point there was nothing said about the Vintage Z Program... other than highlighting the events that took place prior to 97, and which lead up to the Programs Birth... Mr. K's full statement ties the "representation" directly to the events that lead up to the Vintage Z Program - does it not? My point was - related to Mr. K's statement and your questions about that statement... 1. Mike wasn't actually "sent" there as his trip report reflects... 2. who he represented.. when the chance arose ie. ZCCA and its members and 3. Who he met with when he was there.. (the man who would the following year become President of Nissan Motors Ltd. Japan). Chris wrote again today: >"Yes I AM 25% sure Mike had something to do with it." I have to admit that I'm very confused by that statement at this time. What/which ""it" you are referring to? There is no question that Mike and his visit to Mr. K in Japan in 95... is the person and the event that Mr. K is talking about in that quote. Yes/No.. or as I ask before, is there someone else that says differently? If you are referring to "it" being the Vintage Z Project... I have no idea what all, if anything, Mad Mike had to do directly with the Vintage Z Project. Other than, like all of us at the time, indirectly just trying to support the concept and the program while it was evolving at Nissan... Chris wrote: >"And finally...Carl, if I am stepping on toes, just tell me and I'll sit down and shut up. >Is Pete going to write a book, or was that just more talk? It has been six years." Well as you can see from his farewell letter.. he seems to have been planning on writing a book then; and from the letter he wrote me the other day.. which I read to you.. he seems to be in the process of writing his book now. I told him that you were putting together an article about the Vintage Z's and ask him if he'd be willing to share some information with us, I have not received his reply yet. I don't see your efforts as stepping on anyone's toes. If anything articles related to the subject, should just stimulate interest and help future sales of his book... yes/no? Other than discussions like this one... where else do we see anything being published that would lead to more interest? >Otherwise, I am not into writing adversarial posts claiming my story is right >and your story is wrong. Does "my story" mean Chris and "your story" mean Carl? Or is that a general statement? I don't feel anything has been "adversarial".... we have been back and forth on a couple of points... like the Mad Mike thing... but I wonder at times if I have made my points clear enough; because when you reiterate them in your own words... it leaves me with the impression that there is still great confusion there... Your statement today, >"please highlight the passages that refer to a discussion about buying up >old Zs, refurbishing them, and selling them back to the public again? >I just can't find it. leaves me with the impression that there is still confusion between background information, which Mr. K tied to the Vintage Z Program, with his statement (which you quoted).. with the expectation that it is meant to be proof of the conception point of the Vintage Z Project.... Just wanted to make sure that you understood - and that everyone following along understood - no one ever said that the representative talking to Mr. Hanawa, suggested anything other than saving the Z for America and Nissan Motors. That started the ball rolling or at least accelerated it a bit after Atlanta. Buying up cars came a couple of years later...so I am surprised that you would be looking for it in Mikes report, or that you think I said it would be there... nonetheless, the Vintage Z might not have happened at all, if the groundwork hadn't been done years before hand. I think we both agree that the story leading up to the concept of the Vintage Z's is as important to understanding their significants, as the story of how they were repurchased, reconditioned and resold... FWIW Carl Carl Beck Clearwater,FL USA http://ZHome.com

halz wrote: >I've tried to keep up with the dialogue in this thread. It seems to me that >the "Factory Restored Zs" should more accurately be termed "Nissan Motor >Corporation USA - supported restoration program". Hi halz: That might be more accurate.. and I'd say that if that's what you want to call them that, I'm sure we'll all understand what cars you are talking about. You might shorten that to "Nissan Vintage Z Program Cars", or shorter still "Nissan Vintage Z's"... Wait a minute... no, on second thought, if we call them "Nissan Vintage Z's" or "Nissan Vintage Z Program Cars"... that might be misleading. Someone would think that Nissan Motors owns them. "Nissan Motor Corporation USA - supported restoration program" might be misleading too. In most places Nissan seems to have called them "reconditioned".... they weren't really restored (meaning to make as original again). >I'm not sure if Nissan actually does manufacture vehicles in a factory in the >USA. Now you can be sure. Nissan has several factories that produce cars and trucks here. They just built a multi Billion Dollar assembly facility for their full size trucks and SUV's here as well. As I recall the build the Altma's here, and some production was exported to Japan. >- they certainly didn't make the Z-series there That's for sure... of course "they" ("they" being your reference to Nissan Motors Ltd.) didn't make them in Japan either. Nissan Motors Ltd. Japan, didn't actually build the car in the first place. Nissan Motors Ltd. did the design, the engineering, the distribution, sales and marketing... but they did not produce the car. The Z's were produced by a subcontractor. Shin Nikkoku Kogyo Co., Ltd was started in 1949 to build rail road cars AIR. It formed an alliance with Nissan Motors Ltd. in 1951, it became a publicly traded corporation in 1961. The company name was changed to Nissan Shatai Koki Co., Ltd in 1962. It began production of the Z Car in Oct. 1969. The company name was changed again in 1971 to Nissan Shatai Co., Ltd. It is a publicly held corporation, not a wholly owned subsidiary of Nissan Motors Ltd. (as Nissan Motors USA is). FWIW, Carl

halz wrote: ...snipped.. >Despite the documented visits to Japan by US Z-car club members, >I see no evidence that Nissan in Japan supported the restoration program >in any way. Their contribution may have perhaps been a benevolent smile >at the efforts of their US distribution partners... Hi halz (everyone): "....a benevolent smile at the efforts of their US distribution partners" No offense meant halz, but I have to admit that is one of the funniest things I've read lately. It made me laugh out loud... from all my conversations with Nissan USA employees, the word "benevolent" would never have entered my mind, as it relates to the absolute control of Nissan Motors USA by the home offices. What little independence Nissan USA had, left the country along with Mr. K in 1977. For "evidence... I think we read somewhere that Nissan Motors Ltd. Japan approved the budget for the project originally and re-tooled for production of some of the parts needed. I believe that the list of "Restoration Parts" issued by Nissan was the result... some of them were however reproduced here in the US AIR. BTW - Nissan Motors Ltd. Japan hasn't had "a distribution partner" here in the US since they bought out their last distributors around 1965. kind regards, Carl Carl Beck Clearwater,FL USA http://ZHome.com

