26th-Z

A couple of comments and then some stuff from this morning's e-mail. The VIN # on the door post would match all the rest of the VIN #s on the car - dash, firewall, shock tower. The production date only appears on the door jamb. The value is simply a conversation piece and a unique quality - it is subjective. Differentials are notorious for rumble and clunk. It is entirely possible that the differential has been changed. Finally, this latest accounting ot the early import cars from Carl Beck: Here is a copy of my current listing of 69's.. Note that 789 is also a 12/69 date of production. We found 501 in a junk yard in Canada - it has an 01/70 production date. 124 1969's Found So Far: as of 17 Jan. 2004 00006, 00007, 00008, 00016, 00017, 29 of the first 100 00019, 00020, 00022, 00026, 00029, 00030, 00032, 00033. 00036, 00037, 00040, 00042, 00048, 00051, 00052, 00056, 00057, 00069, 00075, 00077, 00079, 00087, 00089, 00091 00101, 00105, 00114, 00126, 00127, 17 of the second 100 00128, 00129, 00140, 00147, 00152, 00157, 00158, 00182, 00193, 00194, 00195, 00198 00201, 00202, 00207, 00212, 00215, 26 of the third 100 00216, 00222, 00224, 00230, 00238, 00239, 00240, 00244, 00247, 00248, 00249, 00253, 00258, 00261, 00265, 00267, 00268, 00277, 00279, 00286, 00299 00300, 00302, 00303, 00305, 00308 25 of the fourth 100 00311, 00318, 00319, 00331, 00332, 00333, 00346, 00348, 00357, 00361, 00368, 00374, 00378, 00383, 00384, 00387, 00391, 00390, 00392, 00399 00402, 00405, 00415, 00426, 00429, 22 of the fifth 100 00432, 00439, 00448, 00450, 00453, 00456, 00459, 00461, 00464, 00471, 00473 00476, 00479, 00486, 00490, 00496, 00498 119 of first 500 69 Production 00502 has a production date of 11/69 00512 has a production date of 12/69 00504 has a production date of 11/69 00506 has a production date of 11/69 00789 has a production date of 12/69 +5 of 1969 Production 124 Total of 69 Production Year 00048 has a production date of 02/70 00300 has a production date of 02/70 - 3 (that were not 69's) 00474 has a production date of 01/70

Hello kats! Good to "see" you again! Great conversation. What is the panel behind the front wheel well about?

Yea! He got in the car with some woman at the airport? Now I'm going to have to watch it again - oh shucks. Great pictures - just great. I found what I was looking for - Brian Long; "Fairlady to 280Z", page 42 and 43. The Yamaha A550X and the Toyota. Long gives Goertz credit, but from other literature I have read, it's a stretch.

Whooops! What happened to the picture?

Thanks! It's really confusing. I just got this in my e-mail, how pertinent, number 793 with a 12/69 build date. There is just no real answer to what happened when. I know of a fellow who claims he used to own #1776 with a 12/69 build date. There have been many discussions about what parts appeared on what cars. "kats" has contributed a wealth of info and you should check out his site http://www.geocities.jp/datsunz903/ "HLS30-H" has posted numerous pictures from parts books I lust after showing parts and numbers with far better descriptions than I have. The more I look at parts, the more differences I find. What particular part (parts) are you having trouble with, billramsey2002?

I just returned from the Suncoast Z Car Club spring picnic. Lovely sunny day - low 80's - good turnout of members. 26 cars, 5 S30s.

