Mike B

It looks like this seller is a used car dealer and he bought it on ebay last August. Here are some pictures from that listing. It was painted blue then, but I think the original color was white, since you can see white under the blue in some of the pictures. -Mike

To be correct it is HLS30-00383 and it is located in Ozone Park, NY. The seller looks familar (carcomusa). I think he may have bought that car on ebay a last year. Here is the link. The only option is a BIN of $9950. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Datsun-Z-Series-240z-1969-240z-production-number-383-COLLECTORS-VERY-RARE_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ6187QQihZ013QQitemZ230256924358QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW -Mike

Disclaimer: This information applies to North American 240Z models (HLS30U and HLS30UA) only We have noted that there were several variations in original 240Z carpet over the years. I thought I would try to compile a summary of the different carpet variations by date range in order to help people that are attempting to obtain accurate reproductions for their specific vehicles. The following is my best guess so far based on carpets I own, and what others have reported in this thread. The date ranges or other details may need to be adjusted further, so please post with VIN or production date (and pictures if possible) if you have any original carpet that doesn't fit this profile. Type 1: 10/69 – Approx 2/70 (VIN #1800?) – Made by Chester & Herod Rear deck: Loop pile w/ clear backing, unbound front edge (goes under plastic riser trim), slits for cargo straps not bound Behind seats: Loop pile w/ clear backing, cut to shape of plastic mats plus entire area under the seats Front Mats: Loop pile w/ clear backing, no slits at the bottom for metal tabs (uses Velcro instead) Type 2: Approx 3/70 – Approx 12/70 (Series 1) Rear deck: Cut pile w/ clear backing, unbound front edge (goes under plastic riser trim), slits for cargo straps not bound Behind seats: Cut pile w/ clear backing, cut similar to shape of plastic mats but not around seat mounts Front Mats: Cut pile w/ clear backing, bound slits at the bottom for metal tabs Type 3: Approx 01/71 – Approx 9/71 (Series 2) Rear deck: Cut pile w/ clear backing, large slit in front edge (which is fully bound) for tool bin access (carpet does not go under plastic riser trim), cargo straps mounted on top of carpet and either small holes or a small slit in carpet for mounting screws Behind seats: Cut pile w/ clear backing, slits cut and resewn to mold to rear wheel wheels Front Mats: Cut pile w/ clear backing, bound slits at the bottom for metal tabs Type 4: Approx 10/71 – 07/73 (Series 3 and 4) Rear deck: Loop pile w/ rough grey backing, large slit in front edge (which is fully bound) for tool bin access (carpet does not go under plastic riser trim), cargo straps mounted on top of carpet and either small holes or a small slit in carpet for mounting screws Behind seats: Loop pile w/ rough grey backing, slits cut and resewn to mold to rear wheel wheels, additional slit cut and resewn in middle of section under passenger seat Front Mats: Loop pile w/ rough grey backing and thin brown jute layer sewn on underside, bound slits at the bottom for metal tabs The part numbers for carpet according to the June 1974 USA & Canada Parts Catalog are listed below. Some of the dates seem to match up with what we have observed, but others do not. Part #74901-E4601 Assy-Trim Front Floor RH Black (Carpet) 10/69 to 08/71 Part #74901-E8800 Assy-Trim Rear Floor RH Black (Carpet) 09/71 to 06/72 Part #74901-N3300 Assy-Trim Rear Floor RH Black (Carpet) 07/72 to 01/73 Part #74901-E4600 Assy-Trim Rear Floor RH Black (Resin) 10/69 to ???? Part #74901-E8801 Assy-Trim Rear Floor RH Black (F/Rest Carpet) 11/71 to 06/72 Part #74901-E8802 Assy-Trim Rear Floor RH Black (F/Rest Resin) 01/72 to ???? Part #74901-N3302 Assy-Trim Rear Floor RH Black (F/Rest Carpet) 07/72 to ???? Part #74902-E4601 Assy-Trim Front Floor LH Black (Carpet) ???? to 08/71 Part #74902-E8800 Assy-Trim Rear Floor LH Black (Carpet) 09/71 to 06/72 Part #74902-N3300 Assy-Trim Rear Floor LH Black (Carpet) 07/72 to 01/73 Part #74902-N3304 Assy-Trim Rear Floor LH Black (Carpet) 02/73 to ???? Part #74902-E4600 Assy-Trim Rear Floor LH Black (Resin) ???? to 01/73 Part #74902-N3306 Assy-Trim Rear Floor LH Black (Resin) 02/73 to ???? Part #74907-E4600 Assy-Trim Rear Floor RH Black (Resin) ???? to 12/70 Part #74907-E8201 Assy-Trim Rear Floor RH Black (Resin) 01/71 to ???? Part #74907-E4601 Assy-Trim Rear Floor RH Black (Carpet) ???? to 12/70 Part #74907-E8300 Assy-Trim Rear Floor RH Black (Carpet) 01/71 to ???? Part #74907-E8800 Assy-Trim Rear Floor RH Black (Carpet) ???? to ???? Part #74907-E8802 Assy-Trim Rear Floor RH Black (Carpet) ???? to ???? Part #74907-N3300 Assy-Trim Rear Floor RH Black (Carpet) (CG-403) 07/72 to ???? Part #74908-E4600 Assy-Trim Rear Floor LH Black (Resin) ???? to 12/70 Part #74908-E8201 Assy-Trim Rear Floor LH Black (Resin) 01/71 to ???? Part #74908-E4601 Assy-Trim Rear Floor LH Black (Carpet) up to 12/70 Part #74908-E8300 Assy-Trim Rear Floor LH Black (Carpet) 01/71 to ???? Part #74908-E8800 Assy-Trim Rear Floor LH Black (Carpet) ???? to ???? Part #74908-N3300 Assy-Mat Rear Floor LH Black (Carpet) (CG-403) 07/72 to ???? Part #74950-E4100 Assy-Mat Rear Floor Black (Resin) ???? to 12/70 Part #74950-E8201 Assy-Mat Rear Floor Black (Resin) 01/71 to ???? Part #74950-E4600 Assy-Mat Rear Floor Black (Carpet) ???? to 12/70 Part #74950-E8300 Assy-Mat Rear Floor Black (Carpet) 01/71 to ???? Part #74950-E8800 Assy-Mat Rear Floor Black (Carpet) ???? to ???? Part #74950-N3300 Assy-Mat Rear Floor Black (Carpet) (CG-403) 07/72 to ???? -Mike