Esteban wrote: >there is a guy here in town that has about 20-30 70-73 Z's in his >back yard. he offered to get me a rust free shell for 600.00 so I >may just take him up on it. Hi Esteban: Send me that guy's name and contact info...!! I'd like to talk to him!! Anyone with 20-30 240Z's in his back yard is my kind of guy. Carl beck@becksystems.com

Chris Wrote: >Carl brought up that he had heard eighteen different body shops >were involved and I am not surprised. Hi Chris: Just to be more correct:)... I said I had a letter from the Nissan Manager of the Z Store Program, in which he stated that 18 body shops and 3 restoration business had completed 40 cars as of the date of the letter.... Text copied below FYI - and when you come up I'll gladly provide a copy of the original, along with the US Postal Date Stamp and Pete's finger prints. Note 1 that contrary to earlier reports... the fourth restoration shop did not pan out. Also note that Nissan clearly states that the parts and cars bought after the close of program... are not Nissan products... Note 2 -- also that Pete states the last remaining cars that were to be shipped to the Z Stores would be finished and shipped shortly... thus more than 40.. and the real total according to other Nissan sources was 42. Note 3 -- Pete is no longer with Nissan, and his phone and e-mail address are no longer vaild. (it was 1998 after all) Keep The Spirit Alive... Carl = = = Nissan Motor Corp., U.S.A. 30 October 1998 TO OUR Z-CLUB MEMBERS: As you well know, Nissan Motor Corporation USA created the Z-Store as part of a unique program to keep the spirit of the Z car alive after retiring the 300ZX. As of the 3 1'' of October, 1998, the official program will be discontinued. The restoration of Vintage Zs involved more than 18 different body shops and three restoration businesses, and the quality restoration process was backed by Nissan Motor Corporation U.S.A. Through the program, some 40 cars have been restored, with one donated for a charity auction organized by Rick Cole. Others have been sold to Z enthusiasts across the U.S., as well as buyers from around the world. I strongly believe the program satisfied a niche demand, and generated positive publicity for Nissan. Additionally, our efforts to bring new life to these wonderful cars has kept the "Z"spirit alive and just as importantly, helped bridge the "gap" between the discontinuation of the 300ZX and the development of a new generation sports car, now possibly a new Z. I hope the cars we were able to deliver to our participating Z-Stores helped generate floor traffic, customer interest and profits from the cars' sales. I also know that parts sales for Nissan, and obviously from the many Z-related aftermarket companies increased based on the recognition of owners of the value of 2402 ownership, as many people be,oan restoring or improving their personal vehicles. While Nissan p]ans no official announcement about the discontinuation of the Z-Store, our Public Relations Department has prepared the following statement: "With the rich heritage the Z car has generated over the years, Nissan wanted to maintain a high level of interest in the Z after the discontinuation of the 300ZX. The Z restoration program heiped us to do that, and it satisfied a special demand for these cars. We're now looking fonvard to what we are hoping will be a new Z. We showed a concept car this summer which was aimed at recapturing the spirit of the original Z, and we'll be unveiling a version of this concept at the January Detroit auto show which we hope will be a further definition of a true, pure sports car." Nissan will now focus its attention on the development of the Concept Z, which may very well open a new chapter ofthe company's continuing interest in performance cars. In the meantime, all of us at Nissan take pride in what we have accomplished with the Z-Store and in the cars we have restored. I think it is a!so safe to say that those people fortunate enough to have purchased one of our restored Z's have a very rare vehicle indeed. The warranties originally set for those cars remain in place, and owners will continue to be served by Nissan¥s Claims Cenrer. The remaining cars are being completed by Datsun Alley of Signal Hill, CA, and wiil be delivered to our participating dealers across the country within the next 10 days to two weeks. Datsun Alley will be continuing the restoration process on its own and will be offering completely restored 240Zs to customers. These will not be Nissan-authorized cars nor will they come with a 12,000-mile/l 2-month warranty. Datsun Alley, however, will stand behind its work, and assist any buyers ofthese cars with any warranty-related problems. Marc Jones of Datsun Alley can be reached at 562-988-0009. Let me just conclude this letter by saying it was a privilege to represent Nissan through the Z-Store, and I have greatly appreciated your interest and support ofthis program. On a personal note, I have been asked by Robert Bentley Publishers, a company noted for its automotive heritage books, to write a book on the Z, including a section on the Z-Store and the Z's legions of fans. If you have anything interesting that you would like to pass on to me for inclusion, please e-mail me at <pete.evanow@nissan-usa.com>, or send it to my attention at P.O. Box 3052, Orange, CA 92857. I look fonvard to seeing many of you at the next National Z Car Convention, and thank you for helping to keep the Z alive and for sharing in the company's great heritage. Cordially, Pete Evanow Manager, Z-Store - - -- - - 30 - - -

Hi Chris (everyone): Re: the Representative Sent To Japan To Plead For The Z... This is what really happened.... Read Mad Mikes Trip Report... it's good reading. 100% certain....? FWIW, Carl Carl Beck Clearwater,FL USA http://ZHome.com