Transmissions are not number linked to the VIN on early Zs. The doorplate showing an improper weight for the car model is a rare and unique conversation piece about the particular car and should be valued. 280Zs did gain a lot of weight, as we all know, but take pictures of your door plate and do some more investigation of your car to determine the build within the various categories. EScanlon could not be more correct. There is a tremendous amount of "bleed over". Here's the explanation. Datsun introduced the 240Z with a certain production run in mind. They were planning to send a few cars or so over here and keep a few themselves. Datsun sent out orders for parts from the different suppliers to meet this "production run". Remember now, that Toyota was having a flop with the 2000GT, the Fairlady Roadster was competing with the TR-4, MGB, and Austin Healy for American sales and not doing real well - Datsun was not real optimistic and the "production run" was not a big number of cars. Well, the whole thing blew up in their face. Sales and sales orders soared along with warranty issues that forced design changes along with new part orders from the suppliers. The suppliers had to gear up to meet the order demands, and they had design upgrade issues as well. For example, I have two series one differentials sitting on the floor here, and they are noticeably different. Mine 11/69 - the other 6/70. I have parts that I only see on very low VIN cars - grey plastic ash tray, plastic gas door latch, gas cap with no chain, metal name plates, clear deck lid glass... Generally speaking, parts fit across the board. There are only certain significant changes within the various categories / dates / VIN #s, but some old parts were used until they ran out and the new part replaced it. One can simply not tie it down. To top it off, ya'll are trying to tie "model years" into the equation. I think it just confuses the issue more. I like sticking to production dates stamped on the doorplate, confirmed with the VIN that is stamped in the firewall. The IZCC refrence is a great resource, certainly not completely correct, but it's not a complete accounting either.

You hit the nail on the head, Alan. James drove a 2000GT in what Bond movie? His tailor, of course was Savile Row. I truly believe that if Katayama san had brought the GT to America, this would be a different club. Like the difference between the 350Z and the G35 today. The Toyota is a beautiful little car with wonderful performance for its time. Alan, do you have pictures of the Yamaha prototype to compare to the Toyota? That would be interesting.

Alan, Are you home? Glad to see your response.

Couple more SR311 kits on eBay http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3177209090&category=2583 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3176930484&category=2583

I have serious doubts that the car is an authentic ZG. I was scolded by Alan once about being fooled by fiberglass ZG kits commonly fitted. He has an authentic ZG. He would know. The fender flares are not authentic. The interior is not authentic. The shifter is not authentic. The paint color is not authentic. And the engine bay is so chromed, I would say this is a customized Fairlady at best. The stated VIN number is not the correct code for an authentic ZG. That's a ricer!

Baking Soda!?!?! Gotta try that. Sounds good.

If I'm not mistaken, this car was for sale a month or two ago. Remember that discussion? It started at $30 something, was reduced during the auction, and didn't meet the reserve. We had a long conversation about the "factory" restoration program and how it wasn't really the factory that restored the cars, the odometers being reset to 0 miles, this car having 51,000 miles on it with the comments about who would put that many miles one of these examples. Yep! here it is. http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10532&highlight=factory+restoration+program Ha! same car!

Sand blasting removes metal just as it does rust, paint, bondo and any other material. Different media is used for different applications. Walnut shell (soft media) is used for softer materials such as plastics and aluminum while glass bead is used for harder materials. "Play sand" is outright dangerous to breath. Sand blasting will leave sand everywhere and is difficult to clean out of a car body. It will warp metal as well as pit the surface. I have read that sand blasting will actually force ferrous ions further into the metal. I think sand blasting is appropriate for certain applications as long as it is done within a controlled environment like a sand blasting cabinet. I have seen it used successfully in spot areas, but never on a complete car.

Mike, I wonder if I should start a new thread and I'll leave that up to your discreation, but to build on what Enrique has just contributed... There certainly are a lot of variations to the theme! Take a look at www.volocars.com. Click on the news and events tab and then select the Shelby Mustang announcement. The Volo Museum is displaying a 1967 Shelby Cobra GT 500 convertible and it is a prototype car - not a production car. As Ford ordered all of the prototype Shelbys destroyed, this is the only surviving prototype. The story appears in Old Cars Weekly News and says that the car was recovered by Ford in 1968 after being reported stolen, refitted with 1968 parts and sold as a used Shelby. Through intense research (four years), the car has been restored to it's "original state". Carroll has authenticated it and you can be certain that the documentation and actual restoration was done by professionals. So here is a $1 million used car involving the terms "rare", "all original", "as original", "like original", "restored original", and "original state". I would imagine the car has been completely disassembled and that very little of the 1967 rubber parts, vinyl parts, and paint remain. However, professional restoration to this degree would dictate authentic materials and manufacturing techniques. With a ton of research and documentation to back it up! Comments?