Several threads have briefly discussed rubber mats that originally came in some early North American 240Zs, but I thought it would be good to have a separate thread to discuss more of the details. As Alan (HS30-H) and others have noted, rubber mats came standard on some Japanese home market S30 models and may have been available as options on all of them (maybe Alan or Kats can clarify for us). I am attaching some pictures of the rubber mats from HLS30-00032 (a 10/69 production car). Here are some questions I have: 1. I have only seen rubber mats for the rear deck and the areas behind the seats. Did the cars also come with rubber mats for the front drivers and passenger floors? If so, does any one have any originals that they can post pictures of? By the way, I am NOT refering to the thick rubber AMCO mats available from the dealer. 2. Are the rubber mats in North Amercian cars the same as the ones that came with Japanese market models? 3. Approximately how many North American 240Zs came with rubber mats, or what is the latest production car that has been found to have them? 4. Did any other markets get cars with the rubber mats? 5. Is there any interest in having some reproduction rubber mats made? -Mike

Yes. Bobc contacted the seller and also posted about it here. http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30691

Alan, I do agree with you that the Z was designed for a global market. I viewed this thread as being soley related to the discussion of carpet in North American models, which is what my comments were based on. I do appreciate the global perspective that you and others on this site provide. However, I think you need to give those of us in the US a little leeway and realize that generally unless we are specifically citing cars outside of our market we are only referencing North American models. Maybe I need to include a disclaimer in any future posts regarding that. -Mike