Esteban ask: ....snipped... I see lots of surface rust in the underbody pics but Im no expert and I want to know if im really screwed! also this is my first restoration project and I knew the car would need it I just want to know if it is as bad as it seems. ....snipped... Hi Esteban: For five hundred bucks, I'd have bought that car in instant. If the rear bumper is as good as the front one looks... then the wheels/tires, early SU's and bumpers are worth the $500.00 you paid for the car. Looking at the condition of the metal in the front suspension, as well as the place the frame rail is eaten up - my guess would be that the car sat in salt water at some point. (aka a flood car). I'd afraid I'd have to agree that the car is a lot cause for anyone other than a highly experienced auto body man, with lots of metal working skills. I wouldn't start a restoration project, nor even a refresh project with a unibody in that bad a condition. I would use that car as a parts car only. As someone already mentioned, its the rust you can't see.. but given the rust damage you can see, I'd bet the rockers are ready to rust through, the doglegs are ready to rust though etc. I'd also bet that when you pull the front fenders off, you'll find damage to the firewall as well. Living in Texas, I would shop Texas, NM and AZ until I found a solid rust free unibody on a 240-Z. Even if you had to pay $4,500.00 for it... it would still cost you far less in the long run, than trying to stop the rust you have, and fix the damage already done to the parts car. Even then, you run the risk that all other panels in the car will rust though shortly after you've repaired and repainted the car. If this is one of your first "restoration/refresh" projects... it is very important that you be able to make good progress, without getting totally discouraged. That means it is even more important to find a rust free, very solid body to start with. After you have restored five or ten of these cars, you will be ready to tackle major uni-body work.. but I would not recommend you start out on one. The bottom line is... my best advice would be to hold the parts car and keep looking for a solid car for your "project". You are living in an area where it's quite possible to find solid 240-Z's if you spend the time looking. good luck, Carl Carl Beck Clearwater,FLUSA http://ZHome.com

Chris wrote earlier: >......... >Case in point....Most people will tell you that there were two or three >shops involved in the Program. There were four. Nissan documentation >includes a production figure for two of the shops at a certain date. >......... Hi Chris: Well Pete Evanow, Manager, Z-Store - told us on 30 Oct. 98, that the program was ending 31 Oct. 98. He stated that 18 body shops and 3 Restoration Business had done 40 cars by that point. He also said that Datsun Ally would finish the remaining cars and get them out to the Dealers within a few weeks. Looks like one of the planned restoration shops.... didn't materialize??? I wonder if that should have said 8 body shops... 18 sounds a bit high for 40 cars... but then given only a year to do them all.. maybe not. FWIW, Carl Carl Beck Clearwater,FL USA http://Zhome.com

Chris Wrote: >.... >Mike Taylor is one of four people with their hand in the air at the moment. Hi Chris: Sorry, I don't understand what you mean. You mean that three people other than Mike, claim to be the person in question? >And I haven't talked to half the people I really need to contact. >You should see the information I'm finding. Right now, Mike Taylor has >a 25% chance of being correct in my mind. Chris.. do you think, or are you being told that some other representative (other than Mike) was sent to Japan by the American Z Clubs? That would be interesting indeed. Or are you saying that my credibility is only 25% - or are you just trying to get me to dig more of this stuff out? OK - I Quote from Mad Mike's trip report.. Sept. 14th through 20th 1995, as published in the Z Club of Texas newsletter, of Oct. 1995. I think I still have the copy he sent to the Clubs somewhere as well. .... {Monday though Thursday snipped..cjb}... ....... ......."Friday morning, complete with suite, jumped into a cab to meet with Kenji and Mr. K at Nissan headquarters for our prearranged conference with whomever. (ed. the meeting was arranged the Tuesday before..cjb)...I arrived early and was shown to a carefully appointed conference room. I became aware of someone else entering the serenity of the peaceful atmosphere when I heard.. "I am Hanawa". After introducing myself in Japanese {had a few days to practice}, we exchanged business cards. His card reads: Mr. Yoshikazu Hanawa, Executive Vice President. Namba-San's call resulted in a big surprise for me." Mr. K and Kenji joined us shorty and we discussed various aspects of the "Z" for roughly an hour. In short, Hanawa-San made some notes about our Z Car Club movement, was impressed with the pictures and discussion of the Z American Relay and stated that Nissan wanted to keep the Z as their flagship product if economically viable. We also discussed the problems of meeting EPA requirements, the changing value of the Yen and sports cars in general. Mr. K also stressed and I reinforced from my research within the ZCCA, the sentiment that Nissan should produce a simpler, more economical Z to attract more customers and increase market share. Hanawa-San left us by graciously stating he would pass along our comments and concerns to those within Nissan currently studying the "Z's" future. Regardless of what the future holds for our Z, we at least have had our "day in court"... thanks to Mr. K and Naba-San. ..... End Quote............ "Naba-san" mentioned above is Yasuhara Nanba, class winner of the 1957 Australian Rally, former President and then current Counselor to NISMO. Mr. Nanba made the arrangements for the meeting at HQ the following friday. >I said in the begining post that this was a sensitive subject. Yea!!! I haven't seen anything "sensitive" so far... conflicted/confused for sure, but when you are dealing with people's perspectives of past events that's to be expected ... yes/no? I'll scan a few things I've found lately.. and send them to you. FWIW, Carl Carl Beck Clearwater,FL USA http://ZHome.com