Good suggestion to blow out wax build-up around the emblems and down the inside of the rain rail with air! Any car this old could use a good blow. Try a long vacumn tip with bristles on the end for hard to reach areas in the engine bay. Vacumn and scrub out all along the fuel and brake lines on the frame rail. Get the sand and dust out! Preservative on the engine hoses and wires. Preservative on the wiring harness. If you loosen the wiring harness from the metal tabs, be sure to get the plastic ends wrapped around the harness again - no metal contact. The rubber grommets that hold the brake, clutch, and fuel tubes could use some preservative too.

I just may be able to help you out. Send me a PM w/ your e-mail and we'll discuss.

The "U Coat It" and the Rustolium are both 2 part, water based epoxies, probably equitable.

This is a great site of car care products http://www.carcareonline.com/ They have products for sale as well as technical articles on cleaning techniques and products. Armor-All contains silicon oils which is an inexpensive short term ingredient that will do more damage in the long run and should be avoided. I prefer the One Grand products.

The author of this thread had no intention of getting into a discussion about who said what or sold to whom or anything at all about an eBay deal gone foul. The author of this thread wanted to discuss fine points of originality and technical aspects of what is considered amongst the most educated of American Zcar clubs as legitimate restoration proceedure and preservation. THERE ARE PLENTY OF ALL ORIGINAL COLLECTOR CARS OUT THERE. Original paint. Original tires. Original spark plugs. Original batteries. Original everything. I know of a Z that still has the plastic protective interior wrapping that was supposed to be removed by the dealer prior to sale. The author of this thread was completely surprised to discover that far too many don't know what "all original" means much less how something is restored. The author of this thread is completely embarrassed by what has happend to this thread and wishes it would simply go away. Evidently, you guys don't wish to talk about specific finishes or preservative treatments or restoration techniques or anything that would resemble a intellectual conversation about collecting and maintaining fine automobiles. Evidently you simply don't know and wouldn't recognize, much less appreciate, an original car or what is involved to maintain or restore a car to an original state. The author of this thread was hoping some people who actually judge cars in shows would comment on aspects of "over restoration" or the value of a certain "patina" to older cars. For instance, does anyone know what the yellow paint on undercarriage bolts is for, their proper location, or why some are painted red? Does anyone care? If the author of this thread goes through all the trouble to duplicate the finish of certain components, does he then have his car viewed equally to someone who had powdercoated over POR? Can any one of you tell the difference? Thanks for allowing the author to get up and rant. PLEASE get off the eBay issue and let it settle. This site has members with some serious intelligent knowledge and experience to share. Perhaps this is a totally boring topic. So be it. Thank you. All my love. And happy President's day.

Gary, Nissan doesn't list 90301-E4101 any more. E8800 replaces it which I believe is the horizontal lined glass. The Nissan price I have is $247 for the E8800 making E4101 that much more valuable. I have seen used pieces go for much less on eBay, but keep in mind the piece I have is brand new.

I'm holding on to the defroster glass as a trade token. It's brand new NOS Nissan. A '72 piece of glass should be fairly common, bimini_blue.

You most definitely need a good camera to photograph models, but your pictures are pretty good, 2ManyZs. Controlling the flash lighting is quite difficult and spot lamps would seem better to light the car. Try using the telephoto zoom feature. The depth of field is way reduced, but you don't have to get in so close. I just bought this kit from Tamiya - 1/24th - Nissan R90V Group C, which should look like this some day.

Two laps in a cobra! Just great. Road America is such a great track. Lots of fond memories there!