dogma420

The fuel vapor tank is made out of metal in 240z's. Check out my tech article: http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19034 It mainly deals with POR15'ing the entire gas tank, but also explains how to reroute the fuel tank hoses correctly when removing the vapor tank.

well, mine's all black; no silver. It's a Honda (but it was the aftermarket new motor I bought)...also, should be noted, that the new motor was quieter w/o fan blade attached vs. the new black one I got. And, yes, IMO, if you're the passenger, the first thing you'd look at would be the silver motor, because it looks out of place in a completely stock interior. Easy enought to paint however.

Mark--change it out!!! if you have a leaking water pump, just in general I wouldn't drive a vehicle.imo.

Carl? Where the hell have you been? Nice seeing you type. I don't take it personally; it's just funny seeing people comment when they've done nothing.

This is still on the burner list...I'm serious, just might be a few things 'down the list'...I appreciate everyone showing interest...looks like I need to start getting quotes. The problem is, the cutting of the sticker, isn't square--on a mass production sheet, this costs more than just a rectangular square...not sure how much more...they may be even cheaper, by means of sending a template and a retangular sticker, and having each owner cut to size. Not sure yet...want to make them cut obviously, but it may cost too much; i mean, these aren't low vin 70 240s here, so the sticker isn't that important..I just thought it would be nice to have a new looking sticker when mine looks like crap.

Yes, I think Arne and you are correct, Martini....I just haven't had a chance to bleed it....all clutch parts are about 5k old so hopefully I'm not leaking yet.

Excluding the 'dinking around' trying to get the stock fan blades to mate to the new motor, total time is under an hour. Stock 240z fans don't have pigtails....that's a Honda pigtail...even if you have a pigtail, you still have to splice the wires into the setup. 240's use 2 male/female plugs sticking out of the wiring harness only about an inch. All references to 'honda blowers' show a silver ended fan that even if painted black, does not match the 240z motor housing (the one in the picture has this pigtail thingy plugging into the motor). The procedure I used matches the original fan, where 2 wires come out of the stock motor. Without mods, my fan looks stock...I will post pictures as soon as I find my camera. Uh, Russell, I post this information for users that could possibly use it. It's easy to make reply's such as yours. Sometimes experience at doing a job exposes a few things that if you were to know before you started a project, it might help you. That's what I did. What did you do?

why would you need a charcoal canister? Don't eliminate none of that stuff on FI-- Check out technical articles.

yeah man--why would you want to make it modern?

I was talking about installing a 88-91 Honda heater motor/fan in my 240z earlier in this thread...here's my new link about the installation.... http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?p=167271#post167271