Chris wrote: >I love the recollections that I have been hearing, but who was "a representative >from the American clubs was sent to Tokyo to plead with Nissan to revive the Z." Hi Chris: You don't have to read my Posts.. but, gee... do you have to make it so obvious?* I answered that question in my earlier "recollections". 1. It was Mike Taylor, the Executive Director of the ZCCA (I think I called him the President of ZCCA earlier..oops). 2. He wasn't really "sent" there to plead with Nissan to revive the Z. He went there to make a surprise "house call" on Mr. K for his birthday. While there, a meeting with Nissan was arranged according to his trip report. (sent out to the Club Presidents and printed in the Z Cub of Texas's Newsletter). Be careful that you don't get totally wrapped around the axle by confusing "written documents" with "facts". The "fact" is that the meeting at Nissan HQ was a surprise addition to the trip according to Mike - he should know right? But the fact important to this discussion is that the meeting took place. >Representing what American clubs? At the time (Sept 1995), there were about 20 local clubs AIR, that were paying dues (or who promised to pay them) to the ZCCA. I'm pretty sure that they were included in the "Charter Members", but some Charter Members joined a little later. (as I recall all dues had to be paid in full by the 1997 Convention, in order to be included in the list of Charter Members). ARIZONA Z-CAR CLUB BLUE RIDGE Z CLUB BRAZOS VALLEY Z CAR CLUB BRITISH COLUMBIA Z REGISTRY CAROLINA Z CLUB DATSUN ZOOM CLUB [MONTREAL] GATEWAY Z CLUB INC GROUP Z MARYLAND Z CLUB OKLAHOMA Z CLUB SMOKY MOUNTAIN Z CAR CLUB THOUSAND ISLAND Z CAR CLUB TRIAD Z CLUB TRIANGLE Z CLUB WHITE ROSE Z & ZX CLUB Z CAR ASSOCIATION OF RICHMOND Z CAR CLUB OF COLORADO Z CAR CLUB OF NORTHERN VIRGINIA Z CLUB OF ALBUQUERQUE Z CLUB OF GEORGIA Z CLUB OF HOUSTON Z CLUB OF OHIO Z CLUB OF SAN DIEGO Z CLUB OF TEXAS Z SPORT ZOOM [Z CLUB OF MN] Nonetheless the ZCCA represented itself to Nissan as "representing all Z Car Clubs in North America".. members or not. (of course this was pure BS, you can't represent people that don't belong to your organization). >Where is the correspondence surrounding that? There was none that I know of, it wasn't arranged by correspondence but by a phone call >With whom did this person meet? Mr. Yoshikazu Hanawa, Executive Vice President, Nissan (he was E.VP in 95). >You see, the story is a good one and as I dig into >this a little, I am beginning to see where a lot of it originates. Some of it is based in fact. This is as it should be - right? You are trying to write a story.. not prove a case in court.* >Actually, I started all this because of the off color F word. The F word is a >press interpretation of Nissan marketing. It is taking me >some time to sort through the facts. I just got fooled by >Road & Track! Off color????? as in "F you" ? <vbg> "The F word is a press interpretation of Nissan marketing."? If by "F" word you are talking about the use of the term.. "Factory" as in "Factory Restored". No - I don't think that is a press interpretation at all... that is a fact correctly reported by the Press. The FACT is, the Vintage Z's are FACTORY RESTORED (maybe REMANUFACTURED is better term) Classic 240-Z's.* Nissan Motors USA is as much "the Factory" in that context of the word... as Nissan Motors Ltd. Japan. As far as Nissan and their stockholders are concerned, they are both parts of the whole. The 240-Z's were built by a Nissan Motors subcontractor to begin with. The 240-Z's are Factory Cars...right? It's totally appropriate that when they are rebuilt at Nissan Motors direction and control... even if by different subcontractors, they are still "Factory" products. They aren't "Dealer Specials".. Nissan Motors funded the project, Nissan Motors sold the cars through their Authorized Dealers and Nissan Motors Warranted their product. We use the term "Factory Works Z Cars"... yet they were all "re-worked" in England before the competition events by yet a different subcontractor. Are they not Factory cars any longer? Silly semantics arguments aside, I think that if Nissan Motors calls them "Factory Restored" or refers to them as "a Factory Restoration Program" etc.... then they certainly have a perfect right to do so. >Here is Dale Ishimoto (I am uncertain of the spelling) with Yutaka Katayama >at the Vintage Z Rally and Picnic, May 3, 1997. While it has commonly been referred to as the "Vintage Z Rally and Picnic". To be more correct/precise - it was the picture taken at "The Vintage Z Roll Out" (or Vintage Z Press Roll Out).* An article could be written about the actual "Rally"... that traveled from Dealer to Dealer. The Caravan to the first Dealership from Nissan HQ (that made the National News). Another Article could be written about the Picnic... all in addition to the actual press roll-out of the Vintage Z's and the displays set up to show them off. OF course we talked about the CHPS's that showed up to escort Mr. K and the Z Caravan... When you are up here next, we'll see if we can dig out the pictures of the "Rally" which was just one of the events held that day. There was also a "Z Car Show" held in the main parking lot and a "Vintage Z Car Display" set up on the lawns. Nissan Motors USA hosted the Joint Group-Z / IZCC Picnic at their H.Q. that day as well. I might still have my notes somewhere, from the planning meetings held a few days before the Rollout. As I recall the lead car that day was a Silver 240-Z restored by PZ.. and I'm pretty sure it is the one that the Factory kept. It was on display at the International Auto Show in Dearborn when the 350Z was introduced. FWIW, Carl Carl Beck Clearwater,FL USA http://ZHome.com

Hi TomoHawk: The Relay was divided into 25 legs as I recall, one for each year of the Z. It started with a 1970 240Z leading the local participants. A Treasure Chest/baton was carried in the lead car that contained the funds for charity. The treasure chest was passed from leg to leg.. from year to year of lead Z's until the end when a 1995 300XX lead the participants into Atlanta on the last leg. (you can see this last leg in the History Channels "History Of The Z Car" as I recall.. as they arrived in Atlanta). Participants were given a decal for their quarter windows.. I'll have to find mine, but I'm pretty sure they are the ones you see in all Vintage Z's. (circle with 25th Anniversary - silver and black)... Ah... my memory wakes up.... Chris.. in the Yellow Brochure, from the Vintage Z Roll -out that you had... on the second from the last page there is a picture and write-up about the Z Across America Relay. In the picture of the Z's parked in a huge "Z" pattern, that's my Blue 72 in the middle of the top row. The brief write-up states: "The Relay was the brainchild of Dave Draper of San Diego's Z Car Club.. OK... now I feel better... Dave Draper... Dave Draper... FWIW, Carl Carl Beck Clearwater,FL USA http://ZHome.com