Here are some pictures of the carpet installed in #32. -Mike

So I noticed where Jim (Zup) had asked if anyone had checked with Chester and Herod in post #87, and it seemed like no one had. I took a look at their site and came across this page http://autockm.com/testimonials.html. In the top right column it says 'One of Chamber's more exciting moments came in 1970 when he created replacement floor mats for Datsun's then-secret 240Z car. After making the mats, he was promptly asked to keep his mouth shut. 'Only five people in the country knew about (the 240Zs),' Chambers said.' I later noticed that in post #98 Bryan Pilati said "Okay I had a talk with Les. ...The first Z's imported came with rubber mats only, and Mr K had carpet kits made by Chester & Herod using the rubber mats as templates. ...." In post #104 Bryan also said "First off, the Z was not originally designed with carpets, they came with rubber mats. When the first ones arrived, Mr K had carpet made, and only later did the factory supply them." I contacted C&H and their story jives with what Bryan said. Just before the Z was introduced Nissan showed a completed car to some Datsun dealers on the West Coast and the car only had rubber mats. The dealers said the car would not sell like that in the US. Since one of the LA dealers had worked with C&H previously, Nissan contacted them and wound up having them make carpet sets using the rubber mats as templates. According to C&H's owner these were made of loop carpet and used in the first 1800 or so cars. I sent them some pictures of the rubber mats from #32 and they confirmed that those were the mats their templates were based on. I also confirmed that they would make the rear cutouts for the cargo straps on the hatch carpet, and for the accelerator and clutch pedal stops on the drivers mat. I asked about getting the loop with the clear rubber backing and they said it would be too thick for their edge binding machines (that didn't make sense to me given that the original carpet sets had bound edges and they had the clear rubber backing). Anyway, I thought it couldn't be too hard to find some kind of clear rubberized backing I could put on myself. I had them send me a set of carpet samples for the regular loop, pile, and wool loop and pile materials. The regular loop and pile materials seem similar to what everyone else uses and I was quoted $195 for a set (plus shipping of $26). The wool pile is very nice, but expensive (I was quoted $525 for a set plus shipping). The wool loop is some sort of a square weave and is not the right color (it is also $525 for a set plus shipping). C&H said that the carpets come with a padding that sounds like the same thread type stuff that others use and that they just glue it on after the carpet is made. C&H said they do not supply carpet to TIR and only supply Z carpet to CDM when a customer asks for wool or colored carpet, otherwise it sounds like Les uses some cheaper mass manufacturer. I ordered a set of the loop pile and told them to leave the additional padding off. My carpet set arrived last week, and to my surprise, it already had a rubber coating on the back. I called C&H and apparently they ordered a more expensive higher grade loop type because it came in a wider size. It came with the rubber backing and they realized they would be able to edge bind it after all. Even though the carpet material was quite a bit more expensive ($56 per yard vs $9 per yard for the cheap stuff), they gave me the price they quoted, but said that future orders of that carpet would be about $265 per set plus shipping. The carpet has the cutouts as promised and the rear carpets are correct for a 1969/early 1970 (based on the rubber mats). The carpet has snaps already installed on the floor mats and came with two sets of the snap based to install in the car if needed. They had also cut slits in the top of the hatch carpet for the cargo straps by cutting straight down from the top a couple of inches and then making small 90 degree cuts on either side. We hadn't discussed that, and I wasn't really thrilled that they cut through the edge binding to do that, but it looked like it laid flat and wouldn't be noticeable when installed. Overall, the carpet looked great, but I had to wait until last weekend to install it. When I did, I noticed it was a little longer in some places then I was expecting and that caused a few fitment issues I had to correct. On early cars, the top of the hatch carpet goes under the plastic edge on the top of the rear shelf. Even after folding the carpet up the rear shelf lip it was about 1/2' too long, so I cut that much off, since it is hidden by the plastic edge guard anyway. The front mats are a little longer than the other ones I have, but they fit fine. The rear carpets were a little long in some areas of the seat support cutouts, and they would work ok, since that area is not visible, but they didn't lay as flat as I would like. I discussed with C&H and they said if I trimmed them up and sent them back they would rebind the edges, so I did that this week. I am also buying a second set of these carpets, and they will use the trimmed set as templates for the second set and ship them all back together. I also told them not to make the slits in the hatch carpet this time. I asked about making and binding slits in the front mats and they said that they couldn't do that because it was too difficult for their machines. I didn't need that for my 1969 cars, since they used velcro in the back of the front mats because the cars don't have the metal clip that later cars do. Given my experience with the rear hatch slits they may make the front mat slits the same way, so anyone ordering later carpets with slits may just want to confirm that prior to ordering or just cut them yourself. I also asked about the rear carpets and tried to verbally confirm that the carpets for 1971 and later cars use a different template and have a slit that is then sewn together to fit the wheel well curve. It sounds like that is the case, but someone else interested in that style should confirm it by sending them a picture or something. It sounds like they are also open to making carpet sets based on paper templates, so you may be able to trace a template for your car and ask them to use that. It sounds like they are already a very busy place. It normally takes them 5-9 working days to complete a set, as long as they have the material in stock. I am attaching several pictures I took last weekend. I'll post some more pics when I get the new and rebound set back from C&H next week if anyone is interested. -Mike

Thanks for the clarification Carl. Interesting that Nissan referred to the then current Z32 as the "Classic Z's". Do you know if any of them were sold and badged as Classic Z's? If so, how many, and do they have any additional value? Also the press release above says "followed by pre-owned Z-cars from the Z's 26-year history including early model Z-cars beginning with the 240Z (Vintage Z)." Did Nissan ever really take any steps towards remanufacturing any later Z's or was that just a marketing ploy? -Mike

Carl, Were cars other than 240z's repurchased, remanufactured, and resold? What do you mean by "later model" used Z cars? -Mike

Hi Chris, So is there a book on this subject you have completed and is available for sale? If so, where do we get it? Also, I don't have the VIN #, but has the VZ I posted about from the 2001 Kruse auction been accounted for? I know it was a long time ago, but did you or anyone document the results of its subsequent sale on eBay? -Mike