Howdy everybody... I just finished with the Honda blower motor upgrade for my 72 240z. I have got to tell you, this would be the best upgrade ever for my Z if it wasn't for Dave's Headlight relay harness upgrade. I'm telling you...on the setting low (the first setting from off) the output is just about equal to what it used to be on full. Yes, it's that good. I did it primarily for 2 reasons: 1. The stock heater fan's output reminds me of an early 70's Japanese car (duh)...in other words, this heater motor's output is very low in comparison to anything in modern times. 2. I plan on installing a new R134a A/C system this June..so I wanted to possibly get higher fan output if at all possible. What I did was order a 88-91 Honda Civic Motor from this Link: http://www.drivewire.com/hondaparts/catalog/hondacivicheaterblowermotor.html I figured a new one for $85.40 ? Sounds good to me...(any of the motors at the bottom for any of the 88-91 civics work, they are all the same model)... The problem was, and I'm to blame, is that it didn't come with a fan blade! Even the picture doesn't show it having one. The Honda one is plastic, much lighter than the 240z metal one, and after over 3 hours of fabrication tries, I came to the conclusion that the stock 240z metal fan blade can't be mounted to this Honda fan without major mods to the motor's bolt that the fan blade would mount to. [i'M NOT SAYING that someone else here couldn't figure it out--I gave up at the 3 hour mark--seems that the spacing is too deep when I got the fan installed--the bolt through the motor would have to be removed and have the indentation on the end of the Honda motor machined down lower on the bolt to make it work--just wasn't worth it, because at that point, the 3 hour mark, I remembered this.....] Auto Adventure in Portland, Oregon Link: http://www.partsadventure.com/ Growing up, I must of had 10 Honda Accords and Civics...and I used to buy parts all the time from Auto Adventure. This is a smaller warehouse in the middle of Portland that houses just about every stock part imagineable for any Honda from 1988 to present (used to be from 1976 to present in the day...) The great thing is, all parts are already disassembed and have been stored since they were removed from a salvage car in a temperature controlled environment. Auto Adventure (owned by Speed's towing) purchases wrecked and whatever else Hondas and then disassembles and does whatever. So.... I called them up, "do you have the plastic fan blade for a 88-91 Honda Civic heater motor?" "yeah, $50" So, now I'm in this project for $85 + 50...jeeze...anyways... I go down there and for $50 I get the entire heating housing, motor, fan, the entire heating guts from under the dash from a civic. They force you to take it all so they have more space. You could probably get them to ship to anywhere in the US, not sure, but if you can't find the parts,....I'd call them. So here's what I did, and what parts I used: 1. New motor from first link 2. Used white plastic fan blade from used motor I got from Auto Adventure 3. Round rubber gasket that goes around outside of housing from used assembly I got at Auto Adventure (THIS was very useful, I think I would've needed this and/or created something--my 35 year old 240z fan gasket was too worn out to be resued IMO). 4. 2 wire crimper thingies, tube with insulation on the outside that you stick 2 ends of wires into each end, and then vice grip the connector tightly closed to complete a circuit. Just put the whole assembly together as you would think it would go. Observations: 1. I tested the new motor with the plastic fan to ensure it was going to rotate the correct way (if wrong, the air output wouldn't be very strong)...when positive (red) from new Honda motor was connected to the postive (red) of the 240Z wiring harness (and both negatives attached) I found that POLARITY IS CORRECT, THAT THE FAN ROTATES THE CORRECT WAY WITHOUT SWITCHING POLARITY. All I did was check what rotation was on original fan motor in relation to the 240z fan blade's curvature) 2. The Honda motor (both the new one and used one) came with a vent hole on the motor, that would have a 'snorkel' that leads to the air housing where the fan blade is moving. My guess is this is to wisk away moisture and keep the motor more dust free than if it was just sealed (like the 240z motor)...not sure what would be better, plugged or vented...I chose to just keep it open, the opening sits on top of the motor and I doubt anything would get in there in the future...I think this would be better than if the vent was capped with a rubber emission type cap... 3. The gasket from the used motor I purchased that goes around the outside was very important in sealing the whole fan in its base. Make sure that you seal it in some way. 4. The 3 washer/rubber gaskets that the housing screws go through need to be modified. The oem Honda fan housing just has knobs in the plastic that the fan sort of snap into (like 2 legos) and then use large washers. What I did was remove the 3 washer/rubber thingies from the 240z motor, and I cut the inside rubber portion off, and removed the 'tube' of metal that the screw went through. What was left was the outside washer, attached to the outside portion of rubber--IMO the best way to mount the heater. 5. The glove box should definitely be removed so you don't damage/scrape the bottom of the glove box as you remove the fan (it would be very easy to damage your glove box). The wire leads from the 240z harness are VERY short (at least on my 10/71 Z) and reconnecting them would be very difficult without removing the glove box. 6. This FAN KICKS TOTAL butt! I highly recommend this upgrade. It's right up there with the headlight harnesses as far as making our 240's feel more like one of our other newer cars. The output is incredibly high on wind, but it isn't any louder, in fact, the motor is quieter at its highest output...the air rushing sound though, is actually louder than the stock 240z fan, which isn't surprising. Although it does not look 100% original, on anything but a low vin 70 car, it's barely noticeable that the fan has been replaced. 7. I would recommend just getting the used assembly from Auto Adventure...But at least I now have an extra Honda motor for future failures if necessary. After seeing/feeling the fan output, I don't feel bad at all about spending $135 on this upgrade...using my Z as a daily driver at times, it's nice to have a good fan on a cold Winter morning, or that one or two weeks of 80+ temps we have here in the Northwest USA. Any questions, PM me... By the way, I thought about doing pictures and/or putting this in the tech how to article area, but it's just too easy and short, I decided against it...am I correct? Have a great rest of your week everyone,

E31 and E88's are for L24's for the most part; IMO I'd recommend a L28 style head...