Hi Guys: I don't know how "Official" this is.. From the May 1970, Factory Service Bulletin - Volume 125, "Introduction Of Datsun 240Z Sports" The Official Names For the Colors Are As Follows: 901 Silver gray (metallic) 903 Universal Blue (metallic) 904 Kilimanjaro white 905 Monte Carlo red 907 Racing green 918 New sight orange 919 Sunshine yellow 920 Safari gold Keep in mind that prior to the Z - Datsun was running 510's in the East African Safari Rally etc. Most of the Factory Service Bulletins after 71 dropped the color names.. and refer to them only as 918 orange, 920 gold etc... FWIW, Carl Carl Beck Clearwater, FL USA http://ZHome.com

Earlier Chris wrote: >....snipped.... >I think it is safe to say that Nissan did this for publicity and marketing reasons. Hoping >to benefit from improved image and name recognition after slumped sales and the >discontinuation of the 300ZX in 1996, Nissan Japan approved the Nissan USA proposal >and a budget for the program was established. >....snipped.... Hi Chris: Let's back up a bit... I think there's more to the story than that. Since you are after fine details I thought you might appreciate a bit broader background related to the foundation from which the Z Car Restoration Program sprang. As they say, nothing happens in a vacuum. The movement to save the Z Car started several years earlier... and it involved far more than just Nissan trying to generate some publicity. I believe that the Vintage Z's are the physical embodiment of a far more powerful concept... ie. "To Keep The Spirit Of The Z Car Alive." It's mid 1994 - Everyone in the Z Car Community is simply dumbfounded when Nissan informs us they have no plans to Celebrate the upcoming 25th Anniversary of the Z!!! (Z Sales are at an all time low by 95.. and they know the Z is dead. Nissan has just had its second or third year of heavy red ink as well .... so no marketing dollars for the Z Car..). It's late 1994 - at the Z Car Convention - Planing Meeting. The Georgia Z Club will play host for the upcoming 1995 Convention and the theme will be to "Celebrate the 25th Anniversary of the Z Car". The Convention is to be held in Atlanta July of 1995. Henry Costanzo, President of the Georgia Z Club suggests that Mr. Yutaka Katayama aka the "Father Of The Z Car", be personally invited to the 25th Anniversary Celebration and the group agrees! Upon checking with Johnnie Gable, who in turn checks with Mr. K... the Club is informed that if they invite Mr. K he will indeed be honored to attend. The formal Invitation is issued at once. (I think by now it was into 95). Someone (I can't remember the name, but I can see his face..da.....) in one of the local clubs comes up with the idea of holding a "Z Across America Relay", to promote local club participation and Publicity for the Convention. He organizes and runs the whole thing, and he talks Nissan into some sponsorship dollars as well. Beginning on May 13th, 1995 the 8000 mile - "Z Across America Relay" starts in Salt Lake City..and heads toward Philadelphia..then back Southwest to L.A. from there, heading back to Atlanta - to arrive at the National Z Car Convention on the 25th of July. (picture a map of the USA... and the route forms a large "Z" across the map). Once Nissan Motors USA got word that Mr. K. is returning to the USA for the Convention, they did a complete About-Face and jumped on the Band Wagon in as big a way as possible!!! They promise sponsorship dollars to the Georgia Club to help pay the costs of the convention (if they can participate!).. they jump on "the Z Across America Relay" when it's pitched to them.. and add $50,000 funding for contribution to charity...!! Keep in mind that Mr. K was ordered to retire by the Corporate Fathers in Japan when he reached mandatory retirement.. He returned to Japan, and entered retirement with very shabby treatment by Nissan Motors Ltd. Japan. (lots of his US customers never bought another DATSUN after that.. myself included). Since that time, he had not returned to the USA either. Nonetheless, when a former President of Nissan shows up at any Nissan facility.. he is expected to be treated with great respect and courtesy. Nissan USA knew they would be expected to do no less for Mr. K upon his return to the USA. Mr. K spent the entire week at the 1995 Z Car Convention... simply amazed at the number of Z's there, the number of pure stock and the number of modified Z's... that were in as new or better than new condition. He was stunned that so many of his American customers not only remembered him, but expressed such affection for him personally. The entire event was simply overwhelming for him... he was AMAZED!. When Mr. K returns to Japan he finds that the Japanese Press covered his historic return to the USA and the annual Z Car Convention!! He also informs Nissan HQ that contrary to the reports from Nissan Marketing in the USA - the Z Car is far from Dead. Indeed it is alive and well everywhere except at Nissan. At the Convention, Mike Taylor (aka Mike Mike), then President of Z Car Club Association, spends a great deal of time with Mr. K... keeping schedules, media interviews etc. and Mike had arranged for the History Channel to film a lot of their "History Of The Z Car" there as well. Mike formed a personal attachment to Mr. K and Mr. K got a kick out of Mike as well.. The 25th Anniversary Celebration as well as the Z Car Club Convention went off very well... and everyone left very happy. Now it's a few months later... and Mr.K's Birthday is coming up at the end of 1995... Mad Mike Taylor jumps a plane to Japan, to surprise Mr. K with a Birthday Visit!!! Mike stays for the week or so (as I recall). Mr. K makes arrangements for Mike and himself to visit Nissan HQ and while there Mike makes a plea for Nissan Motors Japan to stop crushing/trashing the very parts we needed to "restore" our older Z's (yes, Nissan was dumping old inventory to cut costs). Mr. K and Mike also try to make a case for the return of the Z Car to North America!! Now it's 1996 and annual Z Car Convention is held in Denver. Again Mr. K is happy to attend... at the end of the Convention he informs us that we can expect some significant changes at Nissan Motors Japan.. and that we should "keep the faith" and keep lobbying Nissan Motors Japan for a new Z Car. (many of our IZCC Members write letters to Mr. Hanawa asking for a new Z Car for the USA). Mr. Hanawa had taken over as President and CEO of Nissan Motors Ltd. Japan. The management chain that had opposed Mr. K for all these years.. the one that forced him to retire.. the one that changed the Brand Name from DATSUN to Nissan (to wipe out any hint of Katayama's huge success)... yep the good old boys were finally gone.. they simply lost too much money to ignore any longer!!! Mr. Hanawa, it turns out - was a long time friend/supporter/believer in Mr. K's marketing and management abilities; as well as his significant contributions to Nissan's Global success. He held Mr. K in much higher regard than was Politically Correct within the old guard.. Nonetheless Mr. Hanawa was now in charge.. and we begin to see things changing at HQ ... in a significant way! At that point you started to see the "Yellow Z Car with the G-Nose" and this little Happy looking Japanese Man showing up on your TV's... with his dog. "Remember Us - we were DATSUN"... "Keep The Spirit Alive"... "We Are Driven"... and the Superbowl's "Dream Garage".... During that time we heard that Nissan was indeed thinking about a new Z Car.. as well as a return to its roots. A lighter, less expensive Z... affordable again... (maybe as soon as 2001).... "The Z Car Restoration Program"...and "the Vintage Z's" were simply the next logical step (Brilliant As The Concept Was!!) - to keep a ball that was already rolling.. moving. Maybe even accelerate it a bit!! The idea of keeping the Spirit of the Z Car Alive - after the death of the last 300ZX didn't originate with Nissan Motors USA's marketing department. They simply jumped on an already moving band wagon.... with a great idea! The Spirit of the Z Car was kept alive in the hearts and minds of the Owners and in the person of Yutaka katayama. The Nissan Employees that came up with the concept... I believe were driven to a far greater extent by the idea of keeping the Spirit of the Z Car Alive, than by just a clever PR or Marketing scheme... (and they more than likely did sell it to management based on marketing and PR value). In terms of "Cause" and "Effect"... no question the Effect of the Vintage Z's was about marketing and PR... but the real "Cause" was driven by a desire to Keep The Sprit Of The Z Car Alive, at least long enough for its reincarnation. >“Fortunately, the following for Z-cars is just as strong as ever. After the 25th >anniversary celebrations in Atlanta, a representative from the American clubs was >sent to Tokyo to plead with Nissan to revive the Z. President Hanawa and the staff in >the USA were so impressed that a number of older examples were rebuilt with the >backing of the factory and sold as new cars. This was an unprecedented turn of >events for a major manufacturer”; Yutaka Katayama, “Fairlady Z Story” (translation), >Long, Miki Press. Well, I guess that's a sort of two sentence summary of three years :-).. but it leaves a lot of the details out...!!! At any rate, I thought you might enjoy a little more about the background leading up to "the Vintage Z's" of ""the Z Car Restoration Program".... too bad we never got to see the restored later model Z's that were planned (the Classic Z Cars), nor the Customer Cars that were planned as a follow on... FWIW, Carl now I'll go digging for that name...Dave ????.. that started the Z Across America Relay.. Carl Beck Clearwater,FL USA http://ZHome.com