In 2001 I lived in San Antonio and there was a red VZ that came up for auction at a Kruse auction in the area (not Bob's I don't think). I had been away from Z's for a few years and was interested in possibly getting a deal on that one. I didn't realize only 38 VZ cars had been made at the time. Something came up and I couldn't go make it to the auction. It wound up selling for $12,750. http://www.kruse.com/results/detail.asp?CONSIGN=434&MAKE=DATSUN&AUC_CODE=NEWBRAS01&AUC_BREAD=San%20Antonio%2C%20TX%202001&SEARCH_NAME=DATSUN&YEAR=2001&RESULTS=1&PAGE=1 The buyer listed it on ebay within a week after he bought it. I'm not sure what it sold it for, but I think he made a pretty good return for owning it a week or two. Here is the only picture from the Kruse auction results page, in case that ever goes away. -Mike

Thanks Kats. I don't know that mine is the best example of a blue 69, but it has survived mostly intact and it is one of the earliest blue cars (maybe the second surviving one according to Zhome.com). I understand that Charlie Osborne has a very pristine blue #126. I have only seen the one picture of it on his Zedd Findings website, but I would like to see more pictures of his car. It does have about 79,000 miles on it, so it not immaculate like your cars, but I will work on it. The person I bought #32 from was the second owner and had it for 30 years. Most of that time it was in storage. He wasn't into Datsuns or Z's, but it was his first car and he knew that it was special because it was a very low VIN, and so he kept it as stock as possible. He tried to keep any parts that were removed from the car. For instance, he took it to PierreZ a couple of years ago for a tune up and some other minor maintenance and they replaced his round choke knob with a new square one for some reason. He drove back and made them find the original knob and give it back to him. I'm working on posting some more pictures of #32. The weather is supposed to finally warm up a little here in Seattle this weekend, so I am hoping to drive it a little and take some more pictures. -Mike

They were welded to the underside of the cowl area at the factory. The brackets on low VIN cars are different than the bracket on later 1970's. See my post #28 in this thread for pictures of the differences. http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29554&highlight=hand+throttle I had a 3/71 parts car that didn't have a bracket, so I think they were eliminated in the US when they went to series 2 production. -Mike

I think that one belongs to a member here. Looks like a really nice car. -Mike

Will, I don't plan to use it as some type of cruise control while driving, just to warm up the car on the all too often cold Seattle days we have up here. I don't think it would work as a cruise control anyway. It only moves my gas pedal about 1/2" right now. Not enough to even affect the RPMs yet. I think I need to adjust the pedal so there is not as much play in it first. Even after adjusted it would probably only be enough acceleration to barely keep the car moving in first gear (if someone were stupid enough to even try that), otherwise I think it would just stall out. This version of the throttle is shown in the US & Canada parts catalog and only has a range of half that of the choke. It is different than the one in the right hand drive cars, which has the full range of the choke switch (I also have a used one of those that I got from Australia). -Mike

I bought a NOS hand throttle recently and went to install it in #32 this weekend. I noticed that there was still an original plastic grommet in the accerator pedal mounting point and there was still a screw in the cable bracket. I have read that some of the early cars came to the US with hand throttles, but they were removed either at the port or by the dealer. I guess it was just easier to cut the throttle cable and leave the grommet and screw behind when they removed it. Anyway, I think it is nice that is it restored to the way I believe it left the factory now. -Mike

No problem Arne. I actually prefer the look of the black stripe on the red cars myself. The black stripe on my red car is the original put on by the dealer. I was kind of surprised that since my interior is white that they didn't use a white stripe. I won't be adding stripes to either my silver or blue cars. I think they look better without them, and since they are both low vin cars, they are probably not correct for them anyway. I wonder when the stripes were first available. I have a 1972 accessory brochure that shows them as a dealer added option, but I haven't seen a similar brochure for 1970 or 71. -Mike

Yeah, it has been discussed in two other threads today. http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30439 (See post #4. It had a similar effect on Oiluj) http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30441 -Mike

Good thing you left before the MIB took out that little flashy thing, otherwise you woudn't remember any of this. LOLLOLLOL

Let's see if you guys like this 2006 article about Mr K (from the same Hemmings magazine) any better. http://www.hemmings.com/hsx/stories/2006/01/01/hmn_feature17.html -Mike

I was cleaning up underneath my 72 today and took a few pictures as I went. Just as Carl said, semi-gloss black with lots of engine block blue overspray. -Mike

Here's an article from the new Hemmings Sport and Exotic Car magazine about Nissan's 50th Anniversary in the US that a friend sent me today. -Mike DatsunArticleHemmings.pdf

I recently bought #32 and it has this yellow writting on the transmission case. It is a very original car with only 2 owners and 79,000 miles, so I would think this was put on at the factory. Also, I think my 1972 has a yellow paint mark on the cover instead of the red one that Arne and others described. -Mike