David, If you're talking to me...if not, here goes anyways....;-) Having got laid-off a month ago, and fighting my previous company and Oregon Unemployment insurance over $$$ has pretty much tapped me out...plus I'm spending approx $1,000 today or Monday on various parts at VB and MSA. My car doesn't stack up to just about anybody's car that looks nice on this site...due to not having a garage, I've kept the outside looking like crap on purpose. I plan on putting new oem fenders, door skins, doglegs, rockers, lower half of quarter panels...just about everything after I take a few welding classes at PCC. I'm NOT whining about my car, but a year from this summer coming up, I'll have a garage (Hopefully) and I can trick my car out...and it will be a good representation of what I think of Zs...right now, I just don't want it getting stolen, and I also use it as a daily driver while my van sits with a dead starter...(uh....i sure have been lazy picking up that new starter...I think I've put at least 6,000 miles on my Z since I put your headlight harness in...man, I've got to tell you, that is one of the best things I've ever done to my car....THANK YOU ...you can't know how much this upgrade has improved my happiness about my beloved Z... CA (Los Angeles) is just too far to go on my budget coming up in April....I do have a hidden card in my deck for next summer however.....my lady wants to take her 2 kids (and one of mine) down to Disneyland next summer (not this one) so it looks like I could push them to go to the 2007 msa event and push up the disneyland trip earlier than summer....sounds like fun.... I'd take my conversion van, with a dolly behind it, towing my z...I'd just drive the Z, but the whole family will go... But my lady would cut me off (you know what I mean) if I took off for MSA with my money issues right now AND her not having that time to take off right now (like taking the Thurs/Fri off from work)....to me it wouldn't make sense unless you took most of the week off, and visited Disneyland, Knots Berry Farm, and that new Disney attraction, what's it called? California Adventure? and Magic Mountain just north of course--love that place, and my Taz tank top is worn out, so I got to go back soon!!!! Anyways, that's my sad excuse for not going this year, but I can promise you that I will attend in 2007....it would be my first year and I'm telling you, I'm already excited. David--be sure to take a LOT of pictures (anyone else too!) Mike will more than likely as usual in the past make a place to post all pictures from everybody.

Yeah, I think it will work great....I'll have 4 guage on one side from the battery, and 8 guage on the other side for your headlight harness, the parking light harness, and a live feed for my stereo decks power. I don't have a garage however, and I'm going to wait until this Portland, Oregon weather gets better....its been rainy and pretty cold outside....not the kind of weather I like to be out in for a few hours doing a dexterious task like wiring on my car....supposed to warm up next week so we'll see.

Thanks Will...I was just curious...when I replaced my water pump, I did it just because I had the radiator out to have a leak fixed and replaced it at the same time...don't think it was worn out. Another time I just replaced it when it started to leak....

David, Check out the pictures of the block I bought; it's for amplifiers at a car stereo shop, but should do the trick. I'm mounting it near the battery on the firewall in the engine compartment. On the big hole side, a 4 guage wire from the battery is going; on the other side your headlight harness and your parking light hardness are going to get their electricity. I'm also hooking up my stereo (just a head unit, low wattage). Tell me what you think; also, I know, the holes might be too small; if they are, I'm just going to drill them a little bigger.

I will try that tomorrow, thanks Arne. I have always felt that this wasn't an issue, and that may just be the issue! It sure doesn't appear that there is anything else I can do, so I hope this works. Thank you Arne.

ya know, that's a possible other issue; logically, my brain just doesn't understand how clutches can be bled...it doesn't follow the same procedure as brakes in my head, because there isn't a point of 'pressure' where you push the brake pedal to. What I did to blead the clutch line was this: push clutch in like 10 times, hold it in, and while it is held in, release nipple at the slave. All that comes out is hydraulic fluid however. Then seal back up. Arne, or anyone else, is there a better way to do it? I've pissed at this problem so much that I might even go to a clutch mechanic and say 'please adjust and bleed my clutch system' and tell him what I told everyone here in my posting (#1 post). But I enjoy knowing how to do everything on my car, and this is frustrating! Let me know Arne if this is how you do it....would one of the 'one man brake bleeding systems' work better? Thanks for bringing up the idea of making sure there is no air.