Looks like it was the other way around. She deserted herself. Come on guys... it becomes obvious that she had a nervous break down. Total withdraw from any farther interaction with the Z Car Parts crowd... She shows up on a Cat Lovers forum.. seeking some type of human contact in an area she thinks is safe from the pressures of the Z Parts business... One person from this form finds and contacts here there... no farther posts from her in that from then on. She got into a business from home, thinking it would be simple and part time. Maybe lower stress than working for the dealer... the business grew out of hand, the personal demands grew and she cracked. She just can't and won't deal with the situation.... All your concerns for her welfare are very kind... but she needed help way before she finally broke down. FWIW, Carl B. I've seen it happen before.... pretty much the same way.

Biker wrote in this specific thread devoted to other than Z's: >......learn to not to make the same mistakes. How True and How Hard To Do... The key to controlling power in all political endeavors is "Divide and Conquer". "A House Divided Can Not Long Stand" "Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely." For thousands of years the study and application of Political Sciences has remained pretty much the same. The reason is that people have to learn their own lessons in their own time. People simply can not learn the lessons of history, except in retrospect. Nonetheless, that doesn't prevent others from trying to point those lessons out to us ahead of time. George Washington, in his Farewell Address spent about 18 of his 50 paragraphs trying to warn future Americans of the dangers of "Political Parties" and the destruction they could bring to our "United States". In effect, the Father of our Country believed that our UNION as Americans was the foundation upon which all our freedoms, individual liberties and future success were based. He also knew that if Americans ever allowed themselves to put loyalty to any Political Party, ahead of their loyalty to our Union, it would lead to our downfall. Washington correctly believed that a strong Union was of benefit to us all and therefore as Americans we should guard closely against anyone that attempted to fracture that union. To take by stealth and trickery that which could not be taken by force. Our Constitution was originally written to form "a more perfect Union". Not a perfect one. It was written so as to bring Free and Independent States together for the benefit of all (and to the detriment of none). United we Americans stood against the old world with a united belief in certain fundamental principles of individual liberty and self government. Strictly limited powers of the Federal Government Division of powers, with checks and balances in all government bodies Individual Liberty with associated individual responsibility Democracy- Majority Rule with protections of the minority A belief in God - (without which an "oath" is meaningless.. and without which our Courts of Law could not function) A prohibition on Government sponsored religion, freedom of religion etc. About 65 years after Washington's warning related to "Political Parties" that divide geographical areas of the country, then play one against the other... we had the Civil War. 500,000+ American men died to settle the debate of States Right's vs. the Power of the Federal Government. The Union won... and we remained "the United States of America". Now some 208 years later, we have again forgotten, or worse, failed to understand Washington's warning. We have allowed ourselves to be divided between powerful Political Parties. We have sucked up the propaganda, joined the "contest" and chosen sides. Now it's all about "us" vs. "them". The Blacks against the Whites, The Rich against the Not so Rich, The Old against the Young, The Liberals against the Conservatives, the Right Wing against the Left Wing, The Mothers against the Fathers...... divide and conquer... We have meet the enemy and they are us. Presently the only "winners" are the heads of the two Political Parties and the people that fund and control them. As Michael Moore said; "isn't it great that the rich have two Political Parties to protect and favor them." The bottom line is - Americans better wake up and get back to being "Americans". We need to throw both current Political Parties in the trash can. Then we need to reform anew Political parties filled with "Statesmen" and "Citizen Representatives" instead of professional Politicians (seekers of and brokers of power -- that now take on average 56% of our income though direct and indirect taxation). If we fail to turn this around - if we allow our unity to be fracture to the breaking point - we will look and act just like the fractured states of Europe. The very thing our forefathers fled! Different cultures, different languages, thousands of years of waring tribes, states and nations. Religious wars and cultural hatred. Driven by emotion to the great detriment of them all! Isn't it ironic that the Europeans are today trying very hard to copy the very "Union" we Americans have enjoyed here in the United States for the past 200+ years? The ECU is now ready to support their own Constitution and standardized economy, the EURO Dollar is here! Individually none of them came close to competing with the "United" States of America. Do you think they are acting in our best interests now or their's? The world is not filled with our friends nor our enemies.. it's filled with competing Countries, competing Ideals, competing Cultures. United we "Americans" have beat them ALL for the past 200 years, in every regard. Now we put that all at risk, because we fail to recognize "Political Propaganda" for what it is... divide and conquer. There are no "Red" States, nor any "Blue" States - there are only 50 United States. Majority rule with protection for the minority - means that we argue about issues FIRST... Then we make decisions. Once the Decision is made, we all, for our own good, support the majority decision. At least until the proper time comes to revisit that decision. This endless argument.. day after day, week after week, month after month, year after year... is all about Political Propaganda...not about what is truly best for "we the people". What you are seeing now with all this arguing after the fact - is the long term effects of political propaganda... put out by the power brokers and our enemies. Conservative or Liberal in your views, Republican or Democratic in your Party..continuing to put either or both ahead of being and acting like Americans, will in the end destroy us all. It's been that way for human politics for the past 3000 years. Isn't it time we stepped back and learn something from our human history? The elections are over - lets make the best of it and get back together in four years to discuss the results of our decision. Until that time we the people really need to be united not farther divided by false issues. Somewhat hard to read/comprehend as President Washington wrote it.. but we should all try: http://www.constitution.org/gw/fare_add.htm FWIW, Carl B. A conservative when it comes to our US Constitution A liberal when it comes to overthrowing Dictatorships A registered "independent" voter in Florida

No. There is no way. The "strikers" aren't the only thing thats different. If you look closely, you will see that the doors you bought are actually shaped differently than the doors on your 72, where they meet the threshold. If you put 75/78 280Z doors on a 240Z you'll never get them to seal in the opening. Put them back on e-bay and find a set of the correct doors for your car. sorry, Carl Carl Beck Clearwater,FL USA http://ZHome.com

Hi Guys: Here is my opinion. Three years ago a 76 280Z with 16K miles sold pretty quickly for $16K. Within the past year several 50K mile, original owner 280Z's have changed hands between $8,500.00 and $10,500.00. A more recent sale in NYC was a 16K mile 280Z for $10,500.00 (a bargain and the buyer knew it;-) If this 280Z really checks out - and actually has less than 5K miles (not a car with the speedo disconnected for 25K miles, no dings, not one little scratch, perfect clearcoat on the Metallic Silver etc)... then it will sell for something close to $25K. A perfect original... and I mean really "original" as defined in the dictionary.. not repainted, not fully detailed etc etc... but 100% original perfection... at $25K would be about half of what it would cost to put a lessor car in that condition. As time passes, we are seeing the prices of the 280Z's go UP... people realize that just like the "mid-year" Corvettes... they may not be the first of the series.. but they might represent the best all round. To the serious "Collector" this 280Z might seem like a bargain. I'll agree that it's not a "driver", nor even a weekend car for local shows.. It is a car for Pebble Beach etc. and the people that take them there see $25K as pocket change. You could most likely part it out on e-bay, every nut bolt and screw and collect $50K... FWIW, Carl B. Carl Beck Clearwater, FL USA http://ZHome.com

Hi Guys: Now that someone mentioned it.. Ed.... that floorpan with seats/center console properly mounted and redesigned... would just fit in front of my desk here... then with a new Mac and a 23" display... I'd be set!!.... might be able to make a new desk out of an old hood too.... hummm.... Hey - KRAST - ask the seller to shoot me a price..... ah... a low price;-) FWIW, Carl Carl Beck Clearwater,FL USA http://ZHome.com

Hi Guys: Interesting item. Nonetheless I never make serious offers, until I know what the seller thinks something is worth. It's usually a waste of time. If he thinks it's worth #800.00 to $1000.00 then my "serious" offer of $350.00 would sound pretty harsh.... After trying to sell it for a year and not getting offers of much more than $350.00... he'd sell it for that, to someone else. I truly believe that people that own items like these, need to start the marketing process by putting a price on them. I believe that the last one sold on e-bay for around $400.00 a few months ago. As I recall it was in the North Eastern US. It's a BIG part to STORE if you don't have need of it, and it would be a fun collectible if you had the room and it didn't cost too much. FWIW, Carl Carl Beck Clearwater,FL USA http://ZHome.com

Hello 280Z (everyone) Below is the reply I received from Car Care Specialities. = == = =Copy Message = = = From: "carcare" <sales@carcareonline.com> To: "Carl Beck" <cbeck@becksystems.com> Subject: Re: Vinyl Care Product Ingredients Date: Fri, 3 Sep 2004 10:47:32 -0400 Dear Carl: All manufacturers must provide you with an M.S.D.S. form upon request. Any product we carry or seriously test for possible inclusion in our range of products we run through a Mass Spec. to determine the exact ingredients. We have even found some companies that are "less than truthful" on their M.S.D.S. forms. Any product we carry does not contain the harmful forms of raw silicone oil. We will not sell anything that we have not thoroughly tested. There is no way to know what is in the "discount store" products. One rule of thumb is that the lower the price, the more raw silicone oil it contains, as raw silicone oil is very cheap. The "discount store" type of retailer is looking for a fat profit margin and national advertising budgets. Bottles cost the same, so the only way to increase profit margin and provide national advertising budgets is to reduce the costs of the product. I hope this helps. Thank you again, Larry Reynolds Car Care Specialties, Inc. Distributors of Quality Car Care Products 116 South Main Street Unit # 2 Lodi, NJ 07644-2251 US Toll Free (877) 796-8300 Outside US (201) 796-8300 Fax (973) 767-0038 email: larry@carcareonline.com website: www.carcareonline.com Old enough to remember when sex was safe and race cars were dangerous. = = = = =END Copy = = = = = = = = So now I have another term... to find.... "raw silicone oil". There must be some kind of "cooked silicone oil" out there too. This company must be fairly large to afford time on a Mass. Spec. to check every product. FWIW, Carl