Wondering if anybody has any ideas about my issue below...then I'll list what I've replaced. When driving down the road, the gears shift pretty smoothly from gear to gear. I'm really happy with my 5 speed tranny conversion. I opted for a 77-78 5 speed, so my 1 through 4 gears were essentially the same...I know, I know...they are not exact, but I liked that they are very similiar. Please don't say get a ZX 5 speed...I'm not going to do this, I intentionally got the 77 5 speed on purpose. To me, it feels strong, I can spin the tires if I dump the clutch, so it is engaging correctly I believe... Problem: When I am going 5 mph or under, or I am sitting still, gears are hard to shift into (with the clutch pedal pushed in all the way).... IE. when completely stopped and I'm in 2nd gear, and shift into 1st gear while waiting at the stop, its too harsh most of the time. It isn't just a smooth movement from 2nd to 1st...I don't expect it to be as smooth as when the motor is turned off, but it's harsher than anything I've driven before. IE. shifting into reverse with motor running at a complete stop is tough...since my 5 speed is the one that the reverse fork shares the 5th gear, I get a little grinding sound about 40% of the time when shifting into reverse. It's almost like I don't have the clutch pedal all the way down to the floor, which I do, or that I'm trying to shift without the clutch. The problem seems to be that the clutch isn't disengaged 100% but don't know what to do next to alleviate the problem. It shouldn't be like this. Here's what I've done: 1977 5-speed...came with clutch fork and throw-out bearing already installed, and this was directly pulled out of a 77 280z for my purchase, so the clutch fork and throw out bearing are stock 77 parts. I never did check, so it could be the PO screwed me here...possibly the next step would be to get a new replacement 77 clutch fork, boot, and throwout bearing...I noticed the other day that the boot is cracked, so it could use replacing. If I pulled the tranny to do this, it would also give me a reason to replace my leaking rear main seal. Clutch Slave AND master cylinders ordered from MSA for a 1977 280z with 5 speed. So I have the automatic adjusting clutch slave cylinder. Steel braded clutch hose where the flexible hose goes right before the slave. Bought at MSA. Complete OEM style clutch kit for a 1977 5 speed 280z. Pressure plate and clutch disc for a 77 5 speed. My stock 1972 flywheel resurfaced. Used a 77 positioning tool when installing the tranny last summer. Have driven car approximately 10,000 miles since. Clutch pedal is original 1972. is this different for the 77 5 speed car? The adjuster that attaches to the clutch pedal (that goes into the clutch master cylinder) is adjusted all the way out. If it isn't adjusted all the way out, the car doesn't go anywhere...just sits there like the clutch pedal is pushed in all the time whether it is or not. if it isn't adjusted all the way out, you can sit with the motor running and shift through all gears while it is running and the clutch isn't pushed in. What I'm wondering is, the actions I'm experiencing can't be the norm for a 5 speed...my 4 speed was very smooth when stopped and wanting to shift from 2nd to 1st or shift into reverse. Is there something I'm missing? Like the pedal being different or has anyone had any issues like what I'm saying? I'm stumped. I also got the 77 5 speed because I was interested in the 60% reduction in shifter throw action with MSA's short shifter kit. I am getting this next week....can't wait. I'm going to cut the top of the shift linkage down 1.5 inches and get the threads put on down 1.5 inches, so the shifter is lower and even more reduced on throws. Besides this problem, the 5 speed conversion is awesome! I've loved the 5 speed overdrive...I can go 70 mph at about 3300 rpm, where as before I'd be way over 4000 rpm. I'd say I'm getting 2-3 miles per gallon better on the highway than before. ? Anybody? Help!

Just a quick question....Z saint says << (The water pump was hurting with a LOT of bearing play, however!) >> Is there a way to check for bearing play in advance of total failure or obvious coolant leaking from the pump? ie. do you shake the fan or ? Just curious, thanks guys.

Just wondering..... I think.... that any of the Zs from the beginning to somewhere in the middle of Series II (mid 71) that have the cigarette lighter under the radio would require the little rectangular sticker that Arne is doing....is that right? How long does the 'cross shaped' sticker for the hazards stay on the scene? Would this to from where the cigarette lighter is between the heater controls and driver's area up until the 260z, which has the 280z style dash...is that right? So numbers speaking, The small rectangle hazard sticker that arne makes would fit vins of 1 to approx ???? The cross style hazard sticker would fit vins of ???? to ???? Anyone help out here?

I agree with Dtsnlvrs.... Having 2 attachments to the positive terminal, AND wanting to have my new stereo cd player head unit connected directly to the battery would have me jamming 3 extra wires! So I went to a stereo shop (got my stereo at Walmart, I'm a cheap arse--but it is a nice 50w x 4 mosfet mp3 compatible Pioneer head I paid only $130!!!) and the stereo shop sold me a 1 into 3 gold plated attachment...all have a screw that you tighten to secure each wire into the block, it looks great. Waterproof with a plastic shielding cover. They were quite helpful, and said that this block is normally placed inside the cabin and used for amplifiers only. They said it would have no problems with the configuration I wanted--just that I need to use 4 gauge wiring instead of their normal 8 gauge they use for the live feed for amplifiers. The hole that the live cable goes into fits a 4 gauge wire perfectly as well. The live wire feed is big enough for 4 guage wire, so I bought a 2 foot length of wire so I'll only have 1 extra 4 guage wire. So what I'm going to do is mount this little contraption next to the battery on the firewall where there is a nice little space with enough room for wires on both sides... 4 gauge wire goes into block on battery side; on the other side, I have a live feed for the stereo head (still have presets, etc. hooked up to cigarette lighter)...the other 2 holes are used for Dave's headlight relay and the parking light relay. I'll post pictures as soon as I have it assembled. PS. I just ordered a brand new 92 Honda Civic blower fan, from www.drivewire.com, an online auto parts supplier. Direct Link: http://www.drivewire.com/hondaparts/catalog/hondacivicheaterblowermotor.html The total cost with free shipping was $85. I thought this was a good deal, considering that this is a major everyday item that I use quite frequently with Oregon's chilly wet winter weather. Can't wait to see the difference!!! (apologies right now if you didn't want me to change subjects...I thought with the electrical improvements being the major subject of this thread everyone would be interested.) Everyone have a good week,