Hi Chris: Try this: http://householdproducts.nlm.nih.gov/index.htm Silicone Oil: Armor-All Protectant 35-50% Meguiars Vinyl/Rubber Cleaner/Conditioner 15-25% STP Son of A Gun Vinyl Protectant 15-30% Penz/Shell's - Black Magic Professional Protectant 10-50% - Trak Protectant 10-30% Non-hazardous ingredients: CAS Registry Number 999999-57-5 Lexol Vinylex Protectant % not listed but Bonide Leaf Shine and Moisture Guard a pesticide = 100% couldn't find anything on Zymol, One Grand or Harly yet... Chris Wrote: >....the general consensus is that silicon emulsions are common, inexpensive >compounds used as replacement fillers for the natual off-gassing of vinyl. Over time, >the silicon will accelerate the off-gassing process by creating light reflection and >differential heating of the material - hot spots. Light reflection??? in a Black Dash?.. I do not believe that the "general consensus" is anything close to the truth. I can't believe that Meguiars, STP, Shell Oil, Clorox etc... would put anything in their products, that would be harmful to the very products they claim to "protect". All these companies, have experienced and expert Chemists working for them, that know what they are doing. I'll see if I can get ahold of one. FWIW, Carl

Hi Guys: I have used Armor-All and nothing but Armor-All on my dash since it was new in 1972. No cracks to date. I have applied it per the directions, about three times a year. I don't comprehend anyone applying it weekly. For that matter, I've used Armor-All on all my Classic, Collectible and Special Interest Cars since 1970. Never had any problems.. All the antidotal reports... seem sadly lacking in scientific proof including my own. Nonetheless... your hearing it directly from me... not repeated from a friend of a friend... and I started using the product on a known good dash... not an unknown 20+ year old dash, not a dash subjected to a cocktail of chemicals prior to using Armor-All... One new dash, one owner, one product for 33 years... perfect dash (72 240-Z) One new dash, two owners, one product for 33 years...perfect dash (72 240-Z) One new dash, one owner, one product for 14 years.. perfect dash (91 T-Bird SC) I would like someone to direct me to where they found the list of ingredients, with percentages of total -officially listed for Armor-All either by its manufacturer, or a reliable scientific testing facility. As far as I can see, it's a trade secrete. How can anyone state factually that the active ingredient in Armor-All is "silicone oil"...???? (it could be..if there is such a thing ... I don't know...I want proof not repeated stories.. shouldn't we all???). Urban Myths.... I agree with Owen K.. we need believable testing results.. conducted by a disinterested third party to reasonable scientific standards. I'd like some factual information from a source that isn't selling a competing product, or starting Urban Myths about their competition. FWIW, Carl Carl Beck Clearwater, FL USA (does anyone get more UV than us?) http://ZHome.com

26th Z wrote: >This site has great information about careing for vinyl and rubber. >http://www.carcareonline.com/ >Take note the references to Armor-All and products that contain >silicon oils Hi 26th Z (everyone): I've read the materials at the site you reference... I have not found anything that's says anything about "Armor-All". Did I miss something? Quoted From CarCareOnLine.com >Vinyl Care: >....snipped.... >A quality cleaner/dressing product will contain a UV protectant and >essential oils to replace lost oils from the vinyl. These protectants >are very expensive, so the K-Mart specials may do more harm than >good. Silicone oil also has a very strong electrostatic attraction which >may be considered beneficial in that it will tend to stay where it is placed, >but will also attract every dust particle in the surrounding three counties. Armor-All label information says: "Protectant guards against ozone, oxygen and ultra-violet rays.. ....bla bla bla....It makes surfaces anti-static to repel dust and dirt." So they claim at least that Armor-All has the UV shield recommended. I just took a rubber balloon, rubbed it through my hair... Yep, lots of static cling!! The now static charged balloon sucked the dust off the top of my monitors!!! Then applied a little Armor-All from one of the Armor-All wipes to the balloon.... all static gone.... and now I can't even get it charged up again by rubbing it through my hair. (however my hair is now flat ;-). I sent the following e-mail note to Car Care Specialties, Inc. = = =Copy follows = = == Car Care Specialties, Inc. http://www.carcareonline.com/ Hello: In your "How-To" articles related to vinyl and rubber care, you write about the various ingredients of vinyl and rubber care products. I have several different products in my garage, not one has a list of ingredients on any of the labels, nor can I find a list of ingredients with percentages of total from the manufacturers. Most seem to be secrete formulas. I would appreciate knowing how you found the specific ingredients of any of the products, especially the discount brands you warn against. Short of having a list of ingredients with percentages of contents, do you use specific scientific tests to determine the presents of any of the ingredients you warn against. I don't want to drink all this stuff to see if any contain formaldehyde!! Thank you for any help you can provide. kind regards, Carl Carl Beck, President Internet Z Car Club Clearwater, FL USA http://ZHome.com = = = = = = End Copy = = = = I'd love to figure out how to determine what's in all these various products... I guess it's good that Car Care Specialties, Inc. sells the products they recommend... and warns you against any other competition... isn't it? "raw Silicone Oil" (what the hell is THAT?) - I'm pretty sure it's all Snake Oil... ;-) FWIW, Carl Next email goes to McKesson Inc.. aka Armor-